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Todays "Obvious" Training Reminder:

Discussion in 'Weight Training/Bulking' started by SwoleCat, Nov 1, 2004.

  1. SwoleCat

    SwoleCat Well-Known Member

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    I see a plethora of training questions, as well as receive pm's inquiring about overall body size "how do I get my arms bigger, how do I make my biceps grow?", etc.

    For MASS (and for bigger arms! I'll use biceps as the small bodypart example. Again, this outlook may already be adopted by some of you, so it's not "groundbreaking" news, no, but I did attempt to write it in a manner that relays the truth behind what I've found to be true mass/growth. You know, when YOU as a person become bigger, your entire frame, not just one bodypart. We're talking total stature change.)

    Focus on HEAVY COMPOUND movements in the appropriate rep ranges for mass/strength. (Usually 6-8 for upper body, 12-15 for lower) Deads can be of both ranges. Make THESE movements the focus of your workout routines. Sounds painful, sounds "boring" because you can't look all pretty in the mirror doing concentration curls, but save that pretty sh*t for Friday nights.

    Leave the "fancy-schmancy" concentration curls, tricep kickbacks, leg extensions, etc., for later on during your cut down phase before pictures or a show. Utilize only a few sets of these "assistor" muscles, and torch them then leave them alone. Do not do 12 sets of biceps to try to get 20 inch arms, eat correctly, DEAD/SQUAT/ROW/BENCH your (__!__) off, and you need only hit the biceps with 5-6 all out sets per WEEK! Not any pansy movements either.........3 sets of HAMMERS curls done straight up and down by your sides, and 3 sets of STRAIGHT BAR curls, no cheating check your ego @ the door, going all the way down to the bottom and concentrating on hitting the bicep from the bottom of the movement, all the way to the top. Swinging the weight up does nothing to build muscle, as momentum doesn't stimulate muscle fiber. 2 warm-up sets should be done before the first bicep all-out set, but don't wear yourself out before the real work begins.

    Two things here. You must really TORCH your biceps in these 6 sets. Those who can do 12-15 sets of biceps are not utilizing this TORCHING technique. Find the true failure weight for the exercises, and use a 3 second lowering, 2 second contraction WITH a nice static hold/squeeze at the top (peak) of the movement. If you are not sore from this at least a bit, u are not doing it correctly.

    This is more than enough of a "message" to get those arms to grow, as they have been directly blasted to all h*ll w/out over-training, and they also are receiving the same powerful growth signals as the back/chest/legs are from doing those heavy compound movements that stimulate GH and hormone production. That is how you grow. Big bodyparts stimulate these hormones, and big bodyparts teach smaller bodyparts how to get bigger. Not only will small bodyparts not grow significantly when trained by themselves, they d*mn sure ain't gonna make your LEGS grow! So, why these movements/bodyparts would be the focus of a routine for STRAIGHT HARDCORE MASS, I've no idea.

    I could go on and on, but alas, I've cardio to do.

    Peace all,
    ~SC~
     
  2. Skoorb

    Skoorb Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for this. I'm starting to think that my weight training program has sucked for a very long time, and I may go on a stint for a while relying almost entirely on the compounds.
     
  3. Kino

    Kino Well-Known Member

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    HUH? :confused:
     
  4. French Spirit

    French Spirit Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for writing that. What you described is what I've been doing, for the most part.
     
  5. SwoleCat

    SwoleCat Well-Known Member

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    Each bodypart once per week as far as frequency.

    NEVER do deads/bench/rows/squats in one day. You won't release any hormones, you'll catabolize yourself into a peach pit.

    Those big movements are all done on diff. days w/diff. accompanying smaller bodyparts. (Rows/deads can be put together on the same day)

    ~SC~

     
  6. Hort

    Hort Well-Known Member

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    Amen brother.

    Since I swtiched to a compound-focused workout, my gains have lept ahead,
     
  7. 1FastGTX

    1FastGTX Elite Member
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    Great post Swolecat!!!

    I prefer stretching after the workout. Sometimes I'll stretch in between sets, but hardly ever before the workout. I am very good about warmup sets, and I do about 10 minutes of very moderate treadmill running or bike riding before the workout, but I really don't ever stretch individual muscles before my workout.

    A long time ago I read (in Manfred Hoeberl's book lol) that stretching after a workout dramatically helps muscle growth, but I am not sure how accurate this is.
     
  8. 1FastGTX

    1FastGTX Elite Member
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    SC - what about performing Stiff-Legged Deads on the same day that you perform Squats?

    Currently my leg routine is very basic -- Squats, Leg Press, and Stiff-Legged Deadlifts (I do not do calves on my quad/ham day). I only do a total of 7 sets on this day (3 squats, 2 leg presses, 2 s.l. deadlifts). I used to try to stick lying leg curls in there (2 sets) as well, but after the deads I am so wiped and I just feel "finished" if that makes any sense.

    Just curious what you thought about this... Again great post, thanks.
     
  9. SwoleCat

    SwoleCat Well-Known Member

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    Yes, stiff-legged deads are for the hamstring area more-so than anything.

    Traditional deadlifts are usually of the bent-knee variety, and do hit the hams of course, but the focus is the lower back and overall power.

    I have stiffs on leg day, regulars on back day.

    ~SC~
     
  10. PeteBDawg

    PeteBDawg Well-Known Member

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    I've been doing my squats and deadlifts on the same day. Apparently, this must change. I'm going to ask a bunch of questions to clarify what is fairly obvious already, please forgive me.

    With these four large compound exercises, are you talking about a three day split, or an even finer one? Is it squats one day, deads/rows another day, and bench a third day?

    Do you consider pull-ups/chins/weighted variations thereof to be in the same class as these "compound" four? Could that take the place of rows?

    When you say "rows," are all kinds of "rows" interchangeable, or is there a particular kind of "row" you're talking about (standing barbell row, bent-over barbell row, seated cable row, etc.)?

    If you shouldn't be doing isolation leg exercises and you move your deadlifts off of "squat day," what other exercises should you be doing on the day you do squats? I can see that triceps and shoulders naturally pair with bench, and biceps, lats, and forearms naturally go with rows; what naturally goes with squats? Just stiff-legged deadlifts?

    Basically, If I move my deads from "squat" day to "row" day (when I generally do biceps), I find my routine unbalanced. What's my major malfunction?

    Sorry for being ignorant, just trying to learn.
     
  11. SwoleCat

    SwoleCat Well-Known Member

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    IN CAPS :cool:

    ALL GOOD, GOTTA RUN!
    :tu:

    ~SC~
     
  12. Skoorb

    Skoorb Well-Known Member

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    I had similar questions to Petedawg. Cool :D

    While I'm at it, do you advise to always go to failure on the "work" sets? Ie, do a few warm up perhaps, but then go balls out to failure on each set thereafter? If that is the case, presumably you'd end up having to lower the weight set after set, to stay in the same ballpark, right?

    I've heard from a great many people who don't fail on most of their sets, and kind of work up to it, though I know that Max OT doesn't prescribe that (though it's not the only plan in existence, obviously!).

    How many compound sets would you do?

    Thanks :D
     
    #12 Skoorb, Nov 1, 2004
    Last edited: Nov 1, 2004
  13. bni

    bni Well-Known Member

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    I have felt the

    back/bi/trap
    chest/tri/shoulders
    legs


    seems to work pretty good for me. keeping compound exercises through the week. my biceps were super pumped today and that was without going near a curl...just from back. It has been like this but I think after reading this I felt it more lol. usually by thursday though i wanna do back and bi/traps again but i just do abs and cardio.
    I guess I should try and do more then 6-8 reps for squats though!
    I cant seem to do the weight that I hear other people do. I duno if it is mental or form or me being a pussy. Its been bout a month since i started squats and i think I may still be gettin comfortable.
     
  14. 1FastGTX

    1FastGTX Elite Member
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    I'm go happy to hear you say this. I do everything except squats in a "heavy weight low reps" style (well, around 5-7 reps). On squats I still go fairly heavy (for me), but not as heavy as I could, and I generally shoot for higher reps than with other exercises.

    But I was just probably doing this cause I was scared!!!! I squat by myself, no power rack or cage either. :)
     
  15. steven

    steven Well-Known Member

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    hi

    what would be the best exercises for triceps and shoulders? i cant do dips or pull ups (if by pullups you mean chinups). right now i am doing
    french press, tricep cable extension, tricep cable pushdown and closegrip bench ( i think thats what its called)
    then for shoulders i do vert press, cable flys, cable front and side raises and cable pullup (where u pull up the bar to your chin, not sure if its called pullups)

    thnx!
     
  16. The Dynasty

    The Dynasty Well-Known Member

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    I have a question pertaining to these compound movements. I've actually noticed that the right side of my body is stronger (and in some cases shows up a little more muscular) than my *EDIT--LEFT* side. I still want to incorporate compound movements in my workout, ya know, because I know how they hit a ton of other body parts. What can I do in order to incorporate compound movements yet still make sure i'm not getting stronger on one side. Here's what my workout week looks like (incorporating some of SwoleCat's ideas):

    ***Note***I always increase weight as I move on to the next set
    M:Back and Bis
    BB Bent Deads: 12 (warmup), 8, 8, 8/6 (depending how heavy)
    Pulldowns: 8, 8, 8/6
    Seated Row (on a machine where I load plates on each side): 8, 8, 8
    DB Shurgs: 3 x 10

    RE: Bis, I need guidance for exercises

    T:Chest, Tris, and Abs
    DB Flat Bench: 12 (wu), 8, 8, 8/6
    DB Incline Bench: 8, 8, 8/6
    DB Flies: 3 x 10

    RE: Tris, I also need some guidance

    W:Off

    Th:Legs
    BB 1/2 to 3/4 Squats: 12 (wu), 3 x 10
    BB Stiff-Legged Deads: 3 x 8
    DB Lunges: 3 x 8
    *Edit*I forgot Standing/Sitting Calf Raises (alternate weekly): 3 x 10

    F:Shoulders
    DB Military Press: 12 (wu), 8, 8, 8/6
    DB Arnolds: 2 x 8
    DB Lateral Raises: 3 x 8
    DB Bent-Over Lateral Raises: 3 x 8

    Please give me some advice. Thanks.
     
    #16 The Dynasty, Nov 2, 2004
    Last edited: Nov 2, 2004
  17. PhilipDC78

    PhilipDC78 Well-Known Member

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    Which is it?
     
  18. Skoorb

    Skoorb Well-Known Member

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    Dynasty: I have the same problem.

    What I've been doing for years, and it's not corrected the problem, is to just make sure that I don't go harder on one side than the other. Frankly I have no damned idea why my right bicep is still significantly bigger than my left. I've NEVER done more on it than my left; if my left is on its last rep I don't do another for the right. I've even spent the last 18 months doing a lot more sets for my left (actually just half as many for the right). BTW I don't do much with my right arm (although I am right-handed, and no self-satisfaction jokes, please!).

    Anyway, all I could offer is that if you're stronger on your right side, use your left as an indicator of when it's time to end the set. If you feel like your left is about to fail, then that's the end of your set.

    I almost wonder if compound movements (pullup being my favourite back excercise) are responsible for most of my bicep growth, and that's why my left side is still smaller, since I can't seem to bridge the gap at all.
     
  19. The Dynasty

    The Dynasty Well-Known Member

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    My bad, man, hahahahaha. My right is stronger than my left--I just edited my post :o
     
  20. funsocaltiger

    funsocaltiger Well-Known Member

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    I disagree. By HST philosophy and the fullbody workout school of thought in general there isnt any real advantage to doing a bunch of sets per body part 1 day a week than spreading them out and doing 1-2 sets per body part for all body parts each workout.

    Additionally, according HST, that much rest per body part between exercises would in itself result in catabolism.

    The redistribution of frequency and volume of exercises throughout the week still results in the same total volume of exercise that week and same volume of exercise per day.
     

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