Cardio on an empty stomach?!?! It's driving me nuts...

karatetricker · Tue, February 10th, 2004, 03:49 PM

So there has been much debate lately whether to do cardio on an empty stomach or not in the morning. Well after having been told both is correct, I have been trying to research it on Google. Let's just say, every other article I read suggests the OPPOSITE!! Half seem to say do it after having a small meal an hour prior, others say don't eat anything until an hour after.

Can anyone find an actual study that test participants body fat %, lean mass, etc where one group ate prior and one didn't? A

According to the sources that recommend eating, you are just wasting muscle by not. But according to the ones recommending not eating, you are just cardoing off what you ate and not burning nearly as much fat as you could be since you have now restored carbs, glycogen and insulin levels have been raised.

WHAT TO DO?!?!?!

HunkOLove · Tue, February 10th, 2004, 03:56 PM

And it didn't seem to make much of a difference for me personally. So I have one small banana and a large glass of water about 20 minutes before I cardio. I'm still losing weight. Maybe I would lose another quarter pound a week if I didn't eat the banana before but hey I'm not complaining.

Jingo · Tue, February 10th, 2004, 03:57 PM

you'll probably find any bodybuild/lifting type people will say eat before and straight away after, where as any fatloss/weightloss will say don't eat before or for an hour after to maximise your fat burning potential.

Both are right of cause, it's basicly a personal question of priorities. From what i can make out, if you don't eat before or after cardio, you will increase the potential for your body to consume muscle, but it's as well as fat, not instead of, so you lose more fat at the cost of some muscle. If you're working out that loss might be acceptable to you given the extra fat burning you're getting.
If you're okish with your fat levels and happy to bering it down gradually, you should probably concentrate more on your muscles and give them priority, so conserving them should be your main worry.

Like most things you'll get 2 people come here and tell you why they're right and back what they say up with a lot of good info, at the end of the day it's a personal decision based on your own goals.

d_samuylin · Tue, February 10th, 2004, 04:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jingo

Like most things you'll get 2 people come here and tell you why they're right and back what they say up with a lot of good info, at the end of the day it's a personal decision based on your own goals.

Absolutely true Jingo. I am with you 100% on it.

***John Stone*** · Tue, February 10th, 2004, 04:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by d_samuylin

Absolutely true Jingo. I am with you 100% on it.

Another bump to what Jingo said. Try it both ways, see what works best for you. Don't stress.

karatetricker · Tue, February 10th, 2004, 05:16 PM

Well, it's just that I can't seem to break this plateau I've hit and I want to know exactly what works best for everything so I can lose the last couple % of body fat. I'm like right there, (digital calipers should be here any day now), probably around 12-14% body fat, and I want to break the 10% mark. I just don't want my time being "wasted" when it could be used more efficiently in helping me reach my goal.

I agree with you Jingo though, very good point. I guess for now I'm willing to sacrifice some muscle if it means losing the extra fat.

NME · Tue, February 10th, 2004, 05:25 PM

A lot depends on your body type. If you have trouble putting on mass, common sense would suggest that you'd want to avoid cardio that promotes catabolism. Conversely, if you find it difficult to lose weight, you can likley afford the relatively small loss in muscle mass that can result from fasted state cardio.

From personal experience, fasted state and non-fasted state cardio (when done at the same level of intensity) yield very similar results. I was fortunate enough to not suffer any noticable loss in strength/muscle mass while doing fasted state cardio for 8 weeks, four days a week. I currently do non-fasted state cardio 7 days a week (mid-range four days a week on lifting days, HIIT on non-lifting days); I have had strength gains in all of my lifts since starting my current regimen 5 weeks ago.

Try what you think you'll prefer or what you feel will work best for you. If the results are less than your expectations, switch to the other method. Just make sure that you give each method enough time to prove it's effectiveness (or lack thereof).

karatetricker · Tue, February 10th, 2004, 06:33 PM

I agree with you Famous about experimenting with both. Unfortunately with the warm weather rapidly approaching, I don't have too much time to play with as far as losing the last bit of fat.

I guess I will continue without eating for now since I don't mind the muscle loss right now. I put on muscle pretty easily so whatever I lose I will make up for once the fat's gone.

SLUDGE · Tue, February 10th, 2004, 06:35 PM

Back when I was losing weight like crazy, I used to run first thing in the morning after some water. I could go for awhile doing this, but I found giving myself a kickstart by eating a banana or having a SMALL yogurt would allow me to really get going. Doing the math, I would burn the banana off in ten minutes, and then haul ass for another fifty or so.

Your mileage may vary, but for me, it's definitely a situation where the bit of a jumpstart gets you to a level you wouldn't be at otherwise for the remainder of the workout period.

Quote:

Originally Posted by karatetricker

So there has been much debate lately whether to do cardio on an empty stomach or not in the morning. Well after having been told both is correct, I have been trying to research it on Google. Let's just say, every other article I read suggests the OPPOSITE!! Half seem to say do it after having a small meal an hour prior, others say don't eat anything until an hour after.
WHAT TO DO?!?!?!

karatetricker · Tue, February 10th, 2004, 06:44 PM

I actually do fine in the morning without eating, physically. I don't think my workouts could get much more intense, food or not. (Cardio that is, I'd never lift on an empty stomach)

peter · Wed, February 11th, 2004, 04:17 AM

I had the exact same question. But then I found this article, which sort of answers all my questions:

http://www.fitren.com/res3art.cfm?compid=18&artid=71

brid · Wed, February 11th, 2004, 07:05 AM

Cardio on an empty stomach is a must if your trying to get in shape quickly .... if your an endomorph, more so.

The debate on whether or not to do it without eating first is usually backed up by the reasoning that its far too catabolic and you'll end up burning your muscles up. Bottom line is that if you do your cardio for 20 minutes HIIT then wait and hour and take a gram of vitamin C along with some food, your giving your body the best of both worlds - but at the end of the day, early in the morning when you wake up will get you the results you need.

Having said that, yes if you DONT keep a close eye on your diet and supplements for the rest of the day then you risk losing muscle at a greater rate... Obviously 200g+ of protein a day is in order (for men) as well as creatine, plenty of vitamin c and all the other good stuff. The best way to get a head start on protecting your muscles is to have a protein shake with water as your first meal of the day (i have mine mixed with flax) and then eat your first regular meal 20-30 minutes afterwards. That was you have a flood of amino's in the bloodstream arguably much quicker than eating some foods.

Also bear in mind that as soon as you give the body carbs, you've brought lipolysis to its slowest rate (fat burning)...

Hope that helps.

Paul J · Wed, February 11th, 2004, 08:53 AM

Goal:

strictly wieght loss: do cardio on an empty stomach if you like

fat loss with preservation of muscle mass (as much as possible): dont do cardio on an empty stomach as it seems to catabolize muscle mass.

d_samuylin · Wed, February 11th, 2004, 08:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by brid

The best way to get a head start on protecting your muscles is to have a protein shake with water as your first meal of the day (i have mine mixed with flax) and then eat your first regular meal 20-30 minutes afterwards. That was you have a flood of amino's in the bloodstream arguably much quicker than eating some foods.
Hope that helps.

I agree, but change the meals a bit. After doing cardio on empty stomach, load up with a little bit of simple and lots of comlex carbs: Oatmeal is the best choice. And an hour after this meal drink a protein shake. The reason is that your sugar level in your blood is very low. YOu need to bring it up a little to increase metabolism. Once that is done low GI food for the rest of the day are the best choices.

brid · Thu, February 12th, 2004, 10:50 AM

Might be noteworthy but ive yet to see pictures of anyone who is against morning cardio on an empty stomach

The ones who do DO it are the ones i see the most "transformation" pictures from.

d_samuylin · Thu, February 12th, 2004, 10:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by brid

Might be noteworthy but ive yet to see pictures of anyone who is against morning cardio on an empty stomach

The ones who do DO it are the ones i see the most "transformation" pictures from.

Good point Brid. But still, I would suggest experimenting and finding what works best for each indivudual.

harry.michaels · Thu, February 12th, 2004, 05:33 PM

I have always found pre-breakfast cardio is a lot more effective. The only muscle loss I have experienced is through poor nutrition.

For example, I started cutting in spring 2002 at 221 lbs. By winter 2002 I was 163 lbs or so. My arms were 15 1/4" pre-cutting - post-cutting they were 14 1/2" - this is after pre-breakfast cardio (usually 45 minutes or so) at least 4 days per week for at least four months. My judgement tells me that 3/4" was flab.

Then my drive kind of fizzled out in spring 2003 and I stopped eating healthily. By autumn 2003 my arms were down to 14" (I have pushed them back to 14 1/2").

If you want faster results - do your cardio on an empty stomach. Just don't skimp on the protein afterwards and you won't lose your hard earned muscle.