Magnesium potentially very useful to bodybuilding

[njprime]

Hello gents,

Apologies for this being so long.

I am not a frequent poster, but I have posted a few times before, you can feel free to see that I've posted a transformation thread a few months back, and I'm not just spamming something here.

I have been lifting and eating well for over a year now, and found that I have had a problem putting on muscle (though fat doesn't seem so hard!), even with extremely heavy exercise.

I also lead a generally very stressful life, I've had panic attacks more than once.

Anyway ... down to the point of the post. I had a brief encounter with a retired russian bodybuilder who had asked me if I took Magnesium as a supplement, I replied yes. I have been taking NSI's Calcium + Magnesium Oxide + Vitamin D pills for about as long as since I started, and recently started taking ETS which also has Magnesium in it, but that I was aware that humans were generally pretty bad at absorbing Magnesium orally, and that besides that, magnesium is generally depleted in all farming soils (mainly because it is not added with the manufactured fertilizers as the plants do not require it - even though you do!), so it is almost never in natural foods anymore, and requires supplementation to maintain normal levels. I had said that I occasionally take Epsom Salt (Magnesium Sulfate) baths, and had found them to generally work as advertised - it soothes muscle pain somewhat and allows me to relax.

He starts telling me that while I've got more of an understanding of Magnesium than most, I'm still missing some more information. Magnesium Sulfate is one of the lowest quality grades of Magnesium, and is poorly absorbed -- it is in fact used as a laxative (if swallowed) because of how low it's quality is. Magnesium Oxide also is generally not a great form of Magnesium, though Magnesium Citrate is "ok". He goes on to tell me that the best absorbed form of Magnesium is Magnesium Chloride - the kind that's in the ocean, and also that it's best absorbed through the skin, and that it has made a huge impact in his carreer as a bodybuilder. He is clearly retired and no longer lifts, and has gained some weight around his midsection, but he lifts his pants up to show his leg muscles - insanely huge. He tells me that using Magnesium Chloride will speed up muscle gain enormously. I take this with a grain of salt, and give it a try, and found a few interesting things. In this time, I also completely stopped taking the Magnesium Oxide pills from NSI. I still take ETS sometimes around exercise time for the "Microlactin", but I have certainly greatly reduced the intake from there as well.

1) For me, I had been going through a very stressful time for the last couple of months and found it difficult to work, and was in a very deep state of depression -- Within the first two days, the depression totally cleared, and I was less stressed out than I had been in years, even though things are clearly more stressful now than they have ever been in my life. I wasn't expecting or hoping for this result, but it did occur. I am now dealing with clearing up stressful issues more rapidly now than I have in many years.

2) My appetite started to rapidly increase. I used to not sweat at all in the gym, but this started to make me sweat. I had suddenly started breaking several plateaus. I noticed that the uncontrollable shakiness that happened in some exercises (particularly the Bench Press) was greatly reduced.

3) Most importantly for this forum -- muscle gain -- it's worked for me. I've gained about 2 pounds of muscle, while losing about 1 pound of fat, while eating more than I had been eating before I started. I personally do not count calories, I have a rigid set of rules on what I will eat, and only eat clean -- but if I'm hungry, I eat. I keep eating until I'm not hungry, then I stop. When I am cutting, I stop when I'm satiated instead of full. With this strategy, I've managed to cut 70lbs (of mostly fat), and gain 13lbs (of mostly muscle), so I generally trust this more than a pre-planned spreadsheet. With my new voracious appetite, I'd estimate I've been eating 3500 calories on most off days/upper body days, and 4000+ on lower body days.

I'm not selling snake oil, and I have no benefit from anyone buying this stuff, nor do I guarantee it will do anything for anyone else. Perhaps I just had a magnesium deficiency, and this helped clear it up, but perhaps there's more to it. I've done a lot of research on it, and it seems to scientifically make sense to me.

In any event - if you search on google for "magnesium oil", you'll find what I've been using, a few companies make it. I put a small amount on when I wake up and before I go to sleep on off days, and just before the gym and before I go to sleep on lifting days. The websites that sell the stuff are all unbelievably tacky, and I apologize for that!

From what I've read, through transdermal magnesium therapy, you can effectively raise your magnesium levels from 'deficient' to 'normal' in about 3 weeks, and It's been about that time for me. Getting back to what I was told by this nameless russian bodybuilder, once you've achieved a 'normal' level, maintaining it is easier, as having more magnesium makes your body absorb magnesium more effectively - I haven't been able to find any research that confirms this, but given the correctness of the other part of the advice, I figure it's worth repeating.

Research I've done on my own shows that "Magnesium oil" is actually just very highly concentrated ocean water - so probably swimming in the ocean for an hour a day would have a similar effect, and you could also probably make some of your own just collecting ocean water and evaporating it off.

If you do your own research, you'll find that Magnesium is documented to be at least minimally associated with hypertrophy, stress regulation, muscle relaxation, and running your immune system. I think it's possible that my excessively high stress life may have caused a Magnesium deficiency, so this issue may only apply to me and anyone else thats insanely stressed out.

If anyone else tries it, and it works for you, let me know.

If you are a skeptic -- that's cool too, personally, I think the whole thing sounded very hocus-pocus, and I even feel silly posting about it, but it did work for me.

Incidentally, I had a blood test done a couple of months ago, and my magnesium levels were not clinically deficient, but were on the low range of "normal". Next time I have a blood test done, I'll make sure to test magnesium again and update the thread on what it looks like now.

[gray]

I take epsom salt baths whenever I have access to a bath . I usually use 2-3 cups MGSO4 * 7H20 and soak anywhere from 15-30 minutes. My friend who plays baseball uses them as well.

[stefanjagger]

That's a lot of text for my sorry eyes.

[afraser42]

I am intrigued!

[gray]

I would be using Magnesium Sulfate, the kind you said was low quality. It's the only kind I've ever seen.

[njprime]

You can order it online, and some local health food stores seem to actually carry it. Whole Foods doesn't, but smaller more hippie type "health" places do.


I'm pretty sure any magnesium will be an improvement to low magnesium, even if it's epsom salt.

[Azure]

What does ZMA have?

[gray]

Originally Posted by Azure

What does ZMA have?

I think that would depend on your brand of ZMA. The product should give the specific Magnesium formula. ZMA gave me massive acne along my back and chest after about 2 weeks --- it wasn't worth it.

[kexing]

I highly reccomend a good cal/mag/d3 supp for anyone that trains.

[NCNBilly]

Magnesium Chloride can be found in bulk at most home improvement stores (sold as Mag Flake). I use it in my aquarium. Mebbe I'm getting my Mag supplementation from working around in there.

[mastover]

I routinely use ZMA before training. As a sleep inducer, it did absolutely nothing for me. But for pre-workout I'd have some crazy energy and strength. Magnesium aids in muscle contraction, so I generally recommend it for prior to training. I am still undecided if ZMA can incease test levels, I'll have to continue researching that aspect of it, however it might generate an increase in the 40+ male athlete.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by mastover

I routinely use ZMA before training. As a sleep inducer, it did absolutely nothing for me. But for pre-workout I'd have some crazy energy and strength. Magnesium aids in muscle contraction, so I generally recommend it for prior to training. I am still undecided if ZMA can incease test levels, I'll have to continue researching that aspect of it, however it might generate an increase in the 40+ male athlete.

How many do you take before training?

The bottle I usually buy from Allmax recommends 3 before going to bed.

[mastover]

Originally Posted by Azure

How many do you take before training?

The bottle I usually buy from Allmax recommends 3 before going to bed.

I always used the recommended dosage.

[JoeSchmo]

Originally Posted by mastover

I routinely use ZMA before training. As a sleep inducer, it did absolutely nothing for me. But for pre-workout I'd have some crazy energy and strength. Magnesium aids in muscle contraction, so I generally recommend it for prior to training. I am still undecided if ZMA can incease test levels, I'll have to continue researching that aspect of it, however it might generate an increase in the 40+ male athlete.

Interesting. I usually take zinc and magnesium prior to bed. For me too, it does nothing for sleep. During tomorrow's workout, I'm gonna give magnesium a try pre-workout and see what happens!


...although, I've been taking magnesium oxide, which according to the OP, doesn't absorb well. I'm going to have to look into this a little further....

[MannishBoy]

Originally Posted by JoeSchmo

Interesting. I usually take zinc and magnesium prior to bed. For me too, it does nothing for sleep. During tomorrow's workout, I'm gonna give magnesium a try pre-workout and see what happens!


...although, I've been taking magnesium oxide, which according to the OP, doesn't absorb well. I'm going to have to look into this a little further....

I think Poloquin has talked about this a lot at T-nation. Of course he sells his own...

You could search his "Question of Strength" (or whatever they are called) columns for his take. I'm pretty sure he's also recommending a specific type.

[JoeSchmo]

Well I'll be damned. It seems that magnesium oxide truly does suck!

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11794633

Originally Posted by MannishBoy

I think Poloquin has talked about this a lot at T-nation. Of course he sells his own...

You could search his "Question of Strength" (or whatever they are called) columns for his take. I'm pretty sure he's also recommending a specific type.

Thanks -- I'll take a look when I get a chance.

[mastover]

Originally Posted by JoeSchmo

Well I'll be damned. It seems that magnesium oxide truly does suck!

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11794633




Thanks -- I'll take a look when I get a chance.

Magnesium oxide is good if you're constipated. ZMA is good for strength gains due to the zinc and energy substrates contained in the B6.

Give zma a shot. It may or may not work for you. What brand was I using? Walmart. LOL

[JoeSchmo]

Originally Posted by mastover

Magnesium oxide is good if you're constipated.

Uh...that explains a lot.

Give zma a shot. It may or may not work for you. What brand was I using? Walmart. LOL

Thanks for the tip mastover. I'll try some zma pre-workout and see what happens.

[afraser42]

Well, ordered some magnesium oil - figure, I like the Epsom baths I've been taking, why not give this a shot.


When you say you put on a "little" bit, about how much would you say you're using? An ounce?

[njprime]

I'll try measuring out what I've been using, but really just enough to get a thin/even coat on my chest/abs.