Advice on cutting while gaining/maintaining LBM

danstock · Mon, March 6th, 2006, 06:36 PM

Hey all! This is my first post. I have been lurking for a few months now and working hard to get back into shape. I won't bore you with the details, I'll just get right down to the question. I have been eating right and doing lots of cardio for the last 4 months. I started my change of lifestyle on November 10th, 2005 at 230lbs and about 34% BF (just an estimate based on my mesurements and BF scale at the time). This puts me at a LBM of about 152lbs to start.

I am now down to 187lbs and roughly 25%. This would put my LBM at around 140lbs. I would say (if these numbers are right) that I have lost ~12lbs of muscle and 31lbs of fat. I have been focused more on cardio then on weightlifting and I can now see that I was wrong. So I will be focusing more on lifting from here on.

Is 12lbs of muscle considered a lot over that period of time? I'm sure that upping my calories a bit and hitting the weights will now allow me to maintain my current LBM... but can I expect to even gain a few pounds of muscle while cutting? Even getting up to a LBM of 148-149lbs will be just about right for when I reach my cutting goal of 165lbs and ~10%. Do you think this will be possible? Or will I now have to cut to 154 or lower to get that to that BF%?

Cliff notes: Can I expect to gain 8-9lbs of muscle while cutting? or will I have to maintain LBM and cut 10+ lbs lower before I bulk? Thanks!

bradh · Mon, March 6th, 2006, 06:50 PM

Using good food selection and a high carb recovery drink i believe you can gain muscle and lost bodyfat at the sametime. I'm getting leaner myself right now and my strength is increasing, sign of muscle gain and/or neural adapations.

John Berardi states that if you have a good weight training program, cardio(HIIT+LISS) and a soild diet its quite doable unless your very lean to begin with and in the advance stages the rules change some.

Demon Knight · Tue, March 7th, 2006, 12:48 PM

You should never expect to gain muscle on a cut but if you are a beginner or you are returning to weight training after some time off, you can expect to gain some. Most people lose a bit of muscle when cutting. Start off with your weight training program, whatever it is. If you are increasing in weights or reps each workout (small increments like 5lbs on the squat or 2 more reps on a bench press), not in every exercise but in a fair number, then you are "gaining". That's the basis of proper weight training. Incremental increase each workout and you are growing! No need to change anything there. Don't jump too much. Small increments is key. Just keep adding! If you start weight training and you are pretty much stagnant for 3 weeks or even dropping, then something needs adjusting...

I don't think you can fix muscle loss with more protein, a high carb drink or anything as singular as that (although canada is right, high carb PWO drinks help me too). Check your overall calorie intake, how much you execise etc.

People vary so much, its hard to give you a straight answer on whether you will gain muscle and how much. I believe you can. But its nowhere near how much you gain on a bulk!

RTE · Tue, March 7th, 2006, 01:17 PM

Dr. Ellington Darden puts his male trainees(41) on a 60/20/20 (C/P/F) diet between 1800-1200 calories for 6 weeks in one study. During that time the men lose an average 23lbs of fat and gained 4 lbs of muscle for a loss of 19lbs total. That is .67lbs of muscle a week. They just did resistance training, no cardio. It can be done with an effective program.

leftyx · Tue, March 7th, 2006, 01:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rtestes

Dr. Ellington Darden puts his male trainees(41) on a 60/20/20 (C/P/F) diet between 1800-1200 calories for 6 weeks in one study. During that time the men lose an average 23lbs of fat and gained 4 lbs of muscle for a loss of 19lbs total. That is .67lbs a week. They just did resistance training, no cardio. It can be done with an effective program.

RTE pardon me if I'm incorrect but I believe 19lbs for 6 weeks is 3lbs a week...an ungodly number in terms of pounds lost.

RTE · Tue, March 7th, 2006, 01:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by leftyx

RTE pardon me if I'm incorrect but I believe 19lbs for 6 weeks is 3lbs a week...an ungodly number in terms of pounds lost.

It is a good number and they gained muscle and didn't lose it. This study was documented in his book - A flat Stomach ASAP . The men lost 4" on waist at navel, the women(109) lost an average of 3 1/4". The avg body weight at start for men was 208.3 lbs and women weighted 156.5lbs. There are a number of before and after shots in book.