View Full Version : Gym Information = FRUSTRATING


n'fa
September 21st, 2004, 12:37 AM
I've been lifting weights for a while now, but I am still unsure about a lot of weight lifting stuff. There is so much conflicting information out there, I am constantly confused...

I have read that you must train a muscle group once per week, no, twice per week, no that's too much, less than once per week.

I have read that for large muscles you should do 9 - 12 sets, yet somehow keep it under an hour, no, go over an hour, no, do 6 - 8 sets.

I have read that you should do 10 - 12 reps, no, 6 - 8 reps, no, heavy and 4 - 6, or a combination of all three.

I have read that you must constantly change your routine to keep building muscle, I have read lists of exercises that should be used - compound exercises only, no, a mixture of compound and isolating, freeweights only, freeweights and machines...

I have read that you must consume lots of protein along with other supplements, and I have read that there is no scientific evidence supporting these supplements, and I have read anecdotal evidence that they work, and that everyone needs them.



Are there answers to these questions? I am getting so tired of reading stuff that constantly conflicts with other information. Whether it be from magazines, books, the internet, or personal trainers, everything seems to clash. Ahhhhhhhh! :spaz: :spaz: :spaz:

1FastGTX
September 21st, 2004, 01:43 AM
Yes, there's a lot of info out there.

What you need to do is figure this out on your own. Trial and error. Figure out what works best for you. While I have strong beliefs in particular training protocols, I know a number of people doing things much different than I am and they are seeing gains (or losses).

Of course, genetics is a huge factor as well.

With all that said, here's what I prefer specifically to each of your questions. Note that these are MY OPINIONS and I again stress that you should try to find your own groove so to speak.

I have read that you must train a muscle group once per week, no, twice per week, no that's too much, less than once per week.

I prefer once per week at the most. I know a number of more advanced trainees doing once every 7-10 days, because they know how to properly overload their muscles so they do require more time for rest.

If Arnold and Pee Wee Herman go to the gym and do the same workout, it's likely that Arnold will be working harder because he knows how to properly overload his muscles with correct form, weight selection, etc. So perhaps Arnold, the more advanced trainee, requires more rest than Pee Wee. (Oh, I can already hear the comments coming about "what about Arnold's competition routine in his Encyclopedia!" It was just a comparison!)

I have read that for large muscles you should do 9 - 12 sets, yet somehow keep it under an hour, no, go over an hour, no, do 6 - 8 sets.

I prefer low volume, high intensity, and about a 35-40 minute workout. 2 muscles per day (SOMETIMES 3), 4-5, sometimes but rarely 6, sets for each muscle (excluding warmups). I usually do 1 or 2 more working sets for larger muscles (quads, back) than smaller muscles (biceps, calves).

I have read that you should do 10 - 12 reps, no, 6 - 8 reps, no, heavy and 4 - 6, or a combination of all three.

I prefer heavy weight and between 5-7 reps, approximately. Depends on how I feel really. If I do 8 reps I try to increase weight the next workout.

I have read that you must constantly change your routine to keep building muscle, I have read lists of exercises that should be used - compound exercises only, no, a mixture of compound and isolating, freeweights only, freeweights and machines...

Change for the sake of change is not, in my opinion, the best thing. Changing every few months isn't a bad idea, I guess some call this "shocking the muscles" or whatever. But I like doing the same thing each week but trying to constantly increase weight as much as possible. That way I know I'm getting stronger. I usually go about 10-12 weeks on the same routine (while trying to increase weight each workout where I can), then take about a week off. When I come back I change up the order and split, and possibly switch some of the exercises.

COMPOUND VS. ISOLATION - this is debated a lot, but I prefer basic heavy movements. I don't like a lot of the exercises that I have to go light weight on - like flys, concentration curls, etc. I prefer big movements myself. I think you can get better gains working with heavier weight. Again, my opinion.

FREEWEIGHTS VS. MACHINES - Well, as my friend/PT Eric once told me, your muscle doesn't have an eye and it doesn't have a brain. There's some truth to this, though if I had to make a decision it would be free weights. I think a mixture of the two is good. Figure out what works best for you for each bodypart.

Also, it's kind of hard to totally eliminate machines. The leg press is a machine, the pulldown is a machine, the tricep pushdown is a machine, etc. You could eliminate them all, but it wouldn't be easy. I prefer a mixture of both freeweights and machines.

I have read that you must consume lots of protein along with other supplements, and I have read that there is no scientific evidence supporting these supplements, and I have read anecdotal evidence that they work, and that everyone needs them.

The "lots of protein" issue is debatable as well. I know some really fantastic people on here who totally disagree with this and they have great physiques. Some would say it's part of the supplement industry looking for more money. Obvioulsy this is highly probable. You may want to post this particular question in the "Nutrition and Supplements" section though. I am definitely no nutrition expert. :)

SUPPLEMENTS - In my opinion 95% or higher of the supps out there are worthless. If you are just starting out it is MUCH more important to get your diet and training and rest in check before even thinking about supplements. Perhaps taking a multi vitamin would be good though, I do advise this.

Creatine is one supp that I think isn't bad, provided you have a reputable company you're buying from. But hell even creatine has been known to pack on tons of water weight.

I think the one supp that is good is a decent Meal Replacement (MRP), but this is mainly because of the convienence factor. Let's face it - some of us have a hard time with eating 5-6 meals a day, and a quick shake is much easier to prepare than is chicken and rice.

Sorry for the long post. I hope some of this was helpful! :)

Chris

Knubb
September 21st, 2004, 01:49 AM
The only answer (as I see it) is that you should go your own way. Do what you want to do, as long as it gives you results, or keeps you happy. If you stop gaining (strength, muscle, or whatever you like to gain, if gains are what your looking for), you should probably consider changing something in your program. This goes for training as well as your diet. If you track your intake, you can see what happens when you get a certain amount of protein, if you gain more or less if you use protein drinks, what a little more fat does to your appearance, and stuff like that.

Kino
September 21st, 2004, 06:27 AM
I'm going to throw this out on the table again, since I was in the exact same place that you and many others are in, not too long ago. If you're really into your training, why not arm yourself with the best base from which to build from. Look into getting educated, by taking a certification course. It was without a doubt, the best thing that I have ever done for myself. Here are a few organizations that you can look at...

http://www.acefitness.org/
http://www.afaa.com/
http://www.issaonline.com/
http://www.nasm.org/
http://www.nfpt.com/
http://www.nsca-lift.org/

I know that there are other organizations out there, but these are the ones that you will find the majority of trainers are coming from. I took the course for my own self-knowledge, nothing more. I don't see myself making a career change, and getting into the fitness industry at 42. Though you never know.
I had become so confused, and so frustrated with not being able to decide whom, or what to listen too, that the price of taking a CPT course was negligible compared to having piece of mind. Taking a course alone, will not provide you with everything that you will ever need to know...but once you better understand how the body works, everything just seems to make alot more sense.

Wondering if you'll actually learn anything that you may not already know? Try this Pre-Test. (http://nsca.hkeducationcenter.com/Courses/CSCS_info/pretest.cfm)

CASD
September 21st, 2004, 09:10 AM
Go here:
http://www.ast-ss.com/max-ot/max-ot_intro.asp

And sign up! they give you all the info and a workout routine
I went to "training" first(top click)
Click "Getting Started"

I'm on the 2nd phase of the 3 day split ..

william g
September 21st, 2004, 09:40 AM
nsca can be done completely online cant it ????

Kino
September 21st, 2004, 10:02 AM
nsca can be done completely online cant it ????

I couldn't say. After I made my decision on who I would certify through, I kind of forgot about how the other organizations did theirs. I do plan on taking some courses through other organizations in the future though.
You can get all of the information by calling them direct. I spoke to 4 different organizations before deciding myself.
Something I did forget to mention above...I have yet to see how having a trainers cert. could ever hurt anybody. :tu:

--D--
September 21st, 2004, 10:07 AM
If you want to learn about building muscle go here: http://www.hypertrophy-specific.com/hst_index.html and here: http://www.hypertrophy-specific.com/cgi-bin/ib3/ikonboard.cgi?;act=SF;f=13 to start. The difference between this information and what you find in most other places is that this information is backed by peer reviewed, physiological studies on muscle growth. It's not about philosphy, it's not about "do this because it works because I said so", it's not about "everyone is different so try everything", it's about the science of why muscles grow and how to grow them as fast as possible.

Skoorb
September 21st, 2004, 10:26 AM
There are almost no uniform answers to any of your questions.

The thing is, almost everything works, to some extent. I've made gains training a muscle group hard every 48 hours for weeks on end, and I've made them training it hard every 7 days. Some of it is, figure out what works best for you, but another problem is that as excercise science progresses, a lot of the older conventional wisdom pervades. For instance, almost nobody now prescribes a 48 hour rest between muscle groups, whereas in the past it was the accepted idea. People lean now towards 4-7 days.

Even from competent sources you will often find a lot of conflicting info. Some info does not conflict though, but for the rest, just try what works and see for yourself, unfortunately.