After trying these multiple times I've come to the conclusion that due to the fact that I've VERY double jointed I cannot do these at all with freeweights without it feeling like I'm ripping my shoulders in half (My arms just do not correctly bend the necessary way.

I am able to do squats on one of the squat machines and I was curious to how effective it is. I can do a good amount of weight on it for me but I know that it's always easier to do more weight on machines. I'm wondering if I'm still getting the benefit of the exercise. I enjoyed doing it, it felt like a normal squat and the movement was the same, but I prefer using free weights whenever possible.

Any ideas?

The machine is not even close to the same. Try front squats or hack squats. Check out www.exrx.net for other squat variations that would work for you. I dont quite see how your arms cant get into the correct position. It seems like a very natural movement but everyone is different. Hope you find something that works.

Out of curiosity, how is the machine not simliar in movement and the idea? Unfortunately, hack squats don't do anything for me. The only real difference is that I don't have to stabilize and the weight rests on my shoudlers with the pads. I'm still using my legs and keeping my back straight.

Just curious, not arguing. Today it seemed like a good addition into my leg workout.

Out of curiosity, how is the machine not simliar in movement and the idea? Unfortunately, hack squats don't do anything for me. The only real difference is that I don't have to stabilize and the weight rests on my shoudlers with the pads. I'm still using my legs and keeping my back straight.

Just curious, not arguing. Today it seemed like a good addition into my leg workout.

http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/ronharris5.htm
http://www.bodytrends.com/staley.htm

These two might give some insight. The exercises are different. Whether one is superior - who knows? I am in the camp of exercise for health, which means translating to the real world - so if I have to squat up some weight I know there's not going to be a bar there to counterbalance and stabilize me. I also noticed that the smith locks me into an unnatural range of motion. If you analyze a properly executed squat, there is a deviation of the line between the bar and the floor due to the shift in your center of gravity, and related to such factors as the length of your leg bones, your hip and ankle flexibility, etc. The Smith doesn't afford any such deviation and locks you into the plane of the Smith. This isn't necessarily doom but you should know how to position yourself to take advantage of as much of your natural range as possible.

There is also a peripheral benefit you gain from squatting in upper body development - this exercise affects 75% of your body. When using the smith, because the bar is stabilized for you, you lose some of that benefit. Now, whether or not this means your overall program is doomed or not is another subject for debate. Me, I like to get bang for my buck so I want to affect as much mass as possible. However, if your condition prevents you from safely executing a free form squat, then it may make sense to use a machine.

The question is that double-jointed or not, it takes muscle and effort to stabilize that bar in a free squat. By switching to the Smith, are you handicapping yourself and not allowing certain muscles to develop that you would need? I.e. should you take it slow and use a lighter weight and adapt to the free squat? Or are you truly, physically impeded from effectively doing it, and therefore a Smith is not a handicap but rather a compromise to train your legs as effectively as possible? Only you and/or your trainer can really answer those questions.

Jeremy

Excellent articles.

Thanks Jeremy, let me explain. I can't even do a bar alone in a free form squat due to overwhelming amounts of pain unrelated to the actual technique.. It's due to the joints. I haven't tried to go heavier than what I'm able to do.

Thanks for all the feedback folks, it's appreciated.

I'd like to know if anyone has successfully built his legs w/out free weight squats using this or something substantially like it

http://newyorkbarbells.tv/pro91305.html

?

that is rather close to what I have to use.....

Seems to be a good startup exercise for legs followed by leg press and some other things. My legs have developed rather well since January; however, they have always been stronger than anything else due to the extra 80lbs I used to carry around.

Are dumbbell squats out of the question? I do those because the machines and the squat rack are normally occupied at my gym.

Did those today, as well as some Sumo Squats. Those were fun. :)