i agree, congrats on your lucky genetics :D



hate hate hate

What is going to be your next goal, John. Well...after you bulk up and cut you said you wanted the 18 inch arms and 8% bodyfat. You also said you don't want to get much bigger. Are you going to maintain after that point?

I've wanted to say this for a long time but have always hesitated, until now.

"John has great genetics! Lucky genetics! You've got great genes! blah blah blah!"

Are you people serious? I see these comments all the time on this board and I just can't take it any more. I wish it was sarcasm, but it doesn't appear to be.

Look at his dedication. He hasn't missed a single work out for what, three years? Never misses a meal--rarely cheats any more. His meals are nutrient dense, extremely well balanced, and detailed to his specific current goal. He controls everything he can, everything within his limits. That's why he is so successful. He doesn't skip ANYTHING. I get so sick and tired of people commenting about his genes. I repeat, he doesn't slack on ANY OF THE MOST IMPORTANT FACTORS TO A SUCCESSFUL "WORKOUT PROGRAM." He is a machine.

You eat perfect meals totaling 4,000+ calories a day (which I assume he is doing now) for three months, never miss a workout, push yourself every workout with great equipment, sleep 8~ hours a night, all awhile never allowing yourself to slip on any of these routines, and you will have John Stone results. He eats massive amounts of quality foods, takes quality sups, uses quality weight equipment, gets quality sleep, and has quality workout sessions every single day. This is not easy. It’s not even challenging. It’s grueling.

I don't think it has a single thing to do with his genetics. Look at his pictures through his life. Scrawny guitar player to no-muscle, fat techie and you want to tell me he has great genetics? No. He wasn’t huge/cut/superiorly fit whatever you want to use to describe it in high-school (probably most in shape because of swimming), the college years, or even during the male body physical peak period, early through late twenties.

The man has perseverance, dedication, and determination. He has knowledge. He has self-control. He has a drive to give it his all. He walks the walk. He does not possess superior genetics. If you mimic his flawless performance (FOR THREE YEARS! Yes, I am aware he made mistakes, but that was only due to ignorance, not his fortitude) you'll pack on the muscle, shred the fat, or succeed when applying it to anything you want to accomplish. But that's the point, he doesn't mimic anything. He does it for himself and has zero tolerance for his own erroneous behavior.

It’s not genetics, its willpower and control of the mind.

edit: I'm not trying to be disrespectful to those who have commented on his genetics, I'm just irritated and want to get a point across to anyone who might read this and become discouraged because they believe they have inferior genetics.

I've wanted to say It’s not genetics, its willpower and control of the mind.
Very good post! I also think this is true. Don't take away John's hard work and say it's a big part genetics!

To be honest I think Wh0 was jus teasing John there.

To be honest I think Wh0 was jus teasing John there.

I agree with this, he most definatly was.

However, still a great post. :tu:

I've wanted to say this for a long time but have always hesitated, until now.

"John has great genetics! Lucky genetics! You've got great genes! blah blah blah!"

Are you people serious? I see these comments all the time on this board and I just can't take it any more. I wish it was sarcasm, but it doesn't appear to be.

Look at his dedication. He hasn't missed a single work out for what, three years? Never misses a meal--rarely cheats any more. His meals are nutrient dense, extremely well balanced, and detailed to his specific current goal. He controls everything he can, everything within his limits. That's why he is so successful. He doesn't skip ANYTHING. I get so sick and tired of people commenting about his genes. I repeat, he doesn't slack on ANY OF THE MOST IMPORTANT FACTORS TO A SUCCESSFUL "WORKOUT PROGRAM." He is a machine.

You eat perfect meals totaling 4,000+ calories a day (which I assume he is doing now) for three months, never miss a workout, push yourself every workout with great equipment, sleep 8~ hours a night, all awhile never allowing yourself to slip on any of these routines, and you will have John Stone results. He eats massive amounts of quality foods, takes quality sups, uses quality weight equipment, gets quality sleep, and has quality workout sessions every single day. This is not easy. It’s not even challenging. It’s grueling.

I don't think it has a single thing to do with his genetics. Look at his pictures through his life. Scrawny guitar player to no-muscle, fat techie and you want to tell me he has great genetics? No. He wasn’t huge/cut/superiorly fit whatever you want to use to describe it in high-school (probably most in shape because of swimming), the college years, or even during the male body physical peak period, early through late twenties.

The man has perseverance, dedication, and determination. He has knowledge. He has self-control. He has a drive to give it his all. He walks the walk. He does not possess superior genetics. If you mimic his flawless performance (FOR THREE YEARS! Yes, I am aware he made mistakes, but that was only due to ignorance, not his fortitude) you'll pack on the muscle, shred the fat, or succeed when applying it to anything you want to accomplish. But that's the point, he doesn't mimic anything. He does it for himself and has zero tolerance for his own erroneous behavior.

It’s not genetics, its willpower and control of the mind.

edit: I'm not trying to be disrespectful to those who have commented on his genetics, I'm just irritated and want to get a point across to anyone who might read this and become discouraged because they believe they have inferior genetics.



Relax dude. No one is saying John didn't put the time in. For the record, if you think genetics don't come into play at all, you're sadly mistaken.

I've wanted to say this for a long time but have always hesitated, until now.

"John has great genetics! Lucky genetics! You've got great genes! blah blah blah!"

Are you people serious? I see these comments all the time on this board and I just can't take it any more. I wish it was sarcasm, but it doesn't appear to be.

Look at his dedication. He hasn't missed a single work out for what, three years? Never misses a meal--rarely cheats any more. His meals are nutrient dense, extremely well balanced, and detailed to his specific current goal. He controls everything he can, everything within his limits. That's why he is so successful. He doesn't skip ANYTHING. I get so sick and tired of people commenting about his genes. I repeat, he doesn't slack on ANY OF THE MOST IMPORTANT FACTORS TO A SUCCESSFUL "WORKOUT PROGRAM." He is a machine.

You eat perfect meals totaling 4,000+ calories a day (which I assume he is doing now) for three months, never miss a workout, push yourself every workout with great equipment, sleep 8~ hours a night, all awhile never allowing yourself to slip on any of these routines, and you will have John Stone results. He eats massive amounts of quality foods, takes quality sups, uses quality weight equipment, gets quality sleep, and has quality workout sessions every single day. This is not easy. It’s not even challenging. It’s grueling.

I don't think it has a single thing to do with his genetics. Look at his pictures through his life. Scrawny guitar player to no-muscle, fat techie and you want to tell me he has great genetics? No. He wasn’t huge/cut/superiorly fit whatever you want to use to describe it in high-school (probably most in shape because of swimming), the college years, or even during the male body physical peak period, early through late twenties.

The man has perseverance, dedication, and determination. He has knowledge. He has self-control. He has a drive to give it his all. He walks the walk. He does not possess superior genetics. If you mimic his flawless performance (FOR THREE YEARS! Yes, I am aware he made mistakes, but that was only due to ignorance, not his fortitude) you'll pack on the muscle, shred the fat, or succeed when applying it to anything you want to accomplish. But that's the point, he doesn't mimic anything. He does it for himself and has zero tolerance for his own erroneous behavior.

It’s not genetics, its willpower and control of the mind.

edit: I'm not trying to be disrespectful to those who have commented on his genetics, I'm just irritated and want to get a point across to anyone who might read this and become discouraged because they believe they have inferior genetics.

SC certainly knows all that. I see where you're coming from though. I think SC was saying how now that John is letting his genes reach their full potential and express themselves, he is proving to have great genetics. You can have great genetics and never realize your potential ie: the former John. Now that he has transformed himself in to "Johnny Fitness":lol: we can really see his genetic potential.

I agree with bm1te. Sure genetics plays a certian role, but I dont belive that all big gyes witch 18"+ arms do have superior genetics.

What is superior genetics btw?

I can take myself for example. I dont need to eat especially much to gain weight, and most of it must be clean foods or the gains will be fatgains instead of muscle.
My friend who is a hardgainer, can eat extremly much and still dont gain much muscle at all. BUT a sweare that Principly EVERYTHING he is eating is added on his muscle. He can eat usuall food + an extra 2 family size bags of chips EVERY day. Wich will say he is on around 4500 cal/day and most of it is bad fats, still not gaining a single amount of fat. Just muscle.:eek:

So the point is that your own body needs its own routine to work proper. If you just learn your own body and does what it tells you, you will with right training and sleep routines get big!

Sure our metabolisms and so on depends on our genetics. But I dont belive in that it is the genetics that decides how fast and big your muscles can grow. That is up to you.

Just my opinion on the whole thing :)

One more time. Regardless of how hard you train, how well you eat, or how dedicated you are, you can only go as far as your genetics allow. (unless of course drugs are involved) The bottom line is this. John has busted his ass for years. He's gotten tremendous results. However, if he didn't have the genetic pre-disposition he wouldn't have achieved these results to the degree he has. Plain and simple.
I by no means am taking ANYTHING away from John. He has done an amazing job with his transformation but I think he'll be the first to say genetics have played a role in his success. This is a scientific fact, like it or not.

To be honest I think Wh0 was jus teasing John there.
no kidding.
how can anyone take something like that seriously when they see a banana man riding a green llama in my sig?

and skinz on bm1te for deleting his post after everyone else already quoted it :D

One more time. Regardless of how hard you train, how well you eat, or how dedicated you are, you can only go as far as your genetics allow. (unless of course drugs are involved) The bottom line is this. John has busted his ass for years. He's gotten tremendous results. However, if he didn't have the genetic pre-disposition he wouldn't have achieved these results to the degree he has. Plain and simple.
I by no means am taking ANYTHING away from John. He has done an amazing job with his transformation but I think he'll be the first to say genetics have played a role in his success. This is a scientific fact, like it or not.

I think you might want to expound on this DD. For example, for some people having a hard time with their routine or getting to where they want that statement could discourage them and cause them to give up. I.e. can SOME people just not cut down to 10% bf no matter what they do because of their genetics? IMHO I believe that genetics plays more of a role in MUSCLE DEVELOPMENT than in FAT LOSS. Perhaps that is what you are saying in essence as well and I am just not seeing it. I think through the right diet and excersize anyone can cut fat down to single digits if they want to, however I do not believe that everyone can continually pack on muscle non stop. At some point their body is going to slow that progress down to some degree unless altered with steroids (sorry to use a dirty word) or the like. What do you think?

One more time. Regardless of how hard you train, how well you eat, or how dedicated you are, you can only go as far as your genetics allow. (unless of course drugs are involved) The bottom line is this. John has busted his ass for years. He's gotten tremendous results. However, if he didn't have the genetic pre-disposition he wouldn't have achieved these results to the degree he has. Plain and simple.
I by no means am taking ANYTHING away from John. He has done an amazing job with his transformation but I think he'll be the first to say genetics have played a role in his success. This is a scientific fact, like it or not.


yeah I belive what you are saying.
But I think that John right now is on a point that almost everybody can reach. Im NOT saying its easy, but achiveble.
John is at a perfect point right now, definatley not small, not to big.
I think for most people the drawn line where geneticts stop you is if you should want to get even bigger.

But I can definatley be wrong. This is only what i belive myself and what I have learned in my 7 months of bodybuilding.

What I have been understanding u have been doing this for alot more than 7 months,:) so I guess you know better. :rolleyes:

yeah I belive what you are saying.
But I think that John right now is on a point that almost everybody can reach. Im NOT saying its easy, but achiveble.
John is at a perfect point right now, definatley not small, not to big.
I think for most people the drawn line where geneticts stop you is if you should want to get even bigger.

My theory/thoughts exactly. Agreed. :tu:

Where did bm1te's post go anyway???Must have been the couple of F bombs that got it removed:spank:

I am going to have to make you STOP my program and quit training.

You're getting too big, and pretty soon people aren't going to recognize you and you're going to get mad at me for outgrowing all of your clothes.Sounds good to me! I'll happily buy a new wardrobe. :D

Thanks again for all the support and the great bulking program. :tucool:


Dude, you can only motivate me so much. I'm beginning to question myself!!!!! Nice traps.Thanks a lot, dd! :)


i agree, congrats on your lucky genetics :D
hate hate hateThat's the nicest thing you've ever said to me. Thank you.



What is going to be your next goal, John. Well...after you bulk up and cut you said you wanted the 18 inch arms and 8% bodyfat. You also said you don't want to get much bigger. Are you going to maintain after that point?It's going to take at least one more bulk to reach my goals (my arms are the least of my "worries" right now). Once I'm satisfied I'll maintain, yes. I have no desire to see how big and "freakish" I can get.


I've wanted to say this for a long time but have always hesitated, until now.

"John has great genetics! Lucky genetics! You've got great genes! blah blah blah!"

Are you people serious? I see these comments all the time on this board and I just can't take it any more. I wish it was sarcasm, but it doesn't appear to be.

Look at his dedication. He hasn't missed a single work out for what, three years? Never misses a meal--rarely cheats any more. His meals are nutrient dense, extremely well balanced, and detailed to his specific current goal. He controls everything he can, everything within his limits. That's why he is so successful. He doesn't skip ANYTHING. I get so sick and tired of people commenting about his genes. I repeat, he doesn't slack on ANY OF THE MOST IMPORTANT FACTORS TO A SUCCESSFUL "WORKOUT PROGRAM." He is a machine.

You eat perfect meals totaling 4,000+ calories a day (which I assume he is doing now) for three months, never miss a workout, push yourself every workout with great equipment, sleep 8~ hours a night, all awhile never allowing yourself to slip on any of these routines, and you will have John Stone results. He eats massive amounts of quality foods, takes quality sups, uses quality weight equipment, gets quality sleep, and has quality workout sessions every single day. This is not easy. It’s not even challenging. It’s grueling.

I don't think it has a single thing to do with his genetics. Look at his pictures through his life. Scrawny guitar player to no-muscle, fat techie and you want to tell me he has great genetics? No. He wasn’t huge/cut/superiorly fit whatever you want to use to describe it in high-school (probably most in shape because of swimming), the college years, or even during the male body physical peak period, early through late twenties.

The man has perseverance, dedication, and determination. He has knowledge. He has self-control. He has a drive to give it his all. He walks the walk. He does not possess superior genetics. If you mimic his flawless performance (FOR THREE YEARS! Yes, I am aware he made mistakes, but that was only due to ignorance, not his fortitude) you'll pack on the muscle, shred the fat, or succeed when applying it to anything you want to accomplish. But that's the point, he doesn't mimic anything. He does it for himself and has zero tolerance for his own erroneous behavior.

It’s not genetics, its willpower and control of the mind.

edit: I'm not trying to be disrespectful to those who have commented on his genetics, I'm just irritated and want to get a point across to anyone who might read this and become discouraged because they believe they have inferior genetics.Wow, I think I've found my new publicist! :D :tu:

Your biggest mistake was actually taking something wh0 said seriously. :nono:

;)

Thank you for the exceedingly kind praise. I do think you make some very good points. Let's get into it a bit...

A lot of people use genetics as an excuse for failure. Many people put in half-hearted efforts and then blame their genetics for not succeeding.

I think SwoleCat made a good point (above) when he said "Your genetics are very good, and you are now giving them a chance to really work for you."

Genetics are absolutely a factor - but they will only get you so far. You have to put the work in and you have to adapt your training to your particular genetic strengths and weaknesses. That's all I've done. I have genetic "shortfalls", just like everyone else.

So, no, I don't think I have above-average genetics, but I do think they are "good" genetics when it comes to putting on mass. There are guys out there who put on mass every time they even glance at a barbell, and there are guys out there who have a lot of trouble putting on mass even under the best of conditions. I'm not like either of those groups and, as you pointed out, I've worked very, very hard for the progress I've made.

I don't think anyone is saying I don't work hard, and I don't think anyone thinks my progress is primarily due to genetics. Those who do think genetics are the reason for my success are either new to the site, jealous, or simply making excuses so they feel better about their own lack of progress. Most people don't even come CLOSE to maxing out their genetic potential when it comes to adding mass.

Where did bm1te's post go anyway???Must have been the couple of F bombs that got it removed:spank:I didn't remove it!

I think you might want to expound on this DD. For example, for some people having a hard time with their routine or getting to where they want that statement could discourage them and cause them to give up. I.e. can SOME people just not cut down to 10% bf no matter what they do because of their genetics? IMHO I believe that genetics plays more of a role in MUSCLE DEVELOPMENT than in FAT LOSS. Perhaps that is what you are saying in essence as well and I am just not seeing it. I think through the right diet and excersize anyone can cut fat down to single digits if they want to, however I do not believe that everyone can continually pack on muscle non stop. At some point their body is going to slow that progress down to some degree unless altered with steroids (sorry to use a dirty word) or the like. What do you think?

I'm sorry gentlemen. I should have been clearer. I was referring to muscle developement NOT fat loss. Sorry.

. . .Genetics are absolutely a factor - but they will only get you so far. You have to put the work in and you have to adapt your training to your particular genetic strengths and weaknesses. That's all I've done. I have genetic "shortfalls", just like everyone else.

So, no, I don't think I have above-average genetics, but I do think they are "good" genetics when it comes to putting on mass. There are guys out there who put on mass every time they even glance at a barbell, and there are guys out there who have a lot of trouble putting on mass even under the best of conditions. I'm not like either of those groups and, as you pointed out, I've worked very, very hard for the progress I've made.

I don't think anyone is saying I don't work hard, and I don't think anyone thinks my progress is primarily due to genetics. Those who do think genetics are the reason for my success are either new to the site, jealous, or simply making excuses so they feel better about their own lack of progress. Most people don't even come CLOSE to maxing out their genetic potential when it comes to adding mass.

Here's the thing that always amazes me about the "genetics" argument: We all have some "good" genetics. We all have some "bad" genetics. These depend on the goals that we have at any given time.

Why do I think this is important? Because if you work at it, you can find a way to make your "good" genetics work for you.

John has done an amazing job at that. I always see people who talk about John's dedication and willpower - two qualities that he has developed dramatically.

But few ever talk about how John has been very smart in figuring out how to work with his genetics, or giving him credit for getting help where he needed to learn more (i.e. working with SwoleCat). It's not just his body or his personality that's engaged here. It's also his analytical brain.

Certainly some people have "better" genetics that others - depending on goals, etc. Figuring out how to work with what you have isn't easy, but to me, that's been the "hidden" key to John's great success. I'd love to have that level of success, and I'm still in the process of figuring out what gives me the best results. I hope to get some similar results (not looking to gain as much mass, but a little more lean muscle would be good), but if I don't it's not the fault of my DNA.

I'm sorry gentlemen. I should have been clearer. I was referring to muscle developement NOT fat loss. Sorry.

Thats what I figured, I thought it would just be good to clarify that so as not to discourage newbies to fitness or people struggling or using genetics as an excuse for not losing FAT. Thanks DD, you are a stand up guy! :tu:

Thats what I figured, I thought it would just be good to clarify that so as not to discourage newbies to fitness or people struggling or using genetics as an excuse for not losing FAT. Thanks DD, you are a stand up guy! :tu:


Thankyou sir. Believe me, that was NEVER my intention. Also consider what John said. Very few people EVER reach their potential when it comes to adding mass. It happens though.

Very few people EVER reach their potential when it comes to adding mass.

Mostly due to the fact that it requires you to eat like it was your second profession. ;)

Interesting....comments though...I see it in my kids, where one is more carb sensitive than the other. The oldest (by a year and a half) outweighs his younger brother by only 5 pounds (they eat the same foods and the same candy). The oldest obviously has a higher metabolism and is skinny and thin....can pound sugar and is largely unaffected. The youngest is built like a tank. The difference if you had to categorize them is

oldest = receiver
youngest = lineman

Some people look at a twinkie the wrong way and gain 10 lbs and others have to put more effort into gaining weight (my damn problem...:nope: ).


Genetics and metabolism are somewhat synonomous to a degree. When you have a understanding of what you have in terms of your frame, existing musculature and your metabolism you start to get a good idea of what is required to get to where you want to be (be it gain muscle or lose weight).

John is really starting to figure that part of the equation out (I think) and is gaining mastery at manipulating his metabolism and musculature. No one grows muscles sitting around waiting for it to happen.

The way he's documented his pursuits is very unique and one of the things that draws many people to his site (it did for me). It provides tangible proof that diet and exercise is the key to change (plus it helps that his mental game is "on" as well).

You have to bust your ass in the gym, and week after week John conquerors that quest.

k I think the horse is dead.

k I think the horse is dead.


Believe it or not, this is how people grasp an understanding of concepts which confuse them. Excuse us for trying to help them out.:rolleyes:

Believe it or not, this is how people grasp an understanding of concepts which confuse them. Excuse us for trying to help them out.:rolleyes:

I understand that, but that guy obviously already has his foot in his mouth if he deleted the post so soon :lol:

i think it was in his genes to delete that post.

i think it was in his genes to delete that post.


:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :tucool:
Sorry John. End of derailment.

Why are people offended by comments about someone's 'good genetics'.

If I told a musician he was very 'talented', would there be people crying about how it was all hard work and not natural ability? Would there be people saying that talent doesn't matter? At the same time, why would anyone say "you're only good because of your talent" ...? i don't think anyone has said that here. talent + shitloads of work = ability.

The fact is, muscles are attached to the bone where they are and that's one factor limits bodybuilders' growth. Metabolic issues can be hard to overcome as well-there are some people who will always be thick or skinny no matter what they do. Not everyone was born to play like Ingwe Malmsteen.

If John's success is just due to genetics than why was he all fat and sloppy on 1/6/2003? And if John's genetics has zero to do with it than tell me how he can have 18 inch arms with a pump at only 200 pounds when only about 1 in 100,000 males in the world can claim that (official estimate)

I know I'm beating a dead horse. I just couldn't help myself. flame away.

Actually I'm more interested in the idea (that John has mentioned before) that his legs seem to put on more muscle mass than other muscle groups and that could be due to his genetics. Does everyone have different muscles that are easier to grow?

Why are people offended by comments about someone's 'good genetics'.

If I told a musician he was very 'talented', would there be people crying about how it was all hard work and not natural ability? Would there be people saying that talent doesn't matter? At the same time, why would anyone say "you're only good because of your talent" ...? i don't think anyone has said that here. talent + shitloads of work = ability.

The fact is, muscles are attached to the bone where they are and that's one factor limits bodybuilders' growth. Metabolic issues can be hard to overcome as well-there are some people who will always be thick or skinny no matter what they do. Not everyone was born to play like Ingwe Malmsteen.

If John's success is just due to genetics than why was he all fat and sloppy on 1/6/2003? And if John's genetics has zero to do with it than tell me how he can have 18 inch arms with a pump at only 200 pounds when only about 1 in 100,000 males in the world can claim that (official estimate)


1. Athletes (great ones) get this sometimes as well. If a superior, talented athlete is perceived to be 'coasting' on his talent and not working hard enough (i.e. Barry Bonds, Manny Ramirez, T.O.) they are criticized by the media, the fans, etc. They make the game "look" easy. Little does the 'common' man understand how hard Manny, Barry, T.O., etc., work to get the most of their talent -- although where does Darryl Strawberry fit in this? -- anyway, I digress.

Hard workers (Jerry Rice, Roger Clemens) are accepted as a 'hard working, lunch-pail' kinda guys due to their highly publicized, grueling workouts.

My $0.02 is that John works hard for what he has and since he has uncovered his own potential (genes play a part) his star will only continue to rise. If you think genes play a majority percentage in John's success, then I defy you to spend a month, no a week following John's program and see if you can stand the heat.

Hate the game not the player

have 18 inch arms with a pump at only 200 pounds when only about 1 in 100,000 males in the world can claim that (official estimate)



???????? I'd like to see where you uncovered that information.:confused:

???????? I'd like to see where you uncovered that information.:confused:
I made it up.

I'm just sayin--18 inches is quite rare for someone of his size. you may see guys with arms that big walking around gyms but they're usually at least 220 or 230 pounds.

I made it up.

I'm just sayin--18 inches is quite rare for someone of his size. you may see guys with arms that big walking around gyms but they're usually at least 220 or 230 pounds.Yeah, but that's 18 inches with a huge pump. I'm just shy of 17 inches cold, and I don't think that's very unusual for someone who weighs 208 pounds and has been lifting hard for several years.

Yeah, but that's 18 inches with a huge pump. I'm just shy of 17 inches cold, and I don't think that's very unusual for someone who weighs 208 pounds and has been lifting hard for several years.
You sure do add a lot when you get a pump. Mine only go about maybe a half inch.

You sure do add a lot when you get a pump. Mine only go about maybe a half inch.Yeah I do - like 1.25 inches on bicep/tricep day!

Yeah I do - like 1.25 inches on bicep/tricep day!
Comparing the pictures of you from 01/2004 in post #33 and #64 of this thread, I can see a drastic increase in bulbousness of the gunz due to the aforementioned pump.

The pictures were both in the same month -- so obviously you're using synthol. :D

http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/ronharris8.htm

I'm just sayin--18 inches is quite rare for someone of his size. you may see guys with arms that big walking around gyms but they're usually at least 220 or 230 pounds.

Not true at all. Mine pump up to 18.25" on arm day. Im 5'11" and 195 lbs. Of course being a lean 195-200 will make all the difference. At 220-230 a 20" + arm will be much more common unless of course you are 7ft tall!

Hey John, I noticed you are going up in weight every week ...thats simply insane. I was wondering if you had th same kind of progress while on SGX. Were you increasing in wieight every week back then too?

Also, how do you manage to sweat so much during weight training? You must have breaks that are under 30 seconds between sets, i assume.

I'm not afraid to admit that I was wrong when I added the line "I don't think it has a single thing to do with his genetics" and "...you will have John Stone results." A person will not achieve the exact results; but with his style of training and perseverance, you will still achieve amazing results because what he does is simply amazing. Yes, genetics do play a role and doordude42 explained that in a very elementary form, but he still seems far too reliant on it as a reason for John’s success. I'm sure wh0areume, doordude42, and jk0 will have a great time high-fiving each other with smilies and adding painfully obvious one-liners to my admitted mistake.

I could delve into conceptual theories about motivation and genetic predetermination if you’d like but I’ll try to summarize with an example that many posters (Coachese, BigDog) have already contributed: Wisteria flowers can take 10-15 years to bloom for the first time. If you do not give the flower what it needs (sun, water, and something to climb on--yes, these events are naturally occurring, but I am adapting the scenario where the flower must be nurtured), it will never bloom. Although it has the potential to bloom, it never will unless the caretaker tends to it constantly, supplying everything it needs over a long period of time. A human’s body can have potential far beyond what is currently functioning at, but it’s up to the person in control of it to make an attempt to reach that potential within the limitations of the body. So which controls which? While genetics somewhat define the limits and potentials, only the person, under the right circumstances, can make the attempt to reach them. It can be deduced that, without the effort, whatever the potential may be is irrelevant. (It should also be noted that human potential is impossible to measure and is constantly evolving, whereas human achievement is an extension of science and variation).

John hasn’t done anything that hasn’t been done before (although he may be approaching the outer area of the curve, it is most certainly not the extreme). He hasn’t set a world record. He is a 37 year-old average man, with average genetics, who isn’t going to limit his progress by packaging it in a predetermined box of gene cards. I should've worded my original statement more accurately to convey the point I was trying to make.

The point being that there is a large group of people that read this board, do not read every post, do not know every poster's personality, nor do they know the context of the thread (which is made up of complex, intricate social behaviors) and when they see a misleading, inaccurate comment like wh0areume's (this is not the only time I have read a comment about John's amazing genes, which I stated in the original post that his comment pushed me over the edge, sarcasm or not, maybe I didn’t make it clear enough) it can be extremely discouraging and supportive of reasons not to make an attempt at changing because its just "genetics." "Well, I can't alter my genetic make-up." I think most of us have heard someone who is struggling with their body development say this explicitly or implicitly.

I'd love to make out a long list of threads where people have mentioned his genes being amazing but it won't persuade the people who have instantly discredited every word I have written. It won't do anything but make me look like an ass that is retaliating against his dissenters.

To me, this isn't a contest about who is right or who is wrong. I just want to finally contribute something to this community that has given me so much. The contribution of helping us stay focused on why we are here. We are not super men and women. John created something with his genuine hard work that appeals to the average person. When people begin to mention his "lucky" genes, with no explanation, I feel that it takes away from everything he and his community are about--empowering the person.

I've always had the same objections as bm1te when I saw people talk about John's genetics. Obviously, he doesn't have genetics that allowed him to eat and do everything he wanted, just as obvious as he has genetics that allow him to gain muscle. 'Blaming' his progress on genetics is partly taking away credit from the amazing perseverence John has shown, which is something nobody would disagree he has. I think John is an example that shows what someone is capable of if he just goes for it, with all his might. So are all those people in the media gallery that turned from fat blobs to muscular hunks. If you would do a statistical analysis on their personality characteristics and genetics, which do you think will show the most significance? I think it would show willpower to be the MAJOR factor.

So everyone, first :read:, then :eat: :bb: & :jumping: like you're John Stone, and you will look very much like him posing in his pictures: :flex:

I'm not afraid to admit that I was wrong when I added the line "I don't think it has a single thing to do with his genetics" and "...you will have John Stone results." A person will not achieve the exact results; but with his style of training and perseverance, you will still achieve amazing results because what he does is simply amazing. Yes, genetics do play a role and doordude42 explained that in a very elementary form, but he still seems far too reliant on it as a reason for John’s success. I'm sure wh0areume, doordude42, and jk0 will have a great time high-fiving each other with smilies and adding painfully obvious one-liners to my admitted mistake.

I could delve into conceptual theories about motivation and genetic predetermination if you’d like but I’ll try to summarize with an example that many posters (Coachese, BigDog) have already contributed: Wisteria flowers can take 10-15 years to bloom for the first time. If you do not give the flower what it needs (sun, water, and something to climb on--yes, these events are naturally occurring, but I am adapting the scenario where the flower must be nurtured), it will never bloom. Although it has the potential to bloom, it never will unless the caretaker tends to it constantly, supplying everything it needs over a long period of time. A human’s body can have potential far beyond what is currently functioning at, but it’s up to the person in control of it to make an attempt to reach that potential within the limitations of the body. So which controls which? While genetics somewhat define the limits and potentials, only the person, under the right circumstances, can make the attempt to reach them. It can be deduced that, without the effort, whatever the potential may be is irrelevant. (It should also be noted that human potential is impossible to measure and is constantly evolving, whereas human achievement is an extension of science and variation).

John hasn’t done anything that hasn’t been done before (although he may be approaching the outer area of the curve, it is most certainly not the extreme). He hasn’t set a world record. He is a 37 year-old average man, with average genetics, who isn’t going to limit his progress by packaging it in a predetermined box of gene cards. I should've worded my original statement more accurately to convey the point I was trying to make.

The point being that there is a large group of people that read this board, do not read every post, do not know every poster's personality, nor do they know the context of the thread (which is made up of complex, intricate social behaviors) and when they see a misleading, inaccurate comment like wh0areume's (this is not the only time I have read a comment about John's amazing genes, which I stated in the original post that his comment pushed me over the edge, sarcasm or not, maybe I didn’t make it clear enough) it can be extremely discouraging and supportive of reasons not to make an attempt at changing because its just "genetics." "Well, I can't alter my genetic make-up." I think most of us have heard someone who is struggling with their body development say this explicitly or implicitly.

I'd love to make out a long list of threads where people have mentioned his genes being amazing but it won't persuade the people who have instantly discredited every word I have written. It won't do anything but make me look like an ass that is retaliating against his dissenters.

To me, this isn't a contest about who is right or who is wrong. I just want to finally contribute something to this community that has given me so much. The contribution of helping us stay focused on why we are here. We are not super men and women. John created something with his genuine hard work that appeals to the average person. When people begin to mention his "lucky" genes, with no explanation, I feel that it takes away from everything he and his community are about--empowering the person.



Out of respect for John and the JSF community I won't dignify this post with MUCH of a rebuttle however I will say I find it EXTREMELY disrespectful of you to single out members of this forum for stating their opinions. Furhermore, to imply Wh0 and I along with jkO will be high 5ing ourselves over your lack of knowledge is ludacris. Don't flatter yourself, we've got better things to do.
Do yourself a favor. Read ALL the posts. No one is disagreeing with the fact that John has busted his ass and has done an amazing job.
You wanna talk facts, do some research.

Sorry John for the rant but............ I'll leave it at that.

Out of respect for John and the JSF community I won't dignify this post with MUCH of a rebuttle however I will say I find it EXTREMELY disrespectful of you to single out members of this forum for stating their opinions. Furhermore, to imply Wh0 and I along with jkO will be high 5ing ourselves over your lack of knowledge is ludacris. Don't flatter yourself, we've got better things to do.
Do yourself a favor. Read ALL the posts. No one is disagreeing with the fact that John has busted his ass and has done an amazing job.
You wanna talk facts, do some research.

Sorry John for the rant but............ I'll leave it at that.Unfortunately I think you read the part of his thread that mentioned you specifically, got angry, and then missed the main points of his post, which I think are excellent:

John hasn’t done anything that hasn’t been done before (although he may be approaching the outer area of the curve, it is most certainly not the extreme). He hasn’t set a world record. He is a 37 year-old average man, with average genetics, who isn’t going to limit his progress by packaging it in a predetermined box of gene cards. I should've worded my original statement more accurately to convey the point I was trying to make.
and...
To me, this isn't a contest about who is right or who is wrong. I just want to finally contribute something to this community that has given me so much. The contribution of helping us stay focused on why we are here. We are not super men and women. John created something with his genuine hard work that appeals to the average person. When people begin to mention his "lucky" genes, with no explanation, I feel that it takes away from everything he and his community are about--empowering the person.

I totally agree with the above two statements. As for the comment he made about "high-fiving", I think he was making a somewhat crude, but very valid point. That point was better expressed in this part of his post:

The point being that there is a large group of people that read this board, do not read every post, do not know every poster's personality, nor do they know the context of the thread (which is made up of complex, intricate social behaviors) and when they see a misleading, inaccurate comment like wh0areume's (this is not the only time I have read a comment about John's amazing genes, which I stated in the original post that his comment pushed me over the edge, sarcasm or not, maybe I didn’t make it clear enough) it can be extremely discouraging and supportive of reasons not to make an attempt at changing because its just "genetics." "Well, I can't alter my genetic make-up." I think most of us have heard someone who is struggling with their body development say this explicitly or implicitly.


The funny thing is, I don't think you guys disagree much, if at all! I think a series of miscommunications has created some unfortunate tension.

I think a series of miscommunications has created some unfortunate tension.

Lift weights. It helps! :lol:
:bb:

ludacris

Throw them bows!

I definitely have some sort of bug. My stomach has been bothering me all day, and I've been feeling less than 100% since yesterday (see today's Daily News update (http://www.johnstonefitness.com/news/dec_2005_news_archive.php#12172005)).

So, tonight's workout was up in the air until the last minute. I didn't feel weak like I did last night, it was mostly my stomach that was bothering me and lack of energy.

I was pretty close to skipping my workout, but I decided that I didn't feel bad enough to skip it, and it would have been more of an excuse than a legitimate reason to bail.

So, 6:00 PM rolled around and I headed into the gym to work my delts and traps!

I'm really glad I worked out. My biggest worry was that I was going to start feeling weak like I did last night. Didn't happen. Once I had a few sets banged out I felt pretty damn awesome and wound up having a GREAT workout.

Here's my delts/traps workout for the next three weeks:

DELTS
4x12 Smith machine military press
4x12 Standing dumbbell lateral raises
4x12 Bent-over dumbbell lateral raises
4x12 Seated one-arm low pulley raises

TRAPS
4xburnout Dumbbell shrugs

My new Plate Mates (http://www.johnstonefitness.com/store/shop.php?c=sports&n=3375301&k=plate+mates&s=sr&p=1&x=SportingGoods) are not only saving me a boatload of money, but the 1.25 pound weights are excellent for micro-loading the dumbbells. As I'm sure you guys know, a jump of 5 pounds PER ARM on something like lateral DB raises is no small amount of weight. Being able to add 2.5 pounds per arm on exercises like that is awesome!

OK, just one picture tonight. At the risk of sounding like I'm tooting my own horn, I have to say that I'm pretty happy with this picture. After all these years, I can finally say that I have a pair of traps!! Working them twice per week has proven to be a very wise choice - my traps have absolutely exploded over the past 2 months. I really like the effect they have on my overall physique.

My new Plate Mates (http://www.johnstonefitness.com/store/shop.php?c=sports&n=3375301&k=plate+mates&s=sr&p=1&x=SportingGoods) are not only saving me a boatload of money, but the 1.25 pound weights are excellent for micro-loading the dumbbells. As I'm sure you guys know, a jump of 5 pounds PER ARM on something like lateral DB raises is no small amount of weight. Being able to add 2.5 pounds per arm on exercises like that is awesome!

I think adding 2.5 pounds per arm on lateral dumbell raises is still very much! :confused: I do em one arm at a time (I think I had some kind of impingement, so I'm using VERY strict and slow form) and I just screw on an extra set of eerrrrr end screws? (don't know how to call them), equalling 0,5 kg per dumbell. :D

That makes me wonder how much you lift doing lateral raises?

nice lookin traps John, and you can still see the veins! what size waist do you get for your jeans?

what size waist do you get for your jeans?Right now I'm wearing my "bulking jeans". They are a 33 inch waist and supposed to be baggy. They are still loose in the waist, but my legs are filling them up.

Here's how I've looked at Christmas time over the past 4 years. :)

You look totally different in that 2002 picture. I would not have said it was you if you hadn't said so.

You look totally different in that 2002 picture. I would not have said it was you if you hadn't said so.Here's another one from that same day (Christmas 2002)

Not only was I overweight, but I was so unhealthy and pasty looking...

*shudder*

"Thumbs up if you want an extra big slice of cake!"

Here's how I've looked at Christmas time over the past 4 years. :)

Great comparison!:bow:

You seem to be alternating, so will 2006 be a smiling year? :)

Here's another one from that same day (Christmas 2002)

Not only was I overweight, but I was so unhealthy and pasty looking...

*shudder*

"Thumbs up if you want an extra big slice of cake!"


Interesting....to me it seems like you weren't happy on the inside in this picture.

Good job John! The progress you've made from Summer to now is just as remarkable as the early ones you've made.

BTW, what move are you quoting in your sig? It's on the tip of my fingers....

Here's how I've looked at Christmas time over the past 4 years. :)
How many people do we know have just grown fatter the last four years and more unhealthy?

Awesome job. :claphigh: :claphigh: :claphigh: :claphigh:

Here's how I've looked at Christmas time over the past 4 years. :)



That's just F' ing unbelievable!!!!!!!!!!! :claplow: :claplow: :claplow:

John,

You were not kidding about finally having some traps. Your neck and shoulders look great--especially compared with year/year.

.

Great comparison!:bow:Thanks BG. I saw that I had a December 2002 and 2003 comparison already up, and then I realized that I had pictures of me doing similar "poses" from December 2004 and 2005 and thought it would be an interesting series of photos. I can't wait to add December 2006! :D


You seem to be alternating, so will 2006 be a smiling year? :)It's a little more complicated than that. I'll have to check my contract. ;)


Interesting....to me it seems like you weren't happy on the inside in this picture.I was miserable with myself. Probably the most unhappy I've ever been in my life, in fact.


BTW, what move are you quoting in your sig? It's on the tip of my fingers....Ah, my current sig quote is from the excellent film "Sin City", co-staring the lovely and talented Jessica Alba.

I think my wife is going to smash my face in if I don't shut up about Jessica. Like it's my fault that my heart skips a beat every time she's on the screen. Sheesh. :rolleyes:


How many people do we know have just grown fatter the last four years and more unhealthy?You want to know something really cool? A lot of people I know have lost fat since I started working out! I was looking through pictures of Christmas 2002 and, with the exception of very ectomorphic Lisa who's always thin, our whole family was fat. Today Lisa's dad has lost 50 pounds, her mom has lost 20 pounds and my mom has lost 20. Kudos to them! :tucool:


That's just F' ing unbelievable!!!!!!!!!!! :claplow: :claplow: :claplow:Those old pictures crack me up now. Back then every time I saw a picture of myself I wanted to cry. I was so unhappy and ashamed of myself.

Thanks man! :madpimp:


You were not kidding about finally having some traps. Your neck and shoulders look great--especially compared with year/year.Thanks! The improvement in those two areas are having a huge effect on the overall look of my upper body. Even with clothes on, my shirts hang so much nicer now. :)

Great workout tonight! I rested all day today, and I'm feeling 100% again.

Tonight I did pretty much the same bicep/tricep superset workout that I started my bulk with, but I changed the bicep/tricep exercise pairings up (except the machine preacher curls/triceps pressdowns - I love that combo!) Here's the workout I'll be doing for the next three weeks:

BICEPS/TRICEPS (Supersets)
4x12 Machine preacher curls/4x12 Tricep cable pressdowns
4x12 Ez-bar curls/4x12 Standing dumbbell tricep extensions
4x12 Hammer curls/4x12 Standing ez-bar french curls


I took some pictures tonight, but I think I've been posting more than enough pictures lately, so I'm not going to bother putting them up.

Sin City.....that's where the quote is from...should have known, I saw it twice.

Been lurking around for a while now. But I am amazed every time I see your comparative photos John.

Excellent display of hard work and can-do attitude! Very inspirational.

SFC

I'm particularly impressed with the photos you've put on the front page today John. Getting away from the stoney-faced front and profile shots makes it seem more real. I don't usually post here, but I had to today.

Excellent progress. It really DOES show what can be done.

As for your question, I am somewhere in between picture 1 and 2. But I didn't start out at picture 1 - I don't drink daily and I don't smoke pot.

-Masher

Great pictures and progress - and really only over three years!

Just out of curiosity, you're getting pretty big and I was wondering what your eventual goals are for size, etc...Are you looking to become a huge meathead (I mean that in the nicest way possible!)? Are you looking to attain Swolecat's level of muscle?

I know this will sound like a strange comment, but looking at your front and side profiles....well you look bulkier...well, you should since you've been bulking :lol: :lol: :lol: But what I mean is, there is a presence to you that wasn't there before. Now it seems totally natural...your being there and as solid as you are. maybe solid is a better word than bulky. You seem very solidly present...like this is all a part of you and this is who you are. It doesn't look "added on"....it just looks real solid. I guess that show the real advantage of bulking after a cut and bulking in a ways that you are packing on muscle. But the muscles seem real integrated into you...that is the solidness I mean. It sort of conveys a calmness.....a relaxedness, like you have no worries, if someone came to attack you, you could well-handle them. Maybe that is a primitive reaction, but I now understand its appeal to women. It yields a physical sense of safety...I always used to go for the tall and lanky type...I have no idea why, these days -- my tastes have completely changed....:lol:

I am sooo jealous of Lisa :) Not only does she have her own great looks and body but she must be really enjoying herself with you.... Got to get me to a gym where there are not so many gay men. They are really great to work-out with...but not so great to go out with..... :lol: :lol: :lol:

(Just in case people take an incorrect PC interpretation to the above remark .... 60% or more of my friends are gay men and women, Baltimore is a strong gay community and I live right in the area and an avid supporter.....:) )

Been lurking around for a while now. But I am amazed every time I see your comparative photos John.

Excellent display of hard work and can-do attitude! Very inspirationalThanks very much. You mentioned "can-do attitude". I think a lot of people overlook the importance of that facet of their transformations. Too many people think, "I can't do that" when they should be thinking "I KNOW I can do that!"


I'm particularly impressed with the photos you've put on the front page today John. Getting away from the stoney-faced front and profile shots makes it seem more real. I don't usually post here, but I had to today.

Excellent progress. It really DOES show what can be done.
Thanks Masher. I've found that a single photo can be motivational, but people really seem to respond much more strongly to a series of progress photos. I know I do. I think a series of photos can make the transformation much more tangible and real, and does a good job of illustrating that we all had to start from somewhere. There are no magic bullets: real progress takes time, effort and long-term dedication.


Just out of curiosity, you're getting pretty big and I was wondering what your eventual goals are for size, etc...Are you looking to become a huge meathead (I mean that in the nicest way possible!)? Are you looking to attain Swolecat's level of muscle?No, not at all. I'll probably do one more bulk. I'd like to have around 18 inch arms (cold), and about a 45 inch chest. I'd like bigger lats and delts, too.


I know this will sound like a strange commentNot coming from you, dear. :)

It sort of conveys a calmness.....a relaxedness, like you have no worries, if someone came to attack you, you could well-handle them. Maybe that is a primitive reaction, but I now understand its appeal to women. It yields a physical sense of safety...All these muscles, yet you still scare the living shit out of me.

:moon: :lol:

I'm kidding! You walked into that one. :D

Thanks for the unbelievably kind words. I'm totally :o :o :o right now and don't know what to say!

I am sooo jealous of Lisa Not only does she have her own great looks and body but she must be really enjoying herself with you.... :eek: :lol:

Justitia! Don't make his head bulk.. :p

Ah, my current sig quote is from the excellent film "Sin City", co-staring the lovely and talented Jessica Alba.


I did a Google search for that quote and this thread is ranked before IMDB's "Memorable quotes from Sin City" page.

Anyway, it's been maybe a year since I kept up with this site last and wow, John, your progress has been quite impressive. After a senior year of intense school work and little workout time, I got serious again about my fitness this fall. Although I can't really do much lifting because I can't afford a gym membership or get access to weights, I'm running for the first time in my life (as opposed to elliptical machines). Gotta get a thread started soon.

Best for a happy Christmas and New Year's. Keep it up.

All I gotta say is that if one (JOHN) wasn't doing something right and wasn't making extremely fantastic progress, this very long thread wouldn't exist. So, it's safe to say you are doing something right, so just keep on doing it no matter what the comments/speculation are regarding genetics and such.

In the end, how you look w/your clothes off is what seperates the real men from the pretenders. I think you already know what side you are on John.

:tu:

~SC~

In the end, how you look w/your clothes off is what seperates the real men from the pretenders.

That may be the most shallow, vainglorious statement I have ever read...and from someone I respect?
How completely vacuous.

That may be the most shallow, vainglorious statement I have ever read...and from someone I respect?
How completely vacuous.Whoa, hold on man - I think SC was referring to me and others like me who weight train for mostly cosmetic reasons (i.e. body builders). Our reflection in the mirror really is the biggest measure of our success.

Why is everyone so touchy these days?

I think my journal could use a break from controversy. :)

I did a Google search for that quote and this thread is ranked before IMDB's "Memorable quotes from Sin City" page.Hey that's cool! I wonder if Jessica Alba will see this thread one day?!?!

Lisa just smacked the crap out of me. :spank:

Anyway, it's been maybe a year since I kept up with this site last and wow, John, your progress has been quite impressive. After a senior year of intense school work and little workout time, I got serious again about my fitness this fall. Although I can't really do much lifting because I can't afford a gym membership or get access to weights, I'm running for the first time in my life (as opposed to elliptical machines). Gotta get a thread started soon.Thanks for the complements. Even if you can't afford a gym membership, if you want to lift weights maybe you could get some dumbbells and combine some DB work with body weight exercises? I don't have much experience with BW exercises, but I think Jeremy Likness and some others have had good success with them.

In any case, good luck to you!


Best for a happy Christmas and New Year's. Keep it up.Same to ya. :)

John, great progress - your shoulders and traps are looking especially crazy with this bulking cycle!! :tucool:

John, great progress - your shoulders and traps are looking especially crazy with this bulking cycle!! :tucool:Thanks man! I've been working so hard on those areas. Also, because I have neglected those areas in the past, I'm seeing some good "newbie" gains. :)

Whoa, hold on man - I think SC was referring to me and others like me who weight train for mostly cosmetic reasons (i.e. body builders). Our reflection in the mirror really is the biggest measure of our success.

Why is everyone so touchy these days?

I think my journal could use a break from controversy. :)

Maybe, I mean, we all lift weights to look better, and judging our appearance in the mirror is what motivates "us."

However, SCs statement reeks of closed door, secret handshake, frat-boy BS. I think he is a great guy, but that is just dumb. I bet there are millions of scientists, professors, hell doctors and nurses that can't deadlift 2x their body weight that are pretty pleased with the accomplishments they have managed.

I won't harp on this, but if you can infer something from that statement (SCs) then I can understand it from MY point of view.

I think what separates real men from the pretenders is a sense of humility and quite frankly I'm not seeing it there.

Whoa, hold on man - I think SC was referring to me and others like me who weight train for mostly cosmetic reasons (i.e. body builders). Our reflection in the mirror really is the biggest measure of our success.

Why is everyone so touchy these days?

I think my journal could use a break from controversy. :)


#1) I agree. The mirror is ALL I care about.:whistle:
#2) I'm not touchy.:D
#3) Close chance!!!!!!:lol:

Back on-topic..

John, can I ask you a question about this?
BICEPS/TRICEPS (Supersets)
4x12 Machine preacher curls/4x12 Tricep cable pressdowns
4x12 Ez-bar curls/4x12 Standing dumbbell tricep extensions
4x12 Hammer curls/4x12 Standing ez-bar french curls

Unless I'm mistaken you are doing 3 exercises which hit the triceps there, a total of 12 sets. I always thought this was too much for the arm muscles which I've read should be trained less (in terms of the weight/volume forumla) than larger body groups such as the back or chest. However, I understand with the muscle mass you have there this may no longer be a consideration for you. :)

Do you think that this amount of sets is only something you should do with significant muscle mass? :)

Thanks!
Rich

I did a Google search for that quote and this thread is ranked before IMDB's "Memorable quotes from Sin City" page.

Anyway, it's been maybe a year since I kept up with this site last and wow, John, your progress has been quite impressive. After a senior year of intense school work and little workout time, I got serious again about my fitness this fall. Although I can't really do much lifting because I can't afford a gym membership or get access to weights, I'm running for the first time in my life (as opposed to elliptical machines). Gotta get a thread started soon.

Best for a happy Christmas and New Year's. Keep it up.

bodyweight exercises are awesome...bout a few weeks ago, i was bench pressing 135 for 3-4 reps...then i did nothing but pushups, dips, pull ups, situps, and bodyweight squats for the next 2-3 weeks and today I came back to the gym and was bench pressing 155 for 2-3 reps. So they do work.

Maybe, I mean, we all lift weights to look better, and judging our appearance in the mirror is what motivates "us."I disagree. Lots of people who lift weights are doing it for completely non-aesthetic reasons: power lifters, people who train with weights as an adjunct to improve performance in other sports, etc.

However, SCs statement reeks of closed door, secret handshake, frat-boy BS. I think he is a great guy, but that is just dumb. I bet there are millions of scientists, professors, hell doctors and nurses that can't deadlift 2x their body weight that are pretty pleased with the accomplishments they have managed.I know SC pretty well, and I really don't think he meant anything disparaging to any of those groups of people. He was speaking as a bodybuilder to a bodybuilder, with our common, specific goals in mind.

I won't harp on thisHeh, too late. Can open. Worms everywhere.

but if you can infer something from that statement (SCs) then I can understand it from MY point of view.Exactly. SwoleCat directed that statement to me. You're taking a statement that was not intended for you and coloring it with your own personal point of view. That alters the meaning of his words.

I think what separates real men from the pretenders is a sense of humility.That's a nice sentiment, but not in bodybuilding it doesn't; muscles do. Bodybuilding, by definition, is vain. That doesn't mean bodybuilders can't be humble and very giving in the other areas of their lives - I certainly try to be - but when it comes to hitting the weights hard just to look good? Let's be honest, there's nothing humble about that particular activity.

Unless I'm mistaken you are doing 3 exercises which hit the triceps there, a total of 12 sets. I always thought this was too much for the arm muscles which I've read should be trained less (in terms of the weight/volume forumla) than larger body groups such as the back or chest.It's all about what works best for you. There are general rules, such as the one you just mentioned, but everyone is different. My arms grow and respond very well to high volume training. Yours may or may not. There's only one way to find out, and it's not in a book. ;)

I disagree. Lots of people who lift weights are doing it for completely non-aesthetic reasons: power lifters, people who train with weights as an adjunct to improve performance in other sports, etc.

You can disagree, hell you can make yourself right, It LITERALLY is YOUR WORLD! :lol: However, can we infer then that you are lifting weights strictly for aesthetic reasons? Whose definition of beauty are we using? His, yours, mine. Tell you what you lift for your reasons and I'll lift for mine -- mine has nothing to do with separating men from pretenders. EDIT: Wait that makes really no um, er, sense at all.....sh*t!

I know SC pretty well, and I really don't think he meant anything disparaging to any of those groups of people. He was speaking as a bodybuilder to a bodybuilder, with our common, specific goals in mind.

You're looking to break into Hollywood as well? :confused: Well, you already have the name, now if you could only get those guns to 19" cold!

Heh, too late. Can open. Worms everywhere. Well you can't fish if you don't put the hook in the water I guess.

Exactly. SwoleCat directed that statement to me. You're taking a statement that was not intended for you and coloring it with your own personal point of view. That alters the meaning of his words. Then perhaps a public forum is not the best place in the world to have a private conversation with you?

That's a nice sentiment, but not in bodybuilding it doesn't; muscles do. Bodybuilding, by definition, is vain. That doesn't mean bodybuilders can't be humble and very giving in the other areas of their lives - I certainly try to be - but when it comes to hitting the weights hard just to look good? Let's be honest, there's nothing humble about that particular activity. Ok, lets be honest. I honestly think SC misspoke. I think his statement was rude and exclusionary in nature. Whether it was intended for aspiring bodybuilders, trumpet players or the bus drivers of this world does not change the fact that I think it shows a serious macho unoriginality.

Am I overreacting? Probably. Is arguing on the internet REALLY all that smart? Nope.

I guess that is it.

Ok. Thanks for that John. I've noticed that the people here who've worked out for a few years and made big changes seem much more relaxed about the whole process. Treating it as more of an organic process (which it is) than a dry scientific method.

Cheers!
:cool:

You can disagree, hell you can make yourself right, It LITERALLY is YOUR WORLD! I have no interest in "making myself right", I'm just discussing this with you.

At this point I think we are firmly in "agree to disagree" territory. No hard feelings on this side. I appreciate your point of view.

I've said my piece, but everyone better stock up on water; I have a feeling hurricane SwoleCat is coming. ;)

I'm sooooo glad i'm not involved with this.:whistle:

I'm sooooo glad i'm not involved with this.:whistle:
ya, Goat-cheese has been starting fights with everyone today. :confused:
I think today is global PMS* day for all of us - maybe tomorrow will be better :)


*PMS = Pissed_off Male Syndrome

I have no interest in "making myself right", I'm just discussing this with you.

I know that is why I put the smilie face. Isn't that International Forumese for "I kid I kid?" :D


but everyone better stock up on water; I have a feeling hurricane SwoleCat is coming.

Perhaps this 'Swolecat' that you mention would like to have a mature exchange of ideas regarding the study of semasiology with me? How wonderful.

:):)

I think today is global PMS day for all of us - maybe tomorrow will be better :)Careful, your "PMS" remark is bound to offend someone.

EDIT: Nice edit, wh0

ya, Goat-cheese has been starting fights with everyone today. :confused:
I think today is global PMS day for all of us - maybe tomorrow will be better :)

Yeah, it's these damn Mondays!!!!!! Tomorrow will be better.:tucool:

Perhaps this 'Swolecat' that you mention would like to have a mature exchange of ideas regarding the study of semasiology with me? How wonderful.Perhaps, but I think he's going to opt for a goat-cheese omelette instead. :D

I am going to follow your regiment as close as i can. Your results are insane. Honestly I think i have been working out too much. I have been doing a half hour of cardio a day 4 days a week and an hour on the weights 4 days a week. I have been told this is too much. Honestly i have began to cut up but have'nt lost any body fat. It's very discouraging. What could i be doing wrong. Oh and i have only been at it for 3 weeks now. I was at 18% body fat 3 weeks ago and i still am (I have'nt been following your procedures, but good ones in my opinion low fat high protein+exercize).

I am going to follow your regiment as close as i can. Your results are insane. Honestly I think i have been working out too much. I have been doing a half hour of cardio a day 4 days a week and an hour on the weights 4 days a week. I have been told this is too much. Honestly i have began to cut up but have'nt lost any body fat. It's very discouraging. What could i be doing wrong. Oh and i have only been at it for 3 weeks now. I was at 18% body fat 3 weeks ago and i still am (I have'nt been following your procedures, but good ones in my opinion low fat high protein+exercize).

Be careful about following one particular person's regimen identically -- What works for some will be a dismal failure for others ... we each respond to things differently...so be sure to experiment and find out what works best for you.

BTW John, I've been noticing that your delts are looking really good. Big delts make the whole arm look bigger (IMO) -- A nice addition to those new 17 inch guns :tu:

P.S. I may not yet be out of the pretender category, but I did save a lot of money on my car insurance by switching to Geico. (Sorry, I couldn't resist) :lol:

John, looking at your comparison pictures over the years is a real inspiration to me. We're about the same height and age, and it's great to see those kinds of results.

You've also broken the mindset I've always had about "getting too big". I went into this thinking I would cut and then stay where I was, because I like being on the thin side, when I can get there. However, you've packed on the muscle, and I have to say that I've really been inspired to go through a bulk after this cutting phase is over, because your pictures made me see that being really muscular doesn't mean musclebound or overweight.

Thanks! :tu:

Hey John,

Sorry for repeating a question you may have intentionally left unanswered, but I'm still wondering how much weight you use for your lateral raises? :D

Be careful about following one particular person's regimen identically -- What works for some will be a dismal failure for others ... we each respond to things differently...so be sure to experiment and find out what works best for you. Exactly. Besides, I'm doing SUP2, so he can't know what I'm doing because I don't discuss that information with anyone but SC and other SC clients.

BTW John, I've been noticing that your delts are looking really good. Big delts make the whole arm look bigger (IMO) -- A nice addition to those new 17 inch guns :tu:Thanks! I don't think I realized how important a good pair of shoulder really are until recently. I don't care how big your arms are; if your shoulders are not up to par, it just looks silly. I'm playing catch-up right now, but I'm pleased with my progress. I really enjoy working my delts.


John, looking at your comparison pictures over the years is a real inspiration to me. We're about the same height and age, and it's great to see those kinds of results.
Thanks xingcat. :cool:

You've also broken the mindset I've always had about "getting too big". I went into this thinking I would cut and then stay where I was, because I like being on the thin side, when I can get there. However, you've packed on the muscle, and I have to say that I've really been inspired to go through a bulk after this cutting phase is over, because your pictures made me see that being really muscular doesn't mean musclebound or overweight.When I was overweight I thought I'd just want to lose weight - being skinny sounded great to me. Funny how things change, isn't it? :lol:

For example, I used to think Stallone looked HUGE in the Rocky movies; now that I'm watching the films again for the first time in three years, I still think he looks great, but he's really not all that big (around two hundred pounds and shredded to the bone).


Sorry for repeating a question you may have intentionally left unanswered, but I'm still wondering how much weight you use for your lateral raises?:nono: http://www.johnstonefitness.com/php/faq.php#0090

:D

John: I've released my current pics in the Private Media Gallery and doordude said he wants us to hold a JSF kick-boxing tournament- winner fights wh0 :lol: :tucool:

My dumbbell rack is here! It was a breeze to put it together. It was not a breeze moving all the dumbbells around. :flex:

The 90s and 100s wouldn't fit. I knew they wouldn't, and it's really no big deal. I'll probably pick up another rack for the corner to hold those plus my 110s and 120s.

I also took a picture of my plate tree for good measure, since I don't have one on my home gym page.

My dumbbell rack is here! It was a breeze to put it together. It was not a breeze moving all the dumbbells around. :flex:

I took some quick photos. I probably won't use these to update my home gym page, and will take some better ones later.

The 90s and 100s wouldn't fit. I knew they wouldn't, and it's really no big deal. I'll probably pick up another rack for the corner to hold those plus my 110s and 120s.

I also took a picture of my plate tree for good measure, since I don't have one on my home gym page.

Nice rack :tucool:

Now let's get a movie of you beating the hell out of that punching bag:bb:

John: I've released my current pics in the Private Media Gallery and doordude said he wants us to hold a JSF kick-boxing tournament- winner fights wh0 :lol: :tucool:


Lets not get crazy now. I said no such thing BUT since you mentioned it...........i'm sure you're familiar with the old saying "the bigger they are, the harder they fall". Havin' an old man like me give you a :spank: could REALLY damage your ego.:whistle: .................:D

Lets not get crazy now. I said no such thing BUT since you mentioned it...........i'm sure you're familiar with the old saying "the bigger they are, the harder they fall". Havin' an old man like me give you a :spank: could REALLY damage your ego.:whistle: .................:D

:lol: :lol: I just wanted another excuse to pick on wh0 :P

My dumbbell rack is here! It was a breeze to put it together. It was not a breeze moving all the dumbbells around. :flex:

I took some quick photos. I probably won't use these to update my home gym page, and will take some better ones later.

The 90s and 100s wouldn't fit. I knew they wouldn't, and it's really no big deal. I'll probably pick up another rack for the corner to hold those plus my 110s and 120s.

I also took a picture of my plate tree for good measure, since I don't have one on my home gym page.
You have a sick home gym, my god. I wish I had a place to put all that. I'd get one like yours in a second.

Question: Does the titan have low cables too? How does the motion of the cables compare to that of a cable machine you'd find at your gym? Is it as fluid and offer a similar feeling of resistance?

Question: Does the titan have low cables too?Yes, there are dual-low cables at the front of the machine, and single low pulley at the back of the machine which is useful for one-arm cable work and leg abduction exercises (if those are your bag).

How does the motion of the cables compare to that of a cable machine you'd find at your gym? Is it as fluid and offer a similar feeling of resistance?It's been a long time since I've been in a commercial gym, so I can't honestly answer that question. I can tell you the the motion of all the cables/pulleys is 100% smooth and the resistance is very even through the entire ROM. I love how they feel.

leg abduction exercises (if those are your bag).


Are you saying I'm girly for doing abduction/adduction? :p When I'm done with my butt blasters I will proceed to cry because you hurt my feelings.

In all seriousness, my cardio today will either be some Jazzercise or Dick Simmons' "Sweatin' to the Oldies". :claphigh:

Are you saying I'm girly for doing abduction/adduction? :p When I'm done with my butt blasters I will proceed to cry because you hurt my feelings.I said no such thing. :D :whistle:

Took another picture, and updated my home gym page with all the new photos and descriptions: http://www.johnstonefitness.com/php/homegym.php

These are some other accessories I use all the time. From top, left: wrist wrap, weighted heavy bag training gloves, a couple of Olympic barbells, an EZ-Curl bar, two Captains of Crush grippers (http://www.johnstonefitness.com/store/shop.php?c=sports&n=3375301&k=captains+of+crush&s=sr&p=1&x=SportingGoods), MyoTape and Fat Track digital calipers (http://www.johnstonefitness.com/store/shop.php?c=sports&n=3375301&i=B0002J9OBK&x=Accumeasure_FAT_TRACK_GOLD_Digital_Fat_Meter_and _Myotape_Body_Measurer), a Grizzly Leather Dipping Belt (http://www.johnstonefitness.com/store/shop.php?c=sports&n=3375301&i=B00021Z8EA&x=Dipping_Belt_Leather), a set of Dumbbell Power Hooks (http://www.johnstonefitness.com/store/shop.php?c=sports&n=3375301&i=B0008NPT2I&x=Power_Hooks_Dumbbell_Power_Hooks_Free_Weights_Ba rs) and a pair of Lifting Straps (http://www.johnstonefitness.com/store/shop.php?c=sports&n=3375301&i=B0002EZB3A&x=Cotton_Lifting_Straps).

I said no such thing. :D :whistle:

Wait--I'm not done firming and toning my trouble areas yet!!! :(

My favorite was awhile back when Rtestes mentioned a machine at the gym being 'for the ladies'.

It's a good thing some of us have a thick skin because I use all of the machines in the gym and I'll even use those colored dumbells :lol:

Took another picture, and updated my home gym page with all the new photos and descriptions: http://www.johnstonefitness.com/php/homegym.php

These are some other accessories I use all the time. From top, left: wrist wrap, weighted heavy bag training gloves, a couple of Olympic barbells, an EZ-Curl bar, two Captains of Crush grippers (http://www.johnstonefitness.com/store/shop.php?c=sports&n=3375301&k=captains+of+crush&s=sr&p=1&x=SportingGoods), MyoTape and Fat Track digital calipers (http://www.johnstonefitness.com/store/shop.php?c=sports&n=3375301&i=B0002J9OBK&x=Accumeasure_FAT_TRACK_GOLD_Digital_Fat_Meter_and _Myotape_Body_Measurer), a Grizzly Leather Dipping Belt (http://www.johnstonefitness.com/store/shop.php?c=sports&n=3375301&i=B00021Z8EA&x=Dipping_Belt_Leather), a set of Dumbbell Power Hooks (http://www.johnstonefitness.com/store/shop.php?c=sports&n=3375301&i=B0008NPT2I&x=Power_Hooks_Dumbbell_Power_Hooks_Free_Weights_Ba rs) and a pair of Lifting Straps (http://www.johnstonefitness.com/store/shop.php?c=sports&n=3375301&i=B0002EZB3A&x=Cotton_Lifting_Straps).
Nice amazon store you've got there. How long have you been set up with that?

I knew it....look how shiny and new that stuff is....like it's never been used. Who is this muscle-bound imposter and what have you done with the real (and smaller)....John Stone ;)


(you take really good care of your stuff!)

It must take longer to dust and clean your equipment than your workout itself!

My dumbbell rack is here! It was a breeze to put it together. It was not a breeze moving all the dumbbells around. :flex:

The 90s and 100s wouldn't fit. I knew they wouldn't, and it's really no big deal. I'll probably pick up another rack for the corner to hold those plus my 110s and 120s.

I also took a picture of my plate tree for good measure, since I don't have one on my home gym page.
:D Will you be my father? And, if so, when can I move in?

It must take longer to dust and clean your equipment than your workout itself!
Loki must lick all the equipment between sets.

:nono: http://www.johnstonefitness.com/php/faq.php#0090


No fair! Since when are lateral dumbell raises show-exercises?! I thought it would be a safe area to tread, but I can imagine why you wouldn't. :D

I was just wondering because of the amount of weight you mentioned adding. I you pm me the amount I won't tell a soul! ;)

As those of you who read my journal may recall, last week's back workout was awesome. I knew I had to do even better this week, and I'm very proud of myself because I rose to the challenge and improved on every single exercise.

First was seated cable rows, and I added 5 pounds to what I did last week and did the same number of reps as last week except for the last set. On the last set I broke form on the last rep, so I didn't count it.

Next I did lat pulldowns, and added 5 pounds to what I did last week. I manged 4 sets of 12/12/11/10 with perfect form, so I'll be moving up again next week.

Next was the big one: deadlifts. I knew this week was going to be a real challenge. I've been moving up at a rate of 10 pounds per week for many, many weeks now, and last week they were pretty damn tough. Still, I added the 10 pounds and nailed 4 sets of 8. I'll be adding 10 more pounds next week {gulp}.

At this point in my workout I was hurting pretty bad (just like last week), but I manged to pump out 4 sets of 10 DB rows with 5 more pounds than last week.

After my back work, I was so tired that I really wanted to stop, but I'm always going on and on about self-control and discipline. One thing I can't stand is a hypocrite, so I did 4 sets of barbell shrugs with 10 more pounds than last week, and I even did more reps.

That was probably the toughest workout I've ever put myself through. I'm really glad I did it. Next week I'll do even better.

I took a couple of pictures. Actually, I took a couple and Lisa took one of me doing deadlifts! She likes to watch me deadlift, and today she grabbed the camera and took a picture of me in action.

It's funny, I've been with Lisa for 16 years, and I still like to show off for her. When she watches me lift, I get a real boost knowing she's watching me. I think the last two sets felt easier than the first two just because she was there cheering me on. :D

OK, first picture is a back progress shot. Second picture shows my ridiculous calluses. I swear, the calluses have become so thick that I could hammer nails with them. The last shot is the picture Lisa took of me deadlifting. Just look at my face. :lol:

You don't turn one palm face out on deadlifts? :confused:

Anywho, is that 3 plates I see on each side? Well, at the minimum. Quite impressive. I'm curious how significant of an increase in weight you're lifting these days vs. the late 2003 days when you were "too skinny".

You don't turn one palm face out on deadlifts? :confused:
For a deadlift, double overhand is always the most preferable grip; a mixed grip is used when you don't have straps but need to go heavier than your overhand allows. When you have straps, you should lift double overhand. It's never recommended to work double underhand; any underhand (even in a mixed) places a lot of extra stress on the bicep and is dangerous to use at high weights (500+) as it makes you much more prone to a tear.

You don't turn one palm face out on deadlifts? :confused: I do use an alternating grip when I DL without lifting straps, but with the straps I've found that a overhand grip works best (much easier to turn the bar and tighten the straps).

Anywho, is that 3 plates I see on each side? I've only got four 45-pound plates. The 35-pound plates are smaller and don't show.

Yes, I'm being purposefully vague and obstinate. ;)

I'm curious how significant of an increase in weight you're lifting these days vs. the late 2003 days when you were "too skinny".Huge. No comparison. :)

Invest in a couple of liftinggloves and spare your hands!:tucool:

Invest in a couple of liftinggloves and spare your hands!:tucool:I have lifting gloves, but I stopped wearing them several months ago. I wasn't complaining, I like calluses.

ok,:neener: What's good about having calluses? just wonder:confused: :D

ok,:neener: What good about having calluses? just wonder:confused: :DI think calluses add character. They serve as a constant reminder that I'm no longer a soft and sedate desk-jockey.

As someone earlier in this thread said, they are "hard earned badges of honor". :)

What can I say? I just like having 'em. :flex:

I have lifting gloves, but I stopped wearing them several months ago. I wasn't complaining, I like calluses.

i'm sure lisa does not like them :D

I think calluses add character. They serve as a constant reminder that I'm no longer a soft and sedate desk-jockey.

As someone earlier in this thread said, they are "hard earned badges of honor". :)

What can I say? I just like having 'em. :flex:

You have a point there :)
But they hurt like hell when lifting, especially dumbell curls:p

You have a point there :)
But they hurt like hell when lifting, especially dumbell curls:p

Pain is the name of the game. No one said it would be easy. If it was, everyone would be fit.

Pain is the name of the game. No one said it would be easy. If it was, everyone would be fit.
True, but I don't think using gloves or not is any representation of how fit someone is.

There was a time I didn't use gloves, but that was years ago. I find using them helps keep my hands a little smoother (although I do still get calluses) and prevents me from directly touching the same bar/dumbbell a 100 other people just touched that who knows where their hands've been.

For a deadlift, double overhand is always the most preferable grip; a mixed grip is used when you don't have straps but need to go heavier than your overhand allows. When you have straps, you should lift double overhand. It's never recommended to work double underhand; any underhand (even in a mixed) places a lot of extra stress on the bicep and is dangerous to use at high weights (500+) as it makes you much more prone to a tear.
Yeah, I didn't even notice the fact that he was wearing straps.

I do my stiff leg deadlifts with both palms facing me but since I don't use straps, I do deadlifts with one palm out. I've actually never seen someone do both palms in before until John's picture.

True, but I don't think using gloves or not is any representation of how fit someone is.

Nor do I.. was just saying.

You can occassionally sand the calluses down. Most powerlifters will either take a razor (straight blade) to them and shave them off or break out the rough grit sandpaper and sand them down so your lady doesn't complain too much ;)

ok,:neener: What's good about having calluses? just wonder:confused: :D

chicks dig it.

ok,:neener: What's good about having calluses? just wonder:confused: :D

I'm sure it's just a morbid obsession....i'm the same way :tu:
Besides, I love the feeling of the cold steel in my hands....you just don't get the same feeling with the gloves :nono:

John, first off the Deads look good!

Take off your ring bro, you're going to trash it.

How's that grip coming? Thick Bar holds for time is what helped mine for the deads. Hope this helps.

Timber

chicks dig it.

Nah, chicks dig the long ball!


end of hijack

Take off your ring bro, you're going to trash it.

Maybe he doesn't want to :nope:

My dad hasn't taken his off ever.. its been there since my mom put it on at their wedding.. almost 25 years ago. He said if he wanted to take it off, they would have to cut it since his fingers have grown a lot since then :lol:

I use gloves for one thing:
Not feeling the weights slip in my sweaty hands when holding them over my body with my weakening arms :D :bb:

Hey John, i just noticed the heavy bag in your gym. Is this a new addition? Im curious as to how you incorporate heavy bag training with your current routine (if at all)? I'm getting a heavy bag for christmas and am still trying to decide on how to add it to my current weight routine.

Or maybe you just need something to pound on after taking on those massive deads? ;)

Eh I'm bad with calluses. I have played competitive tennis since i was in my early teens, and now being 19 with the addition of weight training, my calluses on my right hand were sometimes obsurd. Completely across each finger, and i swear, no less than a 3/4CM tall.


I have since acquired the habbit of picking at them, which seems no better =/


Thanks for double-overhand w/ grips comment. I will need to put that into effect on the rare occassions i use grips.


John, progress update on the Titan review? =]



Edit: Have you ever come close/had to replace any of the mirrors in your room (via destroying them with a barbell or dumbell)? I don't have mirrors, but with 2 barbells to move around for different exercises i think i push the limits of my space quite handily






One last question actually. Is there a way to add a drop-down menu with the smilies to the "Quick Reply" box? There is Bold/Italics/Underline/Hyperlink/Image and of course quote.

Maybe? Totally cool if not, just figured I'd ask, because I feel myself and several others use the quick reply almost exclusively.

Edit: Have you ever come close/had to replace any of the mirrors in your room (via destroying them with a barbell or dumbell)?
I don't think John has destroyed any mirrors while working out, but I know this guy who destroyed his fish tank while doing barbell curls. :lol:

John, first off the Deads look good!Thanks - they're coming right along!

Take off your ring bro, you're going to trash it.I never take the ring off. Sure, the ring has scars, but I find them metaphoric.

How's that grip coming? Thick Bar holds for time is what helped mine for the deads. Hope this helps.The CoC grippers I bought are already making a difference. The trainer gripper I can do for reps (they are still tough!) - I use those to warm up. I could close the #1 when I first got it, but just once and just barely. Now I'm doing the #1 for reps. I know the CoC grippers are mostly for crushing grip, but it will help my supporting gripping strength, too. Another item I think I'm going to get that will help my my supporting grip strength is the Rolling Thunder Revolving Deadlift Handle (http://www6.mailordercentral.com/ironmind/prodinfo.asp?number=1246). The handle is 2-3/8" in diameter and should be great for one-hand deads and holds.


Hey John, i just noticed the heavy bag in your gym. Is this a new addition? Im curious as to how you incorporate heavy bag training with your current routine (if at all)?It's fairly new, I got it a couple months ago. I mainly use it for stress relief. I don't do any formal training with it or incorporate it into my fitness program.


John, progress update on the Titan review? =] :o I've been real busy, holidays and all. I know it's taking forever.

Here's a short review to tide you over: Buy it. :)


Edit: Have you ever come close/had to replace any of the mirrors in your room (via destroying them with a barbell or dumbell)?Nope, never. I try not to throw my dumbbells at the mirrors. ;)


One last question actually. Is there a way to add a drop-down menu with the smilies to the "Quick Reply" box?Quick reply is for experts. :nono: Experts have smilie codes memorized. :D

Nope, never. I try not to throw my dumbbells at the mirrors. ;)

Oh common.. where's the fun in that!? :neener:

Maybe he doesn't want to :nope:

My dad hasn't taken his off ever.. its been there since my mom put it on at their wedding.. almost 25 years ago. He said if he wanted to take it off, they would have to cut it since his fingers have grown a lot since then :lol:




Just a suggestion man :rolleyes: ....my father in law didn't want to take his off either, the ladder he was on took it off for him as well as his finger.

I lost my wedding ring snorkling in Mexico....yeah, ...not like lifting..like I said just a suggestion:tu:

someone should get rid of that rolleyes smiley

someone should get rid of that rolleyes smiley
:rolleyes:

P.S. - I don't lift with gloves either. I like getting the calluses...don't know why exactly...

:rolleyes: :nope: :gl:

Sorry door, I had to:tu:

Gather 'round, children -- it's time once again for Uncle Jay's "John Stone Picture Thread Hijacking." Today we'll be looking at updated images of Mr. Stone's back-double-bicep pose compared to previous incarnations, as well as compared to a special guest.

First, the updated image compared to himself:

http://www.jaypaulsimon.com/p/stone-back-comparo-1205.jpg

Excellent stuff.

Second, let's take an updated look at Mr. Stone compared to the Abdominator himself, Mr. Skippy Podar!

http://www.jaypaulsimon.com/p/skip-stone-back-comparo-1205.jpg

Not too shabby! Of course, Skip may look nothing like that these days -- other than carrying his light-as-a-feather bride across a threshold or two, he's probably not doing much lifting as a newly married fellow. :D

Stay tuned for more thread hijacking as updated photos permit! :tu:

:eek: John - you already know this - but your rear delts and traps have practically tripled in size since August. Insane.

And your erector spinaes look like pythons.

:bow:

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Skipster vs Stoner? :D

haha.. I like todays update. I wouldnt have the patients for something like that. I'd most likely leave and goto McDonalds if I had to. :bang:

j.simon, Thanks for the update on... well, my back! :lol:

I'm proud of myself because I've made a lot of progress since you first embarrassed me back in late August with a set of back comparison shots.

Although Skip's back development is still light years away from mine, at least now I'm in the same galaxy. I'm only halfway through my bulk, so six weeks from now I will have made even more improvement. By this time next year, I think I may even be approaching the outskirts of Skip's solar system. :D


:eek: John - you already know this - but your rear delts and traps have practically tripled in size since August. Insane.

And your erector spinaes look like pythons.I have to admit, I'm pretty astonished by the speed with which my rear delts have grown. I started working them for the first time in September, and they have really responded to the training incredibly well! Thanks for the comments. :)


haha.. I like todays update. I wouldnt have the patients for something like that. I'd most likely leave and goto McDonalds if I had to. :bang:Glad you liked it. At least something good came out of the meal - I had something new to talk about this morning for my update. BTW, we're discussing it here (http://forums.johnstonefitness.com/showthread.php?t=23600).

I'm proud of myself because I've made a lot of progress since you first embarrassed me back in late August with a set of back comparison shots.
No, no, no -- it's called motivation. :nod: Embarassment would be what I would suffer were I ever dumb enough to post a comparison of my back against either you or Skipster.

Frankly, I think Skip's just more lean than you are in his photo (and again, I don't know what time frame his photo is from -- for all I know, he's twice that size right now or something). I think the fun comparo will be after your next cut. :tu:

Also, there's no scale, so it's hard to compare.

Frankly, I think Skip's just more lean than you are in his photo (and again, I don't know what time frame his photo is from -- for all I know, he's twice that size right now or something). I think the fun comparo will be after your next cut. :tu:

No, no, no -- it's called motivation. :nod: Embarassment would be what I would suffer were I ever dumb enough to post a comparison of my back against either you or Skipster.

Frankly, I think Skip's just more lean than you are in his photo (and again, I don't know what time frame his photo is from -- for all I know, he's twice that size right now or something). I think the fun comparo will be after your next cut. :tu:



Hehehe... thanks for the accolades J.Simon!

Yes, John is definitely improving. I showed my wife John's comparison pics from when he first started training in late 2002 and how he looks today and she was amazed. People don't realize how much control they have over their physique. The biggest problem for most of us is that life's little distractions can get in the way of taking care of ourselves. As they say, "Rome wasn't built in a day, but then again... neither was the City Dump." We are a product of our habits, and in order to effectively make a POSITIVE change, you have to have POSITIVE habits. John has many positive habits, and hence he has developed an outstanding physique.

Regarding the comparison shots, John is taller than I am, and about 30-40 lbs. heavier. One day soon though (hopefully in March), Kandra and I are going to drive down to Orlando, and hopefully John will let me do a guest posedown with him at his gym. Now THAT would be cool. :) As long as you guys don't sell the autographed photos on EBay. :)

John, everytime I see your pictures, I well up with pride in your accomplishments. I guess you can say we've mutually inspired each other over the years, and for that I will be eternally grateful. :)

I know I've said this before, but your website and forum have inspired more people than you can imagine. So no matter how many haters you might get from time to time, always remember that by your example, you've changed a lot of peoples lives. I never envisioned that I would be a role model for anyone, seeing as I started off so skinny and was picked on as a kid. But sometimes the challenges of our youth is what makes the testimony in our victory so great. Isn't God good? :D

Give Lisa a big hug for us, and I'll contact you soon about a Spring visit! :)

- Skip "Psalm 139:14 - 'I praise you God because I am fearfully and wonderfully made." :)

Can we get Don King, or his cheaper, more affordable, bodybuilding counterpart in here to give this posedown the hype it deserves?

Regarding the comparison shots, John is taller than I am, and about 30-40 lbs. heavier. One day soon though (hopefully in March), Kandra and I are going to drive down to Orlando, and hopefully John will let me do a guest posedown with him at his gym. Now THAT would be cool. :) As long as you guys don't sell the autographed photos on EBay. :)March?! No way, man - I'll still be cutting! :) We can workout together before I finish cutting, but no posing - especially standing next to you - until I'm at a decent body fat level. :D

Give me until sometime in May and you're on!


John, everytime I see your pictures, I well up with pride in your accomplishments. I guess you can say we've mutually inspired each other over the years, and for that I will be eternally grateful. :)I'm speechless. Thank you, Skip. :)

Give Lisa a big hug for us, and I'll contact you soon about a Spring visit! :)BTW, now that I have my new DB rack I no longer have no room for my elliptical. If you still want it, it's yours for the taking. Come get it anytime - give me a call or PM me and we'll work out the details.

"Rome wasn't built in a day, but then again... neither was the City Dump."

Man that's a great quote....kinda says it all...

Now if John would only shave his head, we could get a much better comparison :D

That may be the most shallow, vainglorious statement I have ever read...and from someone I respect?
How completely vacuous.


You are entitled to your opinion as is everyone.

In the end, all people care about are RESULTS, no matter how extreme or minimal.

I was speaking to John specifically about what HE has overcome, accomplished, etc...........

Believe me, I've been doing this for YEARS.

I don't sugar coat, too many carbs in sugar coating anyhow.

~SC~

Maybe, I mean, we all lift weights to look better, and judging our appearance in the mirror is what motivates "us."

However, SCs statement reeks of closed door, secret handshake, frat-boy BS. I think he is a great guy, but that is just dumb. I bet there are millions of scientists, professors, hell doctors and nurses that can't deadlift 2x their body weight that are pretty pleased with the accomplishments they have managed.

I won't harp on this, but if you can infer something from that statement (SCs) then I can understand it from MY point of view.

I think what separates real men from the pretenders is a sense of humility and quite frankly I'm not seeing it there.

Man you read into shit waaaaaaaaay too much.

Have a drink and relax, it's Christmas for shit's sake.

:lol:

Man......SEN.......SI........TIVE.........

~SC~

Maybe he feels like a pretender naked??? Makes no sense to me...:neener:
I believe the point here is hard work separates the wannabes from those who find success, no matter what the goal in life...:tucool:

That is a good way to put it as well, yes.

Whatever is "politically" correct.

:lol:

Man........

~SC~

Hehehe... thanks for the accolades J.Simon!

Yes, John is definitely improving. I showed my wife John's comparison pics from when he first started training in late 2002 and how he looks today and she was amazed. People don't realize how much control they have over their physique. The biggest problem for most of us is that life's little distractions can get in the way of taking care of ourselves. As they say, "Rome wasn't built in a day, but then again... neither was the City Dump." We are a product of our habits, and in order to effectively make a POSITIVE change, you have to have POSITIVE habits. John has many positive habits, and hence he has developed an outstanding physique.

Regarding the comparison shots, John is taller than I am, and about 30-40 lbs. heavier. One day soon though (hopefully in March), Kandra and I are going to drive down to Orlando, and hopefully John will let me do a guest posedown with him at his gym. Now THAT would be cool. :) As long as you guys don't sell the autographed photos on EBay. :)

John, everytime I see your pictures, I well up with pride in your accomplishments. I guess you can say we've mutually inspired each other over the years, and for that I will be eternally grateful. :)

I know I've said this before, but your website and forum have inspired more people than you can imagine. So no matter how many haters you might get from time to time, always remember that by your example, you've changed a lot of peoples lives. I never envisioned that I would be a role model for anyone, seeing as I started off so skinny and was picked on as a kid. But sometimes the challenges of our youth is what makes the testimony in our victory so great. Isn't God good? :D

Give Lisa a big hug for us, and I'll contact you soon about a Spring visit! :)

- Skip "Psalm 139:14 - 'I praise you God because I am fearfully and wonderfully made." :)

You both have been such great inspirations in my life and in many others. I do not believe there words in the english language that can explain our gratitudes to you both. I can truly say that without the inspiration that you both have given me. I would never had made it this far and had the chance to inspire others as well. Lia (my wife)and I were going to come down to Florida for your annual cheat meal, but alas things changed. While we were in the general area we were going to visit Skip (well hopefully next year we can do it). Oh Skip congratulations on your wedding, I wanted to send you a message before but I have been so busy, so busy infact I had forgotten about my birthday (which was the same day as your wedding I might add). Also I am not sure if I am going to be competing due to a shoulder problem. I might (again) have to wait until next year. But there are ups to that!!!

John, your progress is far beyond anything I have ever seen before. I am so impressed (and jealous) *smiles*. I mean I come to the site every morning just to look at the new pictures. I mean. . .each picture is better than the one prior. Such inspiration. Also starting next august I have been thinking of going on the same program you are on now. I am currently doing the MAX O/T program you were on (but with some tweaks here and there). I have gained 20 lbs since using that program (well almost 18 to be exact). But. . .before I ramble on even more I shall dash. Talk to you later

~Ronn :bb:

[QUOTE=j.simon]Gather 'round, children -- it's time once again for Uncle Jay's "John Stone Picture Thread Hijacking." Today we'll be looking at updated images of Mr. Stone's back-double-bicep pose compared to previous incarnations, as well as compared to a special guest.

First, the updated image compared to himself:

Excellent stuff. =Quote]

OMG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I'm also amazed at how much you've grown (same pose) since November!!!

I have lifting gloves, but I stopped wearing them several months ago. I wasn't complaining, I like calluses.

i used to work at a shop part time, people would hand me cash, and have stuff like that on their hands, i freaked and thought they were warts or something. that's from lifting weights?

Man i don't lift enough weight.

John,

I reviewed your stats from Nov 1 to Dec 25 and found that you gained 13.9lb of muscle!!! What in the world have you been doing? No 'roids, I hope. ;)

How much have you gone up on various lifts?

John -

Those were some cool pics of the doggies today. Makes me want a dog of my own again. :cry:

And I think Loki could take you... a'hm just sayin. :lol:

You both have been such great inspirations in my life and in many others. I do not believe there words in the english language that can explain our gratitudes to you both. I can truly say that without the inspiration that you both have given me. I would never had made it this far and had the chance to inspire others as well.Thank you very much, Merk. I feel the same way about the inspirational photos and words that have helped pushed me along the way. Making a life-changing transformation is never easy, and I know I couldn't have done it without the help of more people than I could possibly name. I'm continuously inspired to this day by all the awesome people on this forum. :tu:

Lia (my wife)and I were going to come down to Florida for your annual cheat meal, but alas things changed.That's a shame - hopefully you can make it next year!

Also starting next august I have been thinking of going on the same program you are on now. I am currently doing the MAX O/T program you were on (but with some tweaks here and there). I have gained 20 lbs since using that program (well almost 18 to be exact).Great job! I also had great results with MAX-OT, but this year's higher volume workouts combined with the SUP2 nutritional program have moved things to the next level. I know you won't be disappointed with SUP2!


I reviewed your stats from Nov 1 to Dec 25 and found that you gained 13.9lb of muscle!!!No, 14 pounds of lean mass. Lean mass is not all muscle.

What in the world have you been doing? No 'roids, I hope. ;)Haha - good one! I've not heard that before. :blank:

I've documented everything I possibly can here in this journal and on my main site. I can't talk about the SUP2 nutritional program.

You want to know my secret? This is not part of SUP2, so I can talk about this: it's butter. I eat at least 2 whole sticks of butter every day. Sometimes I mix a stick of butter in the blender along with a can of tuna, a scoop of chocolate protein powder, a cup of dextrose and 1/2 cup of flax oil. My bench has gone up almost 200 pounds since I started eating the butter.


And I think Loki could take you... a'hm just sayin. He and Turtle could both take me down, no problem. Luckily I have them fooled and they think I'm the alpha. :lol:

Happy :D

mmmmm....butter :drool:

thanks for the tip. :tu:

you forgot one comparison, LESS ARM HAIR :D

nice horseshoes...11% at that weight makes me wanna :cry:
my wife doesn't like when I shave my arms, but it definitely shows definition and seems so much cleaner IMO. Vanity...not IMO.

Butter.

Happy :D

Dude, Congrats on the progress, lets hope one day I can have guns like that too. :D

Cheers John, and again, as I am sure everyone here would agree, thanks for the insparation.

2 sticks of butter?? Oh man, I think I would have a heart attack. I mean I thought it was bad enough eating 3-4 eggs a day let alone 2 sticks of butter, though I must ask (just to satisfy my curiosity) How on earth does butter (out of all things) give you the extra oommph to push more weight? I have a bad feeling that I might end up trying this. . . .

Cheers
~Ronn :bb:

Hey Merk. Please dont try that. It was a joke.

Hey Merk. Please dont try that. It was a joke.

I caught on. . .only after the fact (leave me be I had just woken up) I wouldn't man, trust me. I was thinking about it after I wrote that. I was like "there is no way in hell I would even try that, I would keel over in a week from a massive heart attack". Plus the taste is bad :D

Cheers
~Ronn :guitar:

Happy :D

John, your arms are amazing! For the heck of it, I pulled out 18" on my MyoTape and held it up around my flexed bicep (just hit 14", up from 12"). It was amazing how much arm wasn't there that is there on your arm. Ten pounds of your present bulk must be wrapped up in your upper arms. Great work! :tu:

If butter were the key, I'd be Superman.

No, seriously. :eat:

Happy :D



GEEEEEEEEZ!!!!!!!!:bang:

I can't believe no one is taking my butter advice seriously. I'm even writing a souper sekret new book called "Huge Guns and You: Building a Butter Mousetrap". Watch and see; It's going to take the bodybuilding world by storm. :nod:


Dude, Congrats on the progress, lets hope one day I can have guns like that too.

For the heck of it, I pulled out 18" on my MyoTape and held it up around my flexed bicep (just hit 14", up from 12"). It was amazing how much arm wasn't there that is there on your arm.

Hey guys, first of all - thanks! Second of all, keep in mind that just 1 year and 4 months ago (August 20, 2004) my arms were only 13.75 inches! It really boils down to hard work, an excellent diet (Thanks SwoleCat!), plenty of sleep, consistency and heart (oh, and a good supply of whole butter). Over the last two bulks I set goals and surpassed them because I never miss workouts, I never miss meals, I eat clean and eat often, I don't drink alcohol when I'm bulking (I did have a glass of wine on Thanksgiving, but that's it), I always get plenty of rest, I never make excuses and I push myself as hard as I can every second of my training.

Stratus_fear, I may not know you very well, but I know if you do all the things I mentioned above you can definitely have big guns. :tu:

Carguy, I've been following your transformation for some time now, and your progress speaks for itself. You've already added two inches to your arms and noticeable mass to the other areas of your body; you've lost pounds and pounds of fat; you've extended your life expectancy considerably, and you look years younger. Keep it up!

John, that progress is insane. Congrats!

I can't believe no one is taking my butter advice seriously. I'm even writing a souper sekret new book called "Huge Guns and You: Building a Butter Mousetrap". Watch and see; It's going to take the bodybuilding world by storm. :nod:

You cannot be serious about the butter thing. LOL. . . .are you? :eek: I am honestly not sure if you are or not. I feel like a 'tard for saying this :o . *shakes head* Not being able to hear the sarcasim nor facial expressions makes it a little hard to gauge.
On that note I am going to bed.

Night
~Ronn

No, 14 pounds of lean mass. Lean mass is not all muscle...




If one weighs, takes BF measurement and then calculates LBM, it is not all muscle, obviously. But if one gains x lbs and calculates LBM using difference in BF%, then the gains are primarily muscle, except for miniscule changes in connective tissue.

I can't believe it's not butter!

Wow, those are some incredible tricep comparison shots! I continue to be impressed.

I also really like the back comparison shots. The back comparison to Skip was especially interesting. I don't generally like the idea of comparing one person's physique to another's, and I know it's not usually your thing either.
Although Skip's back development is still light years away from mine, at least now I'm in the same galaxy. I'm only halfway through my bulk, so six weeks from now I will have made even more improvement. By this time next year, I think I may even be approaching the outskirts of Skip's solar system.
What are the differences between your back and Skip's? Do you believe the differences can be narrowed, or is it just an innate shape/genetics thing? It looks to me like Skip has bigger shoulders and more tapered biceps than yours. Your biceps however look much larger than his and I wonder if that's because you concentrate more effort in that area.

I think both yours and Skip's back are really quite amazing, but I don't know how much sense it makes to compare them.

(But I'm definitely in on the autographed pics of the posedown.:D)

Great arm comparison! It really shows what an extra 1.25 inch does to an arm. I could never really picture what kind of difference an inch would make to an arm but this gave me a much better idea. (I knew it would make a huge difference but I couldn't really visualize the increase.)

I think both yours and Skip's back are really quite amazing, but I don't know how much sense it makes to compare them.
No, it probably doesn't make much sense to compare them; as Skip has pointed out, John is taller and much heavier than Skip at this point in time (and even after John's next cut, I'm guessing he'll still be heavier than Skip), so it's certainly a bit of the ol' "apples versus not apples" kind of thing.

But it does beat posting shots of ME. :rolleyes:

It really boils down to hard work, an excellent diet (Thanks SwoleCat!), plenty of sleep, consistency and heart (oh, and a good supply of whole butter). Over the last two bulks I set goals and surpassed them because I never miss workouts, I never miss meals, I eat clean and eat often, I don't drink alcohol when I'm bulking (I did have a glass of wine on Thanksgiving, but that's it), I always get plenty of rest, I never make excuses and I push myself as hard as I can every second of my training.

John, you left out one component...a lot of sweat!!!:bb:

lions, butter and frat boys? what the hell is going on in here!!!


is John causing a "rucus"?

:lol:

Stratus_fear, I may not know you very well, but I know if you do all the things I mentioned above you can definitely have big guns. :tu:


Thanks Mate, I am going to try my best with that. got a bit of reading to do :read:

Got a journal going now, feedback and suggestions welcome, I am very new to this so I am looking at any suggestions with a very open mind...including the pure butter stuff :D

If one weighs, takes BF measurement and then calculates LBM, it is not all muscle, obviously. But if one gains x lbs and calculates LBM using difference in BF%, then the gains are primarily muscle, except for miniscule changes in connective tissue.You're forgetting something very heavy: water.

Water weighs 8 pounds per gallon, and is considered lean mass. Between the creatine and the massive amounts of carbs I'm eating every day, I'm holding a lot of water.

Oh, everyone: just to be 100% safe: I'm joking about the butter. :lol:

John, that progress is insane. Congrats!Thanks, Todd! I'm looking forward to seeing your before/after BFL photos. Keep up the hard work, and watch those strains and injuries. ;)

Oh, everyone: just to be 100% safe: I'm joking about the butter. :lol:


I don't think I will ever live the "butter" thing down. . . .:bang:

~Ronn:flex:

You're forgetting something very heavy: water.

Water weighs 8 pounds per gallon, and is considered lean mass. Between the creatine and the massive amounts of carbs I'm eating every day, I'm holding a lot of water.


Ok, I stand corrected, darn it! At least some of that water is in the muscle cells! Well, at least we know that almost 14lb of the 20+lb you gained was LBM if not strictly muscle! ;)

Thanks, Todd! I'm looking forward to seeing your before/after BFL photos. Keep up the hard work, and watch those strains and injuries. ;)
Thanks, John. I was going to put the "before" pic up and then add the "after" one up at the end, but instead I decided to do them both at the end... you know, for dramatic effect?

Those strains will get you every time. Mine seems to be healed up already. I'll be testing out tonight.

as Skip has pointed out, John is taller and much heavier than Skip at this point in time
Just call it Ahr'nold versus Franco.

Wow John....great gains! Lots of focus on the guns this round?

Wow John....great gains! Lots of focus on the guns this round?Thanks. :)

I'm doing antagonistic supersets for my arms and they seem to be responding very well to that kind of training along with the SUP2 diet. I work just as hard on my arms as anything else, but they are not the primary "focus" of this bulk.

I'm already done with my work for today. So....

I'M ON VACTION UNTIL JANUARY 10th! :tucool: :spaz:

:moon: :neener:

Thanks. :)

I'm doing antagonistic supersets for my arms and they seem to be responding very well to that kind of training along with the SUP2 diet. I work just as hard on my arms as anything else, but they are not the primary "focus" of this bulk.


Hey John, i'm sure I could dig this up but i'm kinda lazy.

1) how many supersets do you perform?
2) how many times per week?

And for the record, I agree with your arm training strategy. I also train arms JUST as hard as any other bodypart. I love isolating them.

P.S. Have a nice vaca. I promise i'll behave myself!!!

1) how many supersets do you perform?3 supersets: four sets per exercise, a total of 6 exercises (3 bicep/3 tricep).

2) how many times per week?I work all body parts once per week, with the exception of traps which I hit twice per week (low reps/very heavy weight on back day, and high reps/moderate weight on delts day).

And for the record, I agree with your arm training strategy.I've had very good results with supersets!

P.S. Have a nice vaca. I promise i'll behave myself!!!Thank you!

(I'll believe it when I see it...) :D

Don't worry. I'll ask Wh0 to keep an eye on him (If I can find Wh0, he's quiet lately..) :)

Don't worry. I'll ask Wh0 to keep an eye on himThat's tantamount to asking a fox to guard the hen house.

Since I finished my work early and am now on vacation, I decided to do my leg workout at 4:15 today. It was a excellent, very high volume workout. I've showed and had my protein shake - now I can kick back and enjoy the first evening of my vacation!

Tonight is my cheat meal night, but I don't really want it. I don't mind the extra fat I've added since I started bulking at all, except the fat in my face. My face is starting to look puffy! I hate that. With another month of bulking ahead, I think I'm going to look like a butterball at the JSF cheat meal! :lol:

Even though I'm on vacation, I thought it was important to take my monthly pictures today since I'm bulking.

Once I saw them, I almost didn't have the nerve to put them up. Anyway, for better or worse they are now on the main page (http://www.johnstonefitness.com/).

I've added a little over 27 pounds since I started bulking, and I am up to 216 pounds as of this morning. I'd say I'm around 12% body fat now (wh0, feel free to check me on that ;)). That means I've added around 17 pounds of lean mass and about 10 pounds of fat. I'm good with that.

I've made some nice improvements this month, but many of those gains will not be noticeable until I cut away the fat. Right now I feel very chubby and uncomfortable. :(

Before bulk (November 1, 2005) & Current (January 1, 2006):

Hey John. You look great! Bigger yes, but not chubby. And you're not alone. There are a lot of us bulking right now. Believe it or not, I'm also up 27 pounds on my bulk. And I'm also feeling "thick". And heck, doordude is up like 43 pounds! That what's winter's for. This way everyone will be cutting together and we can give each other support. I know you'll come through this better for it. I'm not so sure about me but I'm going to give it one heck of a try. :tu:

:eek: You can already eat the old you for breakfast! (In the good way.) :D :tucool: You've found the perfect combination of hard work, diet, and self disclipine and are a model and an inspiration to us all.

Honestly you really don't look that much fatter at all. I am surprised you say you may have added 10 pounds of fat I would have said a lot less :tu: .

Also I compared the profile views of november with today's and your abs actually look like they gained a lot of muscular size. I would even say that on those side pics, your abs are showing more difinition compared to nov 2005.

John, you look good.

You're doing fine, and I think you actually look better now than you did in November. I hate cutting though, and just generally feel better when I'm bigger, even if it means I'm holding more bodyfat. I'd rather have blurry abs and big arms/chest/delts myself.

You have a slight hint of embarassment in your "voice" today - stop, you look fine bro.

And think about the amount of muscle you've put on that's going to show when you get going with your cut. :tucool:

Right now I feel very chubby and uncomfortable. :(


If that's chubby, I can't wait to be chubby :tu:

You look fantastic.

Hey, thanks a lot everyone! Sorry if it sounded as if I was complaining. I really wasn't, I'm just trying to adjust to the nearly 30 pounds I've added over the last two months. That's a pretty short time to add so much weight, so feeling my thighs rub together, seeing my puffy face, watching my abs disappear and feeling my clothes tighten up is taking some getting used to. I have to admit, when I saw my pictures today I was a little upset, but I'm getting used to it now. :)

I don't know how much I'll weigh by the end of my bulk, but I figure it will be around 225 pounds @ 14% BF or so. If that's the case, after I cut and lose all the fat and excess water I'll probably be around 205 pounds and 8% BF. That's a solid 16-17 pounds of pure muscle gained in 3 months, so I'm definitely not complaining! :tucool:

Early prediction/Long-term goal: by spring of 2007 I will be 220 pounds and shredded.

Right now I feel very chubby and uncomfortable.

Join the club.....;)

Join the club.....;)

LOL, no kidding. It seems most of use here have gained a good amount this winter. Jeeze John, look at what you have started!!!

On another note. . .

I am wondering if any of you are experiencing this. . .for most nights I am sleeping at an average of 10+ hours (which I find is rather common while bulking). The problem is. . . every now and again (like last few nights) I sleep horrible . This frustrates me alot. Which all of you can understand. I don't know what causes this, but man it makes me upset. The past 4 nights I have slept like this 3-6-11-0.30. This is the worst.:bang: Well I better get ready for the gym today is day one of "ihavetoshredsevenpercentbodyfatinthenextsixweeks" (:D )a.k.a project shred.

Cheers
~Ronn

Hi John, I have looked at your progress and it is truly an inspiration. I was just wondering, though, at what "shredded weight" will you decide to just maintain the body instead of build? Or are you trying to get as big as possible until your skin rips and you turn into a meatball?:tu:

You got guts to hang it all out there month after month (good or bad , in your mind). A bulk plays on your mind a bit. The weights you're pushing keeping going up each week and that speaks loads for the strength and muscle you are adding to your frame, The fat is a simple by-product of your nutrition and extra insurance that the energy you need will be there when you hit the gym. It's funny how different people view bulking and cutting. For some cutting is easier and visa-versa.

I wouldn't say you look fat as much as you look "thick" or "solid" and I mean that in a good way. It's gonna be no sweat either way because you have a solid trainer (it seems) with a good deal of experience. So just "hang tight" and trust his plan. You'll do SGX (I assume) again and probably have better results the next round of cutting due to the added mass. It'll help make cutting that much easier.

Your progress is very good and inspiring John. Don't sweat the small details.

I am wondering if any of you are experiencing this. . .for most nights I am sleeping at an average of 10+ hours (which I find is rather common while bulking). The problem is. . . every now and again (like last few nights) I sleep horrible. There can be all kinds of reasons for that. You should start another thread on that subject in General Health and Fitness; posing that question in my personal journal is probably not going to yield a very good discussion. :tu:


I was just wondering, though, at what "shredded weight" will you decide to just maintain the body instead of build?I fully expect my next bulk to be my last one. My final goal is 220 pounds at 8% body fat (or less), and I really do not want to be any bigger than that. Having said that, I will continue to work on proportion and symmetry if there are any lagging body parts, but my "all out" bulking days will likely be over. 220 pounds and 8% body fat on a 6 foot frame is pretty big for a natural trainer!


You got guts to hang it all out there month after month (good or bad , in your mind). A bulk plays on your mind a bit.I truly enjoy bulking. I love lifting and I love eating. I've mostly overcome the "fat phobia" that I used to experience when bulking, but I suppose there are still some remnants of that mentality lurking. It's probably because I was fat for so long, and also because my pictures are so public. Even though the fat gain still bugs me a little, at least now I'm at the point (mentally) where I can proceed without letting fat gains change my program.

I wouldn't say you look fat as much as you look "thick" or "solid" and I mean that in a good way. It's gonna be no sweat either way because you have a solid trainer (it seems) with a good deal of experience. So just "hang tight" and trust his plan. You'll do SGX (I assume) again and probably have better results the next round of cutting due to the added mass. It'll help make cutting that much easier.Oh yeah - I'm not complaining about SUP2 at all! SUP2 has allowed me to gain a great deal of lean mass while remaining relatively lean. I'd rather put on a little fat knowing I'm giving my body what it needs to grow than short-change my progress by under-eating. SUP2 has exceeded my expectations, and those expectations were quite high.

Yes, I will DEFINATELY cut using SGX. I had such amazing results last time (actually adding lean mass while cutting) that I feel 100% confident that I'll get shredded up quickly, and with no muscle loss.

When I first came to this site and saw the sequence of photographs of you slimming down I was amazed, but it didn't appeal directly to me as I have never tried to slim down. But then my 56k modem slowly started churning out the shots of your first bulk. That is when my jaw dropped and I had to adjust my understanding of what was possible. Since then I've kind of got used to your monthly improvements, but this last set has gone back to jaw dropping changes. I'm inspired.

There can be all kinds of reasons for that. You should start another thread on that subject in General Health and Fitness; posing that question in my personal journal is probably not going to yield a very good discussion. :tu:

Sorry. . .since we were on the topic of bulking I thought I would ask and see if it went hand in hand. Hope I didn't piss you off. Again I apologize.:o

~Ronn

Reeze, Thanks for that. I have to give a lot of the credit to SwoleCat for my excellent diet, and also to Milos Sarcev for his training techniques.

Merk, Pissed off?! Of course not! There's nothing inherent to bulking that causes loss of sleep, so I was just trying to help you get an answer to your question. :p

Even though I'm on vacation, I thought it was important to take my monthly pictures today since I'm bulking.




Before bulk (November 1, 2005) & Current (January 1, 2006):




AAAGGGGHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!:bang:

AAAGGGGHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!:bang::confused: Hrm, I'm not sure what you mean. Maybe you could break protocol just for me and use real words? ;)

You look great in your new avatar!

:confused: Hrm, I'm not sure what you mean. Maybe you could break protocol just for me and use real words? ;)

You look great in your new avatar!
I think he means "you look great and I'm jealous." (?)

That is what I was thinking actually, so maybe Michael thought the same thing. That's some dramatic progress for that timeframe, John.

I think he means "you look great and I'm jealous." (?)

That is what I was thinking actually, so maybe Michael thought the same thing. That's some dramatic progress for that timeframe, John.Neither you nor Michael have ANYTHING to be jealous over, that's for damn sure. You guys both look awesome. :tu:

:confused: Hrm, I'm not sure what you mean. Maybe you could break protocol just for me and use real words? ;)

You look great in your new avatar!

I've got my own private challenge going and i'm failing terribly. You're just too damn tough to hang with!!!!!!!! Your results are phenomenal!!!!!!!!!

Thanx for the avatar compliment.:D

See, no smileys.

I've got my own private challenge going and i'm failing terribly. You're just too damn tough to hang with!!!!!!!! Your results are phenomenal!!!!!!!!!I thought you've already packed on around 50 pounds - that's incredible progress. The last pictures I saw of you looked amazing.

Neither you nor Michael have ANYTHING to be jealous over, that's for damn sure. You guys both look awesome. :tu:
Thanks, John! :)

I thought you've already packed on around 50 pounds - that's incredible progress. The last pictures I saw of you looked amazing.

Yeah but ALOT of that is fat. You look like you've put on straight muscle!!!
I guess after a couple of rounds of cut/bulk i'll get the hang of it.:tucool:
Again, thanx for the compliments.

I think he means "you look great and I'm jealous." (?)

That is what I was thinking actually, so maybe Michael thought the same thing. That's some dramatic progress for that timeframe, John.

Nailed it right on the head!!!!!!:tucool:

Thanks, John! :)

Me too John, thanx.

John -- I honestly think you look much better in your most recent pics than you do in the November pics. You are probably uncomfortable just because of the timescale in which you've added all that new mass -- You haven't had much time to adjust to your new size -- But, you look much bigger, stronger, and impressive in my opinion. You've had an unbelievably successful bulk -- you should be proud. :tucool:

John -- I honestly think you look much better in your most recent pics than you do in the November pics. You are probably uncomfortable just because of the timescale in which you've added all that new mass -- You haven't had much time to adjust to your new size -- But, you look much bigger, stronger, and impressive in my opinion. You've had an unbelievably successful bulk -- you should be proud. :tucool:Thanks, Joe. :)

I am very happy with the lean mass I've added, I guess I'm just more comfortable with a bit less body fat that I'm carrying right now. I think the lean mass I've added will look even more impressive once I shave away the fat that's hiding it.

Really, those month pictures don't accurately reflect how I look in person. For example, my delts look small and out of whack for some reason in this month's shots. They look much rounder and more full when I look at myself in the mirror. I guess it was the way I was posing/standing. Also, I think I look smaller in those pictures than I do in real life. By the same token, I think the amount of fat I'm carrying is a little more pronounced in real life than it is in those pictures.

While I realize that I still have a long way to go, when I look at how far I've come since August 2004 (which was right before my first real bulk), I can't help but feel proud of myself for sticking with my training and diet, and giving it my honest best.

It's kind of cool that I've transformed my body once again: this time I've changed from a skinny "kid" into a person who looks like he lifts weights. :tu:

August 2004 Vs. January 2006.

Also, I think I look smaller in those pictures than I do in real life.

Well duh, the pics are only, like, 395 pixels tall. You're at least 500px tall in real life. :lol:

Well duh, the pics are only, like, 395 pixels tall. You're at least 500px tall in real life. :lol:

WOW :lol: :lol: :lol:

I am so impressed by those pictures...Dayum you added alot of muscle. And if you think your chunky, i hate to tell you man, your not. Im probably 3% BF higher with considerably less muscle after trying my "bulk". When wearing clothes, noone can see you have less "definition" then before, and you must look massive with clothes on.

I am so impressed by those pictures...Dayum you added alot of muscle. And if you think your chunky, i hate to tell you man, your not. Im probably 3% BF higher with considerably less muscle after trying my "bulk". When wearing clothes, noone can see you have less "definition" then before, and you must look massive with clothes on.I don't know about massive, but I definitely don't look skinny any more! :)

Alright, this is the last month of my bulk. I'm changing up all my workouts again starting today. These are the workouts that are going to bring me home, so I'm creating a "best of" series workouts; these workouts will consist of the exercises that I feel have worked best for me over the past two months.

Here is my new back/traps routine:

BACK
4x10-12 Wide-grip pull-ups. (I used to do weighted wide-grip pull-ups, but at almost 220 pounds I can no longer complete 4 sets of 12 pull-ups with strict form. I'll add weight to these if my abilities outpace my body weight over the next month).
4x12 Seated cable rows (narrow grip, to stomach)
4x8 Deadlifts
4x12 T-Bar Rows

DELTS
4xBurnout Barbell shrugs


Tonight's workout was a real challenge. I really didn't feel like working out. I felt tired and lazy. Probably because I've been sitting around all day not doing much of anything (I'm on vacation and needed a "chill" day).

I did the usual "John Stone mental pep talk" (basically I reminded myself that every workout was incredibly important in this bulk, and not only could I NOT afford to skip a workout, but I couldn't afford anything less than a GREAT workout). I cranked up the music, jumped around a bit, slapped the crap out of my face (hey, it works) and got started.

I went up in weight on the first two exercise, but I was still not in the "zone". In fact, I felt kind of weak. That's not a good way to feel right before deadlifts, especially since last week I struggled to get 4 sets of 8 up at my then personal best weight. Tonight I added 10 pounds to last week's deadlift weight and stared at the bar trying to get focused - the last thing I wanted to do was injure myself. I grabbed the bar, lifted... and it felt light! What the hell? I cranked out 8 reps, and double-checked to make sure I'd loaded the bar with the correct weight. Yep. I did another set; piece of cake. Something clicked and suddenly I felt great - I was full of energy and strong. I swear, it must have been the endorphins kicking in. Anyway, I did the next two sets of eight no problem. Next week I'll add 10 more pounds!

I added 10 pounds to my T-bar rows and did 12/10/10/10. After those, I added 10 pounds to my barbell shrugs (tonight's my "heavy" shrug night) and did 4 sets of 20/16/16/17.

Great workout. I'm proud of myself for getting it done, and with a performance I can be proud of. I feel terrific right now.

I did the usual "John Stone mental pep talk"

Those things are becoming world famous! The rest of us just need to think, WWJSD? (What would John Stone do?) :D

Good job, boss.

The rest of us just need to think, WWJSD? (What would John Stone do?) :D Please, tell me you did not just type that. :doh:

:moon:

Please, tell me you did not just type that. :doh:

:moon:

Man, if DD gets a hold of that, WWJSD will be all over this BB :lol:

Those things are becoming world famous! The rest of us just need to think, WWJSD? (What would John Stone do?) :D

.

I'd really like to answer this but i've been so well behaved lately i'd hate to ruin my "good boy" streak.:D

Man, if DD gets a hold of that, WWJSD will be all over this BB :lol:


You JUST beat me to it.:doh:

Please, tell me you did not just type that. :doh:

:moon:

Man, if DD gets a hold of that, WWJSD will be all over this BB :lol:

Oops.

:D

WWJSD! I would love that on a shirt. :tucool:

WWJSD! I would love that on a shirt. :tucool:I'm thinking toilet paper. Probably be a big seller. :D

Great workout. I'm proud of myself for getting it done, and with a performance I can be proud of. I feel terrific right now.

I love that feeling. Way to turn it around. You should feel that way, there is nothing better than gaining strength. Getting stronger is the ultimate motivator for me. That's why I'm a little nervous about this cut I'm embarking on... If you could go through it so can I.:D

John,

First of all, thanks for the great website and also for directing me to Swolecat:tu:

Secondly, Can I make a request for your next mini-clip? I cranked up the music, jumped around a bit, slapped the crap out of my face.

I think you do look fat and bloated in those pictures, but I'll explain why I think you do. When you're nice and cut, you need some extra attention for the round parts of your body to show they're there, so you put on some oil and put on a spotlight. When your body is round enough by itself, putting on oil actually can make you even rounder, which makes you look: round and damn hot if you're a woman, but fat and bloated if you're a man.
My advice for picture taking during the end of the bulk, is to use more natural light and lose the oil to avoid the specularity on the round parts.

First of all, thanks for the great website and also for directing me to Swolecat:tu:Thanks, and no problem!

Secondly, Can I make a request for your next mini-clip? :lol: Maybe instead of slapping myself, I could get Lisa to do it and have my personal slapper, just like Ryan Kennelly. Somehow I think she'd take the job.


I think you do look fat and bloated in those pictures...
My advice for picture taking during the end of the bulk, is to use more natural light and lose the oil to avoid the specularity on the round parts.Keep in mind that my monthly pictures are not designed to portray me looking as good as I possibly can. I think keeping the photographic methods I've used for the past few years as consistent as possible is far more important than using "tricks" to make myself look a little better.

I'm bulking right now and, yes - I've got some extra fat and water on me. It shows in the pictures, and next month I'll have even more fat (and muscle) on display. Over the past few days I've come to grips with that, and I feel great about my progress. None of it will matter in a few months anyway, as I'll be totally ripped and 200+ pounds.

Call me fat again and I'll crush you like tin can! :D ;)

John, do u still take your pics behind the same "line" on the floor as you always did ? Just you look like you might be closer to the camera then you were on the Aug 04 one ?

Then again, maybe its the mass that just makes it look like your bigger. I dont know. Or maybe the new camera ? :confused:

John, do u still take your pics behind the same "line" on the floor as you always did ? Just you look like you might be closer to the camera then you were on the Aug 04 one ?

Then again, maybe its the mass that just makes it look like your bigger. I dont know. Or maybe the new camera ? :confused:Same camera, same exact spot. You can verify this by noting the vertical position of my nipples, belly button, knees, etc.; they are practically identical in both shots.

I'm about 45 pounds larger now, so I'm simply taking up more room. :)

John,

How much weight (% wise) on average were you adding to your lifts while on SGX? I'm sure it was less than what your adding on your current bulk(SUP2).

I'm curious what you and others add weight wise while on a good cut.

Unlike last night, tonight I was feeling fired up about my workout from the get-go! I've assembled a great chest workout to take me through the end of my bulk. I think it's a good mix of machine, cable and free weight work:

CHEST
4x12 Barbell bench press
4x12 Smith machine incline press
4x12 Smith machine decline press
4x12 Cable cross-over

I'll vary the position on the cable cross-over "pull-to point" and the angle of my upper body each week. Same goes for width of grip on all the pressing moves.


I've not posted many (any?) chest pictures this bulk. My chest is bigger than it's ever been before: it's almost 46 inches in these shots. Of course part of the increased chest measurement is due to the gains I've made with my lats, but my chest has also shown very good growth.

Here are a couple of shots from tonight. Please pardon my puffy face and silly expressions. :)

John,

How much weight (% wise) on average were you adding to your lifts while on SGX? I'm sure it was less than what your adding on your current bulk(SUP2).

I'm curious what you and others add weight wise while on a good cut.I couldn't tell you without going back through all my logs. I changed my exercises and order of exercises so frequently that it would be tough to come up with a correct answer anyway. Besides, I think if you asked 10 people on SGX that question, you'd get 10 different answers. Also, keep in mind that while muscle and strength gains are possible using SGX, that is not the goal of the program - fat loss is. Personally I did make some muscle and strength gains, and you may too. :tu:

Unlike last night, tonight I was feeling fired up about my workout from the get-go! I've assembled a great chest workout to take me through the end of my bulk. I think it's a good mix of machine, cable and free weight work:

CHEST
4x12 Barbell bench press
4x12 Smith machine incline press
4x12 Smith machine decline press
4x12 Cable cross-over

I'll vary the position on the cable cross-over "pull-to point" and the angle of my upper body each week. Same goes for width of grip on all the pressing moves.


I've not posted many (any?) chest pictures this bulk. My chest is bigger than it's ever been before: it's almost 46 inches in these shots. Of course part of the increased chest measurement is due to the gains I've made with my lats, but my chest has also shown very good growth.

Here are a couple of shots from tonight. Please pardon my puffy face and silly expressions. :)

http://forums.johnstonefitness.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=10895&stc=1&d=1136421436
http://forums.johnstonefitness.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=10894&stc=1&d=1136421436


Whoa... John, your chest looks great! Awesome job! :)

- Skip :)

Whoa... John, your chest looks great! Awesome job! :)Thanks Skip! I swear, now that I've posted the pictures I can't even see my chest; the only thing I see are my pathetic delts. :(

I've been working so hard on my delts, and I can see real progress when I look in the mirror (my rear delts, in particular, have shown remarkable growth), but they still have a long, long way to go.