hey guys and gals i hope you can give a bit of direction, here's the deal.

i'm a 50 year old male 5'7" and 183 pounds. i've been lifting for about a year now only with nautilus machines - doing the same exercises 3 days a week.
leg press, leg extensions, leg curls, bench press, then i'd work my biceps and triceps - in this order and everything 3 set each. there were other exercise that i would "try" but not very many and not for very often.

my cardio consisted of walking on a treadmill for 1 to 2 miles at 3.5mph, with a polar watch - i've incorporated jogging into my cardio about 6 months ago. i'd walk for 2.5 miles jog 2.5... for 2 miles.

and that was pretty much it - i would do my cardio then do my strength training. unitl i started reading post in this forum - WOW what an eye opener!

now my workout is this...
squats, calf raise, dead lift, and leg press - 2 sets each.
incline bench press, military press, dips, and upright row - 2 to 3 sets each. is that too much?
i do my walk/jog for .5 to 1 mile before to warm up.
i do this 3 days a week.
i used to do cardio after my workout but my hr was consistently at about 133bpm.

oh, one last thing:
i understand the importance of resting for a week after 8 to 12 weeks of training and to change my routine as well. and because my cardio is not intense it should be okay to do it on the same day that i work out right? sometimes on my "off" days i go for a 3 - 4 mile walk (not in the gym)

any comments or suggestion?

thanks!

You do not need to rest on the cardio. At your current intensity, it is fine to continue.

You also do not necessarily need to rest or change your workouts every eight weeks - this is a good thing if you feel you have "stalled" in either strength or body reshaping, but as long as you feel that you are still getting a good workout and are seeing results, then keep at it.

Besides, at our age, the rest of your life typically throws you a week off every couple of months anyway (business travel, family vacations, etc).

thanks kevin, even after reading the "stickies" its difficult to guage how much to do and when to do it. i've always did "arms and legs" on the same day with cardio - some say not to do that. i wanted to make sure that i wasn't doing too much...

and you're correct in that family and the job have a way of keeping us from the gym as well as giving us reasons to go.

I typically do lifting and cardio on the same day (cardio after I have lifted). It certainly has not prevented me from making progress.

What specifically is your goal? To lose fat, gain weight, get stronger?

yep, just to get stronger. i could certinly get rid of my stomach - i've never had one before - never weighed over 150lbs until i quit smoking about 3 years ago, i'm now at 183lbs. but for now just getting stronger and staying healthy is my goal.

i will start working to lose the belly in the near future...

...also could you tell me what the "using the bench/bucket method" is when doing squats?

How does this technique help with improper knee bends?

I hope that I'm asking this correctly :read:

Thanks again

Don't know anything about a squat method called that.

Diet gets rid of bellies and other fat. :gl:

Thanks rtestes, I understand that - as a matter of fact I've changed my diet. I eat a much more healthy/clean diet now - fish, chicken breast, lean beef - with a more healthy mix of carbs and fats.

I've pactically cut fried foods and sweets (I love sweets) out of my diet.
So I eat better and exercise smater (I think) and now deciding what my next move is...
I'm considering doing the Max-OT workout, maybe the beginners Max-OT workout, or getting on Swolecat's program - I've heard good things about it. But I don't want to do any cutting.

Anyway, thanks for the reply.

...also could you tell me what the "using the bench/bucket method" is when doing squats?

How does this technique help with improper knee bends?

I hope that I'm asking this correctly :read:

Thanks again

They may have been talking about "box squats". That's when you squat with a box behind you - with the aim of touching the box at the lowest part of the squat, without actually sitting down. I think the idea behind it is to teach you to "sit" into the squat - almost as if you were sitting down normally.

yep, that's it - the box squat! thanks.

here's an article on it if anyone is interested.

http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/schultz22.htm

I'm a little confused by these two statements:

...i would do my cardio then do my strength training. until i started reading post in this forum - WOW what an eye opener!...

...i used to do cardio after my workout but my hr was consistently at about 133bpm...
In which order are you doing it now?

I'm a little confused by these two statements:


In which order are you doing it now?

Well I guess that is clear as mud, let me try that again... when I first started doing my workouts with the machines I did my cardio first, alternating walking at 3.5mph and jogging at 6mph for 2 miles (approx 30min).

After reading info in the forums I started doing my cardio after lifting weights but I thought that my heart rate was too high so I stopped doing cardio.

Currently, I walk/jog for a half mile (7min) just to warm up then do my weight training.

How high is "too high" for you with your HR? Based on the 133 bpm number you cited previously, that is right in line with where you want to be at your age (based on your current age, your maximum HR should be 220-50 = 170 bpm, so 133 bpm is 78% maxHR). There should be no problem going to 85% or higher during your workouts.

At 46, I typically try to keep my average HR at 150+ bpm for a thirty minute workout on either the elliptical or the stairmaster. Don't be overly concered about going too high unless you feel dizzy, weak, or start experiencing any chest pains or other signs of cardiovascular stress. How else are you going to improve your cardio fitness unless you push it a bit?

I'll second what kevin_in_ga said. I just turned 49 and shoot for about the same HR as he does. I can hit my theoretical maximum (220 - 49 = 171) if I really go for it.

Something I learned in a course I am taking is that the "220 minus your age" theoretical maximum applies to about 67% of the population as a whole. About 15% of the total population can comfortably go past that by about 10% and another 15% will max out at about 10% lower than what the simple equation gives you. The remaining small minority will exceed even those ranges by a bit more.

Without looking up the "exact" numbers (which aren't quite so "exact", since these are all merely estimates), it breaks down like this:

For a 50 year old, using the "220 minus your age" formula:

67% of the population = 170bpm
15% of the population = 187bpm
15% of the population = 163bpm

The remaining 3% of the population will be even slightly higher (or lower) than the upper or lower ranges. (Don't forget, these maximum HR numbers are there for you to use as the baseline for your maximum, your aerobic workout generally shoots for anywhere between 60-80% of that figure.)

The only way to approach any degree of certainty as to whether you fall outside the "typical" (67% of the overall population) range is to have a doctor-supervised series of stress tests done.

Finally, what Kevin mentioned about safety is right on the money. Just because you find it fairly easy to reach a higher HR than the simple calculation would suggest doesn't mean you should actually do it. His advice about keeping an eye out for possible signs of trouble is essential. Guys in our age range would be smart to get a really thorough set of heart tests done in any case. The peace of mind which comes from having a doctor give you the "all clear" is invaluable, and finding a potential problem early on in the game can be a lifesaver.

I'll second Prof's second of what I said originally ...

Seriously, you should be shooting for a cardiovascular workout where you huff and puff, sweat profusely, but not feel dizzy or ill. Don't be afraid of pushing your HR up into the 140-150 range (in fact, that is a very solid target for you given your stated goal of getting rid of belly fat).

Thanks for taking the time to help me out here.

When I walk on the treadmill at 3.5mph my hr is about 115bpm. When I'm jogging at 6mpg my hr is about 160.

So when I did my cardio after my weight training my hr stayed at 133bpm, I was only walking at 3.5mph, it never did go down to 115bpm - and yes to be quite honest it freaked me out!


Maybe give it another try when I get over being a "wus" :D

The better shape you are in the harder it becomes to bump the heart rate. When I was really out of shape my heart would pound like a telegraph message was being sent.

The reason you are getting the higher HR during cardio after weights is that the weightlifting session has already moved you closer (or even into) your heart training zone. This is very cool if you are going for fat loss as it usually takes about fifteen minutes of moderate cardio to get to that point. What that means is that while a typical cardio workout of thirty minutes only gives you a net of fifteen minutes in the training zone (the last fifteen minutes, since the first fifteen is spent actually getting there), a post-weights cardio session begins with you already at or near the training zone. When that happens you are burning more fat for the entire thirty minute session, not just the last half.

Exactly. So having your HR at 133 when you start your cardio is a good thing, not a problem. Just keep monitoring it, and if it goes above 160, you might want to crank it down a notch until you feel stronger cardiovascularly.

Thanks Prof and Kevin.

I was going to start the beginners Max-OT Monday, but I think I will continue my full body, 3 days a week workout for a few more weeks and incorporate cardio into it. And move to the beginners Max-OT (5 day split routines) later on - with cardio if all goes well.

Again, thanks a million! :tucool:

Good luck. Please keep everyone posted on your progress.

Okay, I did my workout Monday. I changed up a few of things - no warm up sets, no heavy weights, higher reps, and added cardio after weight training.

It went something like this:

walk 3.5mph/jog 6mph 2.5 miles each on treadmill to warm up.
leg extentions 2sets 20reps 70lbs
leg curl 2sets 20reps 70bls
squats 2sets 20reps 130lbs
calf raise 2sets 20reps 180lbs
bench press 2sets 14 & 10reps 150lbs
pull ups 2sets 6 & 5reps
dips 2sets 8 & 7reps
shrugs 2sets 20reps 130lbs

I finished with 15 minutes on the treadmill (1 mile) at 4mph, my hr stayed between 144 - 147bpm. Boy was I tired I won't tell how many times I started to slow it down. I will give it another try Wednesday and will move up to doing 30 min cardio in time.

By the way I slept like a baby, the first time in quite awhile! My sleeping issue is a whole other bag of cats.

Sooooo that's it for now... thanks.

My Wednesday workout was pretty much like Monday's.

Half mile walk/jog warmup.

I added 2 sets of leg press 150lbs, 20 reps. And military press 2 sets 70lbs 8 reps and dead lift 2 sets 130lbs, 20 reps.

No pullups or dips.

I did cardio on the treadmill again, 4mph for 15min (1mile) "whew"

A coulple of points here:

My lower legs seem to hurt, the shin and calf, and are just plain tired, I think I will do cardio on non-weight training days - maybe I can get 30min of cardio :D

Also, my knees bother me some, not much, on the treadmill. I was doing 220lbs squats when they start "acting up" (the reason I decided to do 20 reps leg extention, leg curls, and squats with only 130#, hoping to build up muscle, and go heavy later) maybe I will give the elliptical a try...

...My lower legs seem to hurt, the shin and calf...
What kind of shoes are you wearing? You might want to give this a read (http://www.sportsinjuryclinic.net/cybertherapist/front/lowerleg/shinsplints.htm). A good stretching program after your workout will probably help, too.


...and are just plain tired...That should improve automatically as your body adjusts to your increased activity level. :)

My shoes are New Balance 336 with insoles - it might be time for another pair shoes I've had them a year now!

Thanks for the link to the article - shin splints, yeap sounds like what the pain is. The pain is not that bad right now, but maybe new shoes and stretching will help.

Is there a brand of shoe that you would suggest for jogging/walking? I read that Chuck Taylors are a good shoe for squats.

Choosing shoes is a highly individual thing and I am no expert on the subject. One thing I have found helpful is to look at the wear pattern on your old worn-out pair and look for a new shoe which seems likely to help support your foot better in the place(s) where you have been putting the most pressure. For instance, lots of people who develop shin splints are running in shoes which show extra wear on the outer edges of one or both feet. Finding a shoe with solid support in that area might help.

The best thing to do about shoes, for myself at least, is to not go too long before replacing them. I have an old pair I keep around to walk my dogs in and they are broken in and as comfortable as can be. I wouldn't want to try and do five miles in them, though. :nope: