Hi guys I've bounced around here for a couple years while I've gone through some weight loss battles. I'm at a point right now where I weigh appx 170 lbs and am looking to bulk up. I still have fat in areas of my body that I'm hoping will go away as I continue to lift weights. With my class schedule I lift Monday (Legs & Shoulders), Wednesday (Back & Biceps), and Friday (Chest & Triceps). I have HIIT runs for about 15-20 mins Tuesday, Thursday, and Saturday mornings. and on training days I usually bang out 3-4 mile runs and I literally bike everywhere.

I'm not worried about my meals at all. I was following a strict vegetarian diet for about 2 years that I recently stopped, pretty much so that I could focus on muscle growth. I'm incorporating meat into my meals now and will start on protein shakes next week. I think if i restrict my calories while I lift I'll reach my goal on time; which is to look like Christian Bale from Batman Begins or Dane cook from his newest movie with Jessica Alba. I definitely have the dedication and motivation to reach that I just need some help on the supplement part of lifting.

I realize that protein is key and I can get enough of that; however I'm not sure about before/after workouts what I can eat or drink to maximize muscle growth. Any information would be appreciated, thanks so much!

Before
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v165/mhistava/100_0338.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v165/mhistava/100_0339.jpg
After
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v165/mhistava/cin_bale.jpg

Hi guys I've bounced around here for a couple years while I've gone through some weight loss battles. I'm at a point right now where I weigh appx 170 lbs and am looking to bulk up. I still have fat in areas of my body that I'm hoping will go away as I continue to lift weights. With my class schedule I lift Monday (Legs & Shoulders), Wednesday (Back & Biceps), and Friday (Chest & Triceps). I have HIIT runs for about 15-20 mins Tuesday, Thursday, and Saturday mornings. and on training days I usually bang out 3-4 mile runs and I literally bike everywhere.

I'm not worried about my meals at all. I was following a strict vegetarian diet for about 2 years that I recently stopped, pretty much so that I could focus on muscle growth. I'm incorporating meat into my meals now and will start on protein shakes next week. I think if i restrict my calories while I lift I'll reach my goal on time; which is to look like Christian Bale from Batman Begins or Dane cook from his newest movie with Jessica Alba. I definitely have the dedication and motivation to reach that I just need some help on the supplement part of lifting.

I realize that protein is key and I can get enough of that; however I'm not sure about before/after workouts what I can eat or drink to maximize muscle growth. Any information would be appreciated, thanks so much!


Use another persons physique as inspiration, but not as a goal to look like them. It won't happen. As you begin to progress with your training and nutrition, you'll begin to cultivate your own look, unique to your genetics. It 's more exciting and more attainable. :)

With that said, you seem to make many contradictory statements relating to the goals you currently have....you want to bulk and maximize muscle growth, yet restrict calories? :confused: You are doing an extensive amount of cardio? Don't know how many calories (or an approximation) you're consuming per day? Knowing what to eat/drink prior to and post workout are much simpler solutions in the overall scheme of things, but you'll have to address your overall nutrition/cardio/lifting program before you move ahead. Maybe you can assess another re-evaluation.

List a typical days worth of eating, and the members here can make initial suggestions to put you on track. Good luck! :tucool:

I guess I should have said he's my inspiration haha. Here's my work-out schedule and a typical day's food:

Monday - Legs/Shoulders
Hack squat 3x8
Leg press 3x8
Barbell squat 3x8 (lighter weight)
One-leg lunges 3x8
Leg extensions 3x8
Seated barbell shoulder press 3x8
Standing shoulder rows 3x8
Standing barbell raises 3x8

I superset each workout with a weighted ab exercise.

Tuesday
A.M HIIT run 1 minute sprint intervals x8

Wednesday - Back/Biceps
Horizontal rows 3x8 (2 hand positions)
Lat pull downs 3x8
Standing reverse butterflies 3x8
One-arm dumbbell rows 3x8 each arm
Seated machine rows 3x8
Standing barbell curls 3x8
Standing hammer curls 3x8
Standing barbell curls rolling the bar up my stomach 3x6-8
(If time permits) Pull-ups

Thursday
A.M HIIT run 1 minute sprint intervals x8

Friday - Chest/Triceps
Flat bench press 3x8
Incline bench press 3x8
Decline bench press 3x8
Horizontal butterflies 3x8
Dumbbell press 3x8
Dips 3x15
Skullcrushers 3x8
Tricep extensions (dumbbell) 3x10
Tricep extensions (machine) 3x8

Saturday
A.M HIIT run 1 minute sprint intervals x8

I also bike to and from campus 2-4 times daily, it's about a mile one way. I play racquetball when work and class aren't in the way.

Whoops - Typical day's food

Breakfast:
1 envelope oatmeal
1/2 cup egg beaters

Lunch:
Lean chicken breast w/ frozen veggies

Dinner:
Lean chicken or fish w/ veggies

I don't snack too often, but when I do it usually is light whole grain bread slices or a serving of nuts. My diet is really the last thing I'm worried about, besides enjoying my breads and pastas occasionally It's pretty dead on with meeting my daily intakes.

Restricting calories while hoping to maximize muscle growth makes no sense.

http://www.t-nation.com/findArticle.do?article=body_146mass

Follow the calculation steps in the article, and you'll be shocked. I know I was. For me, at 180 lbs, 9% BF, and 3 short freeweight workouts a week, I need 4,050 calories a day. You may weigh less, but your caloric needs could be similar due to all your cardio....and from that list it looks like you're barely in the 2000s. Since meeting requirements according to that calculator (and exceeding them by 100 kcal a day, actually), I've averaged 2.3 lbs of clean gain a week for 8 weeks. Before that, when I thought 3000-3300 was enough, I saw quick initial gains, but hardly anything after about 3-4 weeks.

Thanks for the website! I probably should have elaborated but I got lazy of typing. I usually eat several snacks throughout the day ranging from a cup of egg beaters to an 8oz protein shake or a cup and 1/2 of yogurt. I just had a diet analysis project in one of my nutrition courses and found out that I need to be taking in around 3,700 kcal to maintain weight.

Thanks for the website! I probably should have elaborated but I got lazy of typing. I usually eat several snacks throughout the day ranging from a cup of egg beaters to an 8oz protein shake or a cup and 1/2 of yogurt. I just had a diet analysis project in one of my nutrition courses and found out that I need to be taking in around 3,700 kcal to maintain weight.

Unless you are HIGHLY active or have a very high metabolism, at 170 lbs you are not likely to need 3700 calories to maintain.

That sounds about right...so in order to gain figure about 4000.

It helps to make a spreadsheet. It may seem anal, but accuracy and consistency are key. I have my diet listed, and in another area I can manipulate portion sizes to automatically retotal calories and prot/fat/carb percentages. A pain to set up, but easy to follow and no guesswork needed once it's done.

I also put that calculator into the spreadsheet...as my weight goes up, or workout scheme changes, I just enter the new numbers, get the new calorie total, then go to manipulate portion sizes until the new requirements are met on paper. Actually eating that much damn food is another matter... :blank:

That sounds about right...so in order to gain figure about 4000.

It helps to make a spreadsheet. It may seem anal, but accuracy and consistency are key. I have my diet listed, and in another area I can manipulate portion sizes to automatically retotal calories and prot/fat/carb percentages. A pain to set up, but easy to follow and no guesswork needed once it's done.

I also put that calculator into the spreadsheet...as my weight goes up, or workout scheme changes, I just enter the new numbers, get the new calorie total, then go to manipulate portion sizes until the new requirements are met on paper. Actually eating that much damn food is another matter... :blank:


IMO (and experience), in his current condition he'll add quite a bit of fat at 4k cal. I'd say start at ~2800 cal. and adjust every 7-days depending on progress.

IMO (and experience), in his current condition he'll add quite a bit of fat at 4k cal. I'd say start at ~2800 cal. and adjust every 7-days depending on progress.

True...in the follow-ups to that article, Berardi goes into detail on exactly how to get up to where you're supposed to be intake-wise. In my case, I didn't bother (didn't get around to reading the follow-ups until recently)--started right off where it said to in part 1, with no fat issues.

IMO (and experience), in his current condition he'll add quite a bit of fat at 4k cal. I'd say start at ~2800 cal. and adjust every 7-days depending on progress.
That sounds smarter to me.

Berardi's multipliers are different than the typically understood ones (http://www.healthrecipes.com/calories.htm):
Sedentary = BMR X 1.2 (little or no exercise, desk job)
Lightly active = BMR X 1.375 (light exercise/sports 1-3 days/wk)
Mod. active = BMR X 1.55 (moderate exercise/sports 3-5 days/wk)
Very active = BMR X 1.725 (hard exercise/sports 6-7 days/wk)
Extr. active = BMR X 1.9 (hard daily exercise/sports & physical job or 2X day training, i.e marathon, contest etc.)

Berardi's chart uses a multiplier of 1.5 to 1.6 for a desk job. :confused: Then he adds even more calories onto that for any activity that you do.

It really seems very likely that a person would gain A LOT of fat on those numbers.

Weird...those numbers closely match what I was on during my unsuccessful attempts at sustained gaining in the past. Berardi's have been effective, with minimal fat gain.

Weird...those numbers closely match what I was on during my unsuccessful attempts at sustained gaining in the past. Berardi's have been effective, with minimal fat gain.Sorry, I'm confused. Those numbers above are for maintenance. After applying the activity multipliers, you would need to add a constant in order to gain. Berardi increases the multiplier instead of adding a constant. Mathematically, that's potentially more sound, if larger people can add more muscle mass per month than smaller people. :confused:

Berardi's numbers are for maintenance as well, but they assume one isn't training every day (or at least with the same intensity every day). As he puts it, rather than having to stagger calories on a daily basis himself, the training cycles the calories for him, creating the surplus. So, you can eat the same thing every day and not worry about adaptation to a consistent daily level of intake.

Thanks for the information guys! I'm going to try and stick around 3,000kcal. To consume 4000kcal and still eat energy efficient foods I would have to take in a lot of fat even if it was in the form of mono/polyunsaturated and I'm meeting my goals on those nutrients in the form of fish and flax. I guess my only concern is my cardio: too much or too little?

I think you should look over your training regime... That is an (in my opinion) silly amount of volume, and a lot of redundant excercises being use, for example, what need do you have for tre different sorts of presses, and an additional three chest moves, not to mention the tricepswork in addition.

I hope someone that feels more qualified comes along and give you some touch-ups on that crazy program. I would probably just have used every third movement listed or so.

Oh, and put pull-ups first, and make them a priority.. Pull-ups are good!

Isn't Christian Bale just dreamy?

cheers

I think you should look over your training regime... That is an (in my opinion) silly amount of volume, and a lot of redundant excercises being use, for example, what need do you have for tre different sorts of presses, and an additional three chest moves, not to mention the tricepswork in addition.

I hope someone that feels more qualified comes along and give you some touch-ups on that crazy program. I would probably just have used every third movement listed or so.

I agree, especially re the legs. I don't see how anyone but a professional bodybuilder wouldn't be overtraining on that programme...

I mean I haven't noticed any injuries or prolonged soreness, it could just be that I'm young or I don't lift that heavy of weights.

I mean I haven't noticed any injuries or prolonged soreness, it could just be that I'm young or I don't lift that heavy of weights.

But are you making the progress you want to make? Sometimes, less is more.

I mean I haven't noticed any injuries or prolonged soreness, it could just be that I'm young or I don't lift that heavy of weights.

Depending on what you meant, that last part might pose a bit of a problem if you're looking to tack on lean body mass.

Did you mean relative to what you're personally capable of lifting pushed towards your limits, or relative to what others might be capable of? The first condition is vital; the second one isn't of any real concern.

Are you progressive in your loading week to week? With that many exercises, you'd probably have to pick your points where to concentrate your efforts on setting new personal bests.