John mentions in his food logs that he takes Lean Out tabs. I bought all of the supplements the one dosage that lean out contains to save some money. However I am finding that I take a lot of pills in one day to equate to the one dosage of lean out tabs.

My question is this: which ingredients of the lean out tabs are most important? I know L-Carnatine is the main supplement in Lean Out but which others play a critical role. I have all of the ingredients but just feel like I'm overdosing when I combine them with my multivitamin and other supplements like fish oil, flax oils, iron, etc. . .

The ingredients are as follows:
Vitamin B-12 100 mcg 1667%
Biotin 450 mcg 150%
Inositol 1000 mg
Choline Bitartrate 1000 mg
Chromium (as chromium picolinate) 200 mcg 167%
DL-Methionine 1000 mg
L Carnitine 600 mg
Betaine HcL 100 mg
Coenzyme Q-10 10 mg

Any help would be greatly appreciated. :-) Thanks

John mentions in his food logs that he takes Lean Out tabs. I bought all of the supplements the one dosage that lean out contains to save some money. However I am finding that I take a lot of pills in one day to equate to the one dosage of lean out tabs.

My question is this: which ingredients of the lean out tabs are most important? I know L-Carnatine is the main supplement in Lean Out but which others play a critical role. I have all of the ingredients but just feel like I'm overdosing when I combine them with my multivitamin and other supplements like fish oil, flax oils, iron, etc. . .

The ingredients are as follows:
Vitamin B-12 100 mcg 1667%
Biotin 450 mcg 150%
Inositol 1000 mg
Choline Bitartrate 1000 mg
Chromium (as chromium picolinate) 200 mcg 167%
DL-Methionine 1000 mg
L Carnitine 600 mg
Betaine HcL 100 mg
Coenzyme Q-10 10 mg

Any help would be greatly appreciated. :-) Thanks

ALCAR, Biotin, Coenzyme Q-10(especially if you use Red Yeast Rice).

Chromium seems to get a mixed reviews / bad rap.

Inositol is vitamin B-8, its in nuts and oranges.

Choline works with the B vitamins and metabolizes into Betaine.

Methionine helps with protein synthesis and requires B-12 to work, comes from Sesame Seeds among other things.


Based on those ingredients, I was able to put together a 2 month supply @ 5 pills over at customcapsule.com for ~$32 or an 8 month supply for ~$67. The only thing they didn't have was the Methionine. I would just get Sesamin (http://www.1fast400.com/p2151_Sesamin_Scivation.html) for that (sesame seed oil).

I don't know what the cost of the Lean Out tabs are or what you just paid for all of those together, but that seems like a decent deal.
Probably doesn't answer your question, but it seems that the folks at Lean Out put together a synergistic stack.
Nate

Thanks Nate. The Lean out tabs run about $32 for 30 servings however at 3-4 servings per day according to John's food log, this supply would not last long. I'm not sure which would be a better deal however I figured making my own would be cheaper. I use the vitamin world buy one get one free passport days on the first two days of the month so I end up paying 1/2 price for supplements.

I understand that a few of the ingredients are part of the B-12 vitamin and/or dependent on the others being there to provide their role. Are there are any that I should always take together to make sure the supplement is doing it's job?

What you are taking now will do almost nothing for fat loss.

Save some money and buy an effective product that works. Try Thermocin or Nitor from my company: www.atlargenutrition.com

Thanks Nate. The Lean out tabs run about $32 for 30 servings however at 3-4 servings per day according to John's food log, this supply would not last long. I'm not sure which would be a better deal however I figured making my own would be cheaper. I use the vitamin world buy one get one free passport days on the first two days of the month so I end up paying 1/2 price for supplements.

I understand that a few of the ingredients are part of the B-12 vitamin and/or dependent on the others being there to provide their role. Are there are any that I should always take together to make sure the supplement is doing it's job?


I don't know. Almost all of these aid in fat transport across the cell membrane and into the blood stream, thereby allowing you to 'burn' fat. Whether that really works in clinical studies remains to be seen.

Most studies show ALCAR does nothing for fat loss, but does aid in athlete recovery.

I would use PubMed.gov for study abstracts and research each of the ingredients and decide for yourself.


Here is one on Green Tea, Guarana and Kidney Bean Extracts.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/entrez?Db=pubmed&Cmd=ShowDetailView&TermToSearch=17052970&ordinalpos=6&itool=EntrezSystem2.PEntrez.Pubmed.Pubmed_ResultsP anel.Pubmed_RVDocSum


I don't think there is a 'magic pill'...

Nate

Do a search on glucomannan as well.

Here is some information about 7-Keto

Oh, and yes, Nitor has green tea, glucomannan, and 7-Keto at full dose!


It was recently announced that a newly published study in the peer-reviewed Journal of Nutritional Biochemistry revealed that 7-Keto reverses the decrease in Resting Metabolic Rate (RMR) normally associated with dieting and increases RMR above basal levels of overweight adults. RMR is the amount of calories that the body burns while at rest and accounts for approximately 70% of all calories burned in the average day.

In the United States today, over two-thirds of adults are classified as overweight, with approximately half of those adults considered obese.
Approximately 74% of Americans are attempting, most unsuccessfully, to lose or maintain body weight with major emphasis placed on manipulating diet and appetite. It is well documented that cutting calories results in a quick reduction in metabolic rate, which in turn makes it harder for dieting to be successful. Based on these facts, interest in ingredients that boost energy expenditure is increasing as they offer a new tool for consumers to apply to their program focused on maximizing weight loss. While the benefits of increasing metabolic rate are of great value to any weight loss program, consumer safety must also not be sacrificed. This has been an issue in the past as many products that increase metabolism do so via a stimulant mode of action.

This 5-week, randomized, double-blind, placebo-controlled, crossover trial of forty-five overweight adults (34 women, 11 men) on a calorie-restricted diet revealed that the administration of 7-Keto to overweight adults in conjunction with a calorie-restricted diet safely reversed the decline in RMR normally associated with dieting. In addition, 7-Keto also demonstrated an ability to increase RMR above basal levels without any stimulant mode of action and may benefit overweight and obese individuals with impaired energy expenditure. The study concluded that 7-Keto produced a statistically significant increase of 5.4% increase in RMR and no serious adverse events were encountered during any of the treatment periods.

7-Keto (3-acetyl-7-oxo dehydroepiandrosterone) is a naturally occurring substance produced by the body in the adrenal glands and its production declines with age. It is a non-stimulant, thermogenic agent that is clinically proven to increase metabolism and promote healthy weight loss.
7-Keto works naturally with the body to enhance the activity of three thermogenic enzymes - Glycerol-3-phosphate dehydrogenase, Malic Enzyme & Fatty Acyl CoA Oxidase. The up-regulation of these three key fat burning, thermogenic enzymes results in a higher metabolic rate and clinical studies have shown that administration of 7-Keto and produces 3 times more weight loss than diet & exercise alone.

The study results are both innovative and significant for the weight loss industry because 7-Keto is now the only non-stimulant fat-burner with published data proving it's ability to increase metabolic rate. In addition, the fact that 7-Keto can produce top shelf efficacy without any stimulant mode of action greatly enhances its value to the consumer in terms of safety. And lastly, the publication of this study further supports our corporate commitment to delivering products that are safe, effective and backed by rigorous clinical testing.

The Journal of Nutritional Biochemistry presents experimental nutrition research as it relates to biochemistry, n********istry, molecular biology, toxicology, physiology and pharmacology. Rigorous reviews by an international editorial board of distinguished scientists ensure publication of the most current and key research being conducted in nutrition at the cellular, animal and human level.

To read the entire article, click here.
<http://cts.vresp.com/c/?HumaneticsCorporatio/ea4fae6aba/5088efd327/fb72
6093
a2/path=A1x7b9x1y1x870x1x65y1x874x1x65y8x1335x8x1>

warnings

Do not use 7-Keto-DHEA if you are pregnant or nursing. Consult your doctor before using 7-Keto-DHEA. It is recommended that anyone considering using this supplement have their blood level of this hormone checked. Take this supplement only if your blood level of DHEA is low. 7-Keto-DHEA may increase the risk of developing certain hormone-related cancers, including prostate and breast cancer. Do not use 7-Keto-DHEA if you have or are already high-risk for any of these cancers. 7-Keto-DHEA may have additive adverse reactions when combined with prosteroids, steroids, or testosterone replacement therapy. It is not recommended that you combine 7-Keto-DHEA with these supplements or medications.
duration of use

7-Keto-DHEA supplementation is not recommended for long term use.
adverse reactions

7-Keto-DHEA may produce the following side effects: oily skin, acne, mood swings. Specifically in women, 7-Keto-DHEA may cause increased facial hair and deepening of the voice.
toxicity

None reported.
contraindications

7-Keto-DHEA may increase the risk of developing certain hormone-related cancers, including prostate, breast, uterine and ovarian cancers. Do not use 7-Keto-DHEA if you are already high-risk for any of these cancers.
pregnancy / nursing

Do not take 7-Keto-DHEA if you are pregnant or nursing.

There's some amazing work being done on ALCAR+ALA by Dr. Bruce Ames.. Not for fat loss but for rejuvenating mitochondria.

warnings

Do not use 7-Keto-DHEA if you are pregnant or nursing. Consult your doctor before using 7-Keto-DHEA. It is recommended that anyone considering using this supplement have their blood level of this hormone checked. Take this supplement only if your blood level of DHEA is low. 7-Keto-DHEA may increase the risk of developing certain hormone-related cancers, including prostate and breast cancer. Do not use 7-Keto-DHEA if you have or are already high-risk for any of these cancers. 7-Keto-DHEA may have additive adverse reactions when combined with prosteroids, steroids, or testosterone replacement therapy. It is not recommended that you combine 7-Keto-DHEA with these supplements or medications.
duration of use

7-Keto-DHEA supplementation is not recommended for long term use.
adverse reactions

7-Keto-DHEA may produce the following side effects: oily skin, acne, mood swings. Specifically in women, 7-Keto-DHEA may cause increased facial hair and deepening of the voice.
toxicity

None reported.
contraindications

7-Keto-DHEA may increase the risk of developing certain hormone-related cancers, including prostate, breast, uterine and ovarian cancers. Do not use 7-Keto-DHEA if you are already high-risk for any of these cancers.
pregnancy / nursing

Do not take 7-Keto-DHEA if you are pregnant or nursing.


Not sure where you got the above information.

Here, read the following:

Frequently Asked Questions
Find out more about 7-Keto

What is 7-Keto?
7-Keto is a natural substance produced by the body in our adrenal glands. Scientists and physicians believe 7-Keto plays an important role in up-regulating key thermogenic enzymes in the body, thereby enhancing resting metabolic rate. It has extensive clinical evidence supporting its ability to aid in weight loss. Other evidence points to the positive effects that 7-Keto may have on immune and brain function

Is 7-Keto related to the hormone DHEA? What is the difference between 7-Keto and DHEA?
7-Keto is a natural metabolite that is produced in the body from DHEA. Research scientists at the University of Wisconsin isolated the 7-oxo metabolite of DHEA and developed a method to produce it. Like DHEA, the levels of 7-Keto decline with age. 7-Keto is chemically distinct from DHEA and they are two completely different chemical entities. After 7-Keto is derived from DHEA, it cannot convert back to DHEA in the body. The chief difference between 7-Keto and DHEA is that 7-Keto cannot convert to other steroid hormones in the body.

Is 7-Keto a hormone?
No, 7-Keto is not a hormone. Hormones are chemical substances produced by the body that have a specific regulatory effect on the activity of a certain organ; usually through the interaction of the hormone with a specific receptor. Our research reveals that 7-Keto has no known receptor in the human body and no specific regulatory function.

Why do I need to take 7-Keto if my body makes it naturally?
As we age our natural production of this metabolite declines. This decline is most dramatic after the age of 30. By age 40, we produce only half as much 7-Keto as we did at age 20. This decline continues throughout the rest of our lives.

Where does 7-Keto come from?
7-Keto is made from plant sources. It is manufactured to a very high level of purity to look exactly like the 7-Keto your body produces.

Is 7-Keto natural?
We call 7-Keto “the most natural” of natural products. This is because it is naturally found in everyone’s body. By taking 7-Keto, you are simply putting back something that declines as we age.

How long has 7-Keto been around?
7-Keto was initially discovered in the human body in the 1950’s, however, its usefulness in weight loss was not discovered until the 1990’s by researchers at the University of Wisconsin.

Does 7-Keto have any side effects? Is 7-Keto safe?
7-Keto does not have any known side effects. It has been put through very rigorous testing to insure that it is safe. The safety testing was presented to the Food and Drug Administration for their review before this product was offered to the public. In our clinical studies there have been no reports of serious adverse events and since being on the market in 1998, there have been no reports of serious adverse events by consumers.

However, everyone is unique and certain individuals react differently to the same substance.

Does 7-Keto have any benefits beside weight loss?
Researchers have studied 7-Keto for other benefits including helping improve the immune system and improving memory.

What age do you have to be to take 7-Keto?
7-Keto has only been tested in adults and probably only has a beneficial effect as a supplement in individuals older than age 25, when the natural decline in 7-Keto begins to occur.

Can 7-Keto and DHEA be taken together?
Yes, both can be safely taken together but the combination is unnecessary unless hormonal effects of DHEA are desired. Any individual taking DHEA should consult with their physician.

Will 7-Keto affect my blood pressure?
In three clinical trials, 7-Keto has never shown any adverse effects on blood pressure. In one trial, blood pressure actually had a slight decline.

Does 7-Keto affect risks of cancer?
No

Have there been any controlled clinical trials using 7-Keto for weight loss?
Yes. There are two clinical trials using 7-Keto for weight loss at a dose of 200 mg per day. Both of these studies have been published in peer-reviewed scientific journals. Each of these studies were double blind and placebo controlled and performed in population of overweight men and women over a period of 8 weeks. The results of each study confirm that administration of 7-Keto at a dose of 100 mg twice daily when combined with a program of diet and exercise will result in a three-fold increase in weight loss and fat loss compared to placebo. There have been three other placebo-controlled studies investigating the effectiveness of 7-Keto in weight management. Two of these studies evaluated 7-Keto in a formulation that included other active ingredients. The third study confirmed the ability of 7-Keto in increase metabolism - even when dieting.

Is 7-Keto derived from animal sources?
No, it is made from plant sources. It is manufactured to a very high level of purity to look exactly like the 7-Keto your body produces. It would be suitable for both vegetarians and vegans.

How does 7-Keto work to enhance weight loss?
7-Keto works naturally with your body to enhance the activity of three key fat burning (thermogenic) enzymes. The up-regulation of these key enzymes provides a higher metabolic rate during periods of calorie restriction and diet modification. 7-Keto works with a program of diet and exercise to accelerate weight and fat loss by 200% over the same period of time compared to comperable dieting and exercise while taking a placebo pill.

Are there any drug or supplement interactions with 7-Keto?
7-Keto will not interact adversely with other diet supplements or weight loss aids. 7-Keto will also not interact with common medications for blood pressure control or blood lipid control. 7-Keto has no interaction with Synthroid or other thyroid medications. Since 7-Keto is very structurally similar to DHEA, it may have the ability to inhibit platelet aggregation (similar to Aspirin) and caution should be used if you are taking blood thinners like Coumadin™. You should consult your physician before taking and dietary supplement and before starting any new weight loss programs.

How much weight can I expect to lose with 7-Keto?
7-Keto should be used in conjunction with a program of diet and exercise since this is the healthiest way to lose weight. Our clinical studies have been designed to include 7-Keto into a healthy program of diet and exercise and the average weight loss in these studies was 6 pounds in 8 weeks and 80% of the weight lost by these individuals was body fat. Some of the subjects in these clinical trials lost as much as 22 pounds in 8 weeks. Weight loss in the range of 1-2 pounds per week is considered healthy and studies have shown that weight loss greater than this average typically ends in diet failure and regain of weight.

Is 7-Keto an anabolic steroid?
No. 7-Keto is not an anabolic or an androgenic steroid. Unlike DHEA, it does not convert to testosterone or other anabolic steroids in the body. Also our research has revealed that 7-Keto itself is not able to interact with the androgen receptor in the body, thereby assuring that it has no ability to produce androgenic or anabolic effects in the body.

Is 7-Keto a steroid hormone precursor?
No. 7-Keto does not convert to any steroids that have any hormone related characteristics. Particularly, 7-Keto does not convert to any androgenic, anabolic or estrogenic hormones.

Does 7-Keto contain any stimulants like ephedra?
No. 7-Keto is a very purified single molecular compound that itself has no cardiac or central nervous system stimulating characteristics. There is not ephedra or ephedrine in 7-Keto. In our clinical studies, no adverse events related to stimulating side effects were reported. Also, since being on the market to consumers there have been no reports of stimulating side effects from taking 7-Keto in the past 4 years and with over 180 million doses sold.

Will 7-Keto affect my testosterone, estrogen or DHEA levels?
No. 7-Keto is chemically distinct from testosterone, estrogen and DHEA and will not affect the blood levels of these steroids hormones. Also, our research has confirmed that 7-Keto does not convert to testosterone, estrogen or DHEA in the body.

When is the best time of day to take 7-Keto?
7-Keto is best taken in divided doses two times daily. We usually suggest that the doses be spaced about 8 hours apart. 7-Keto may be taken with or without a meal.

Does 7-Keto have any effect on T3, one of the thyroid hormones?
No. One clinical study for weight loss showed a slight elevation in T3 (within the normal range) in the subjects taking 7-Keto. Subsequent clinical studies have shown no effect on T3 compared to placebo or compared to baseline values in the subjects taking 7-Keto. Therefore, there is no convincing positive or negative effect on T3 in individuals taking 7-Keto at 200 mg per day.

Will 7-Keto affect my appetite/Is 7-Keto an appetite suppressant?
7-Keto acts by a completely different mechanism. 7-Keto is a thermogenic supplement, which means it helps your body convert stored fat to heat energy at a faster rate than if you were just cutting calories. When 7-Keto is part of your dieting plan, severe calorie restriction is not required but rather eating a well balanced healthy diet. In our clinical studies, the subjects taking 7-Keto were eating 1800 calories per day and exercising for one hour three times weekly and they lost three times more weight and body fat than the group taking only a placebo pill.

Do I have to change my diet while taking 7-Keto?
Most people gain weight because they are eating the wrong kind of food or are eating too much food. If you are like most Americans, you will have to make some minor changes in your diet to allow your body to shift into “fat burning” mode. Calorie restriction is one of the key elements in any weight loss program but this calorie restriction does not have to be painful. We suggest you reduce your calories to 1800 per day, eat 4-5 meals per day and structure your meals so that your daily intake consists of 45% carbohydrates, 35% protein, and 30% fat.

Do I have to exercise while taking 7-Keto?
Exercise is an important part of any weight loss plan for several reasons; (1) it allows your body to burn more calories, (2) it helps maintain and increase the amount of lean muscle that you have, ultimately increasing your metabolic rate, (3) it helps to tone your muscles so that you look better at your new lower weight, (4) it helps your cardiovascular system circulate more blood and vital nutrients to your muscles and other organs which aids in the fat burning process, and (5) it helps you feel better about your body and yourself and motivates you to continue with your weight loss efforts. The amount of exercise you do is up to you, but the secret is to “get moving”. Even walking three times weekly greatly aids your chances of success.

What if I stop taking 7-Keto after I’ve reached my desired weight, will I gain all my weight back?
Losing and maintaining your weight is not as easy as taking a pill. There are no magic bullets. 7-Keto helps accelerate your weight loss so that you can achieve your goal weight faster and healthier. The key to maintaining your new lower weight lies in your ability to put the principles of healthy eating and exercise into your daily life. Eating a healthy diet keeps your body in balance and exercising regularly helps to build new metabolically active muscle, which helps you to maintain your new lower weight long-term.





(c) 2004, All Rights Reserved

Oh, and here is a more comprehensive PDF file:

http://www.humaneticsingredients.com/ittrium/reference/7KetoBrochure05.pdf?path=A1x7b9x1y1xac9x1x65y1xacd x1x65y8xb17x8x1


The first regulatory finding:

http://www.fda.gov/ohrms/dockets/dockets/95s0316/rpt0014_01.pdf