"No matter" how hard I try, I always seems to end up at 10-15% fat(most, if not all from olive oils etc)

I'm obviously at a plataeu, and I've been there for like a month. I did put on some weight in my easter holliday, but I'm sure most of it is water, as I've lost 3 of the 4 lbs I gained in less than a week.

I just can't seem to break the plateau, and it's dam annoying. A typical week for me is:

Upper body weighlifting: twice a week, 40 mins each day(will add leg-day next week)
Biking to work 5 times a week, 35-40 mins each day

Which is:
80 mins weighlifting a week
3-3.5 hours of biking each week(minimum)

My estimate is that I burn 2800-2900 k cal a day. Is this correct? I'm 29, and my stats are in my sig.

Caloric intake: 1700-1900 k cal
above 40% carb, above 40% protein, below 15% fat

Carbs are from pasta, oatmeal and bread and veggies
Protein from whey protein, chicken breast and tuna
Fat from oils.

I never cheat. Never has, and never will. Fridays and saturdays, I usually have 1 to 3 bottles of beer(0.3 - 1 liters), but that's it.

What am I missing here??? :confused:

What am I missing here??? :confused:
You're missing variation in your workouts. Your body has become accustomed to your routine and has reached a steady-state. Our bodies are constantly resisting change and seeking a steady-state. I plateau easily and the only way I can prevent it is from mixing it up every 4 weeks. I even make changes every week as I add weight to my weight training.

Try changing routines every 4 weeks or so. You could either change the types of exercises or vary the number of reps and weight. You could also benefit from doing weight training on your legs. Start doing squats and straight-leg dead lifts (be sure to follow strict form to prevent injury!). They not only train the legs but also the abs and core helping to increase your overall body strength and fitness.

Working your upper-body twice a week is okay as long as each workout is different. One day work chest, shoulders, and triceps. The other work back and biceps.

You mentioned bread and pasta -- Is this whole grain? You might consider cutting that out and substituting brown rice.

I have never coached a client to consume less than 20 - 25 percent from fats. I find that it raises metabolism, improves recovery, stifles cravings, and just has so many benefits that I can't imagine going below that.

On the flipside, Keith Klein is one of the top nutritionists in possibly the world - he has coached many bodybuilders and was the nutritionist for Lee Labrada. His competition diets keep fat to a MAXIMUM of 10% - and he gets VERY effective results, so obviously I can't say that 10% is the culprit because I've witnessed people gain muscle and lose fat doing that.

My personal opinion is that losing fat is more calorie manipulation - i.e. zig-zagging calories and adding variety to your workouts, etc - rather than macronutrient ratios, because I've seen people succeed with any number of ratios. However, I am focused mroe on the HEALTH than the weight loss aspect, and I KNOW that having a higher percentage of fats is healthier, so I don't dally with the 10%.

Jeremy

ok, you said I miss variation.

Typical weightliftingdays:

Day1:
chest/triceps/shoulders and abs

Day2:
Back and biceps and abs

Different routine every 4 weeks

Like I said, I'm gonna add leg-day from next week, doing leg-press, leg extention and leg curl/deads. Hard and heavy, of course, just the way I like it :tu:

The biking to work is routine, but I do take a longer spin once a week or so, maybe for 40-60 mins.

I also go on a hike, skiing or something like that with 40-60lbs on my back quite often in the weekends(1-3 times a month), so I get variation that way too.

Forgot to mention that I drink about 2-3 liters of water each day, plus a few cups of black coffee...not that it probably matters too much, but still...

Bread is whole grain, the pasta is not, but i's high quality pasta with less than 65g carb per 100 in it. They're not as complex as oatmeal or wholegrain bread, though.

Generally, I see my self as a very healthy and active guy, strong as hell, but I want to get rid of about 5-6 kg fat, and get back to the fitnesslevel I was at 7 years ago. (I'm at about 16-17% bf now and want to get down to about 10%)

"I have never coached a client to consume less than 20 - 25 percent from fats. I find that it raises metabolism, improves recovery, stifles cravings, and just has so many benefits that I can't imagine going below that. "

That would result in me almost litterally drowning my food in olive oil...how's that even possible? I mean, I really make it an effort to get as much as 15%, and you're talking about 25%? :confused:

"My personal opinion is that losing fat is more calorie manipulation - i.e. zig-zagging calories and adding variety to your workouts, etc "

Ok, I can be very creative when it comes to working out, I have a shitload of options, so that won't be a problem at all. I'm just at loss when it comes to my diet...care to elaborate on your "zig-zagging"?

Is is even remotely possible that it is the few beers holding me back? If so, they are so gone from my diet :nod:

Ah, the joys of fat loss!

First, I find it very easy to consume fats. Where I see people going out of their way to toss egg yolks and eat like 5 or 7 egg whites, I just consume 3 or 4 whole eggs. I consume raw peanut or almond butter. For my shakes, while I don't use milk, I will add heavy whipping cream or flaxseed oil (I actually use an oil blend). Olive oil is definitely a staple on salads. It's not hard to add fats at all!

As for the beer, I have to completely cut out beer for 2 - 4 weeks in order to cut down to around 7% (the occassional glass of red wine, i.e. 1 or 2 per week, doesn't seem to stall my progress). On the other hand, my friend Tony Wild drinks like a fish, benches 250 for over 10 reps and is about 8 or 9 percent body fat ... so go figure!

As for zig-zagging your calories, again, hard for me to say. Many people do it on paper, I prefer to be more precise. I find whatever it takes to lose my target amount - let's say I'm on 1900 calories. I use DietPower software to track my metabolism so I know EXACTLY what I need to burn - none of this guessing stuff. Anyway, what happens is that as I diet, inevitably my metaoblism slows and suddenly I find I am budgetted 1700 calories and then 1500 etc. To a point, I'll add cardio or other exercise to keep my calories up to at least 8x my body weight (there is nothing magic about this number, just one I picked to make things easy for me). At 200 that would be 1600 calories (typically a 1000 calorie budget + 600 calories of burned energy = 1600 calories I can take in). Once I get that low, then I take a week where I maintain my weight. So if I am at 1600 calories, and losing 1 pound per week, this means I jump into a week where I consume 2100 calories per day. This is the "zig" I do to compensate for my weight-loss zag. After that week, where I don't gain or lose, then I start the process over and find my metabolism has raised a good 200 - 300 points so I can continue losing again at higher calories (1800 or 1900, for example).

I have an article that covers this but it does have affiliate links and that disappointed a few others so I tried to summarize it as best as I can here.

Jeremy

Honestly I was freaking out about plateauing a few days ago and finally admitted that I really can't be having alcohol on the weekends. I was alloting myself calories for the alcohol itself and not eating when I was drinking, but it just didn't matter. Although 1-3 beers is a good bit less than what I was drinking, the general idea is that its pretty terrible for weight loss. I would suggest getting the variation in your routine. There are a whole slew of exercises you could use to replace the ones in your lifting days (not different muscle groups just different means to an end) and that would be a big help. 2-3 liters of water is far more than most people but I would imagine you could stand to drink more, not sure if that is directly related to fat loss but it couldnt hurt. And what about trying to vary your ride to work - doing it all in a higher/lower gear, or doing it in intervals of sprinting/going slow. Do you think you are really getting an effective workout on your way to work? Can you measure your HR to find out? These are the things I would think about, hope it helps.

Is is even remotely possible that it is the few beers holding me back? If so, they are so gone from my diet :nod:

Quite possibly. Here are some points about alcohol:


Alcohol interferes directly with the body's use of nutrients
Alcohol inhibits testosterone production
Presented with both fat and alcohol, your body stores the comparatively harmless fat and rids itself of the toxic alcohol by burning it off as fuel
Alcohol yields 7 calories per gram, so alcoholic drinks are much more fattening than nonalcoholic ones
Upon exposure to alcohol, the liver speeds up its synthesis of fatty acids


And if you're not getting many fats in the first place, your testosterone production may not be 100% anyway.

How long have you been "cutting"? You could try a bulking phase for a while. This will do two things: 1) add variation and throw your metabolism a curve ball, and 2) add muscle (another way of decreasing %BF) which will change your metabolism.

I have an article that covers this but it does have affiliate links and that disappointed a few others so I tried to summarize it as best as I can here.

I couldn't care less about affiliate links. If the article is good, I'll read. If it helps me loose fat, that's great. If I don't like the links on your site, or any site for that matter, I don't click them. plain and simple.

So...post away or PM me :tu:

What I might try is to increase the fat, reduce the carbs, and try to keep the proteins at the current level...kinda like a "keto light" to see what happens, and I'll also try that zig-zagging if you give me that link.

I won't be drinking anything this weekend, cause I'm going on a hike, and I'll see if I can be "bothered" to not drink next weekend too. Certainly won't hurt to try;)

Bo: As for the biking, it's a plain 20 min. routine each way, no real workout. I do push it quite hard on my way back, so I do break a sweat, but it's not like a HIIT or anything. HR is probably close to 70%.

I think 3 liters of water is sufficient, but 4 liters would be possible, although I don't really see the point going beyond what I already drink.

PecMan: The only place I want to add mass is my upper body, as I have more than big enough legs already, which is why I have up till now only worked out my upper body. :flex:

I was cutting from August -03 to November -03 and lost about 15 kg(33lbs). Then I started again in jan 16th, and I've lost 7kg(15lbs) more so far.

I just had a 1 week maintainance during my easter holliday, gained a few lbs, but they're almost gone now, less than a week after.

Bo: As for the biking, it's a plain 20 min. routine each way, no real workout.

:spaz: No real workout??? I think it's wonderful that you ride your bike to work, but I'm just trying to explore the possibility that it's not the cardio workout that you really need. 70% HR on the way home sounds cool, but only 20 minutes, and not 70% on the way to work? Seeing as how you are already in great shape (I have seen your pics and heard your descriptions) I would imagine that to nail that last bit of fat you are going to need a real cardio workout. I don't know what the specifics of your lifestyle are but I'm sure you've read enough around here to know what a good cardio workout is and how to get one. To repeat, I really do think it's great that you are riding your bike, and I'd encourage you to continue - I hate everything that goes along with oil and gas consumption. But does it qualify as 3-3.5 hours of cardio a week?

EDIT: For some reason I couldn't get this simple sentence together but my point was attempting to be: keep the bike ride to work but look to add additional cardio

But does it qualify as 3-3.5 hours of cardio a week

If I'm gonna be very strict, no. Only the way back would, which is about 1.5 hours a week HIIT "light".

I have a spinning bike at home, and I could easily add 1 or 2 30-40 mins HIIT spinning sessions right after I get home once or twice a week or take a ride in the forest I bike through anyway once or twice a week.

One hour in the forest will suck out all your energy and then some :D (imo equivalent to about 2-3 hours on the road...very intense)

No way I'm gonna stop biking to work. For several reasons:
1. It's great
2. I don't know when and where the bus stops or goes(no need to, as I bike without any exceptions)
3. I don't have a car, cause:
4. I don't even have a drivers licence cause I don't need it :tu:

Try a handful of almonds or unsalted peanuts daily to up your current fat intake to 20-25%. I tbsp of natural peanut butter w/ some celery is good too. I love roasted almonds...I'm practically addicted to them.

Duckman:

I'd say your 2900 daily need is just about right.

Two, maybe three suggestions:

1. Lose the alcohol. Sludge is right. It messed me up in the early days.
It's not really the calorie count of alcohol, it slows the metabolism of fat. (An MD told me that)

2. Double check your numbers on your daily intake. Are you sure that you're adding in everything ?? I know I found that when I wasn't making the progress I had expected, I got tougher on measuring my food, and found out that I was consuming more than I was counting.

3. Perhaps you could add a little more activity to your weekly schedule.
(although I just viewed your skiing pics, and those have to be good for 7,000-8000 cal. burned !!)

It's always good to boost up the metabolism periodically to keep the plateaus in check.


That's it for me. Looks like you're making great progress. Sometimes, I think, folks (myself included) just get impatient.

:gl:

I did a review of my measuring method about a month ago, and discovered that I actually count too many calories, and upped my diet by about 200k cal after that.

I think it's pretty damn accurate, and I litterally weigh almost everything I eat, however, I use "standards" for a few items, like one slice of bread is 50 grams, chicken breast filets are 150 grams etc. I've done spot tests, and it has proven to be right on spot every time.

Like you said, those skiing pics should be good for quite a few calories burned, but I think 5-6000 k cal is more accurate, but it's still a shitload for one day :D

The hikes I'm doing in the weekends are most likely typical 4-6000 k cal burned a day, so that should help boosting my metabolism.

My progress so far has been incredible, and really motivating, both on the first keto diet I did as well as the "regular diet" I'm doing now, I just hate when the fat just sits there on my gut going "na-na-na-na-na-na - I won't go awa-ay!" :whistle:

Upon exposure to alcohol, the liver speeds up its synthesis of fatty acids


This sounds like a good property, but you've lumped it in with all those other bad properties, so I'm inclined to think it's bad as well. Could you clarify precisely what this means?

Hey if you have to drink, drink clean!. Just as with the food we stuff our selves with. Drink vodka, or even better 90% alcohol for medical use. Mix it with any kind of light non sugar drink, and you won´t consume as much calories as if you´re drinking beer.

1 bottle of vodka (70 cl) = 70 x 9 cals/centiliter = 630 kcal

1 6-7% beer = somewhere around 200-300 kcal depending on brand.

So what makes you happier.... drinking 3 beers and walking home half way through, or consuming the whole bottle of vodka...

Then as mentioned above, alcohol itself is harful to your body, but at least you won´t have to panik over the calorie intake :p

I drink beer because I love beer, and I certainly dont get a buzz from 1 to 3 bottles of it. I love chips and coke, but I haven't eaten chips or had a coke in 8 months. Not once.

If that is what it takes, I have no problem stop drinking beer as well :tu:

I still regularly drink alcohol and have been consistently losing 2-4 pounds a week for several months. I cut right down, but I still have say 3 or 4 pints of beer a week, a couple of glasses of wine and a whisky most nights.

oooh...don't get me started on the whisky...got 10 bottles of it at home, but I hardly touch the stuff....Balvenie single barrel 25yo, Lagavulin destillers edt. 20 yo, Springbank, Talisker, Oban...the good stuff :tu:

My weight loss had slowed down to about 0.5 lbs per week. I really wasn't unhappy with that since I'd already lost 50 lbs over the past 5 months. Also, I was seeing improvements in my weekly body measurements, losing about 0.5% bf each week. I'm currently at 15% bf.

I really wasn't trying to change my rate of progress but I did two things differently. Ten days ago, I downloaded the Diet Power software that Jeremy talks about (Thanks for the tip, Jeremy, I love it!). For the first time ever, I started logging and carefully measuring my food intake. I was surprised to discover that I was actually undereating! I'm having a really hard time eating as much as the software tells me to eat. My problem was that I had been getting most of my carbs from green vegetables and it's hard to get enough carbs that way. I added a lot of brown rice and barley to my diet to increase the calories.

The second thing I did was to finally take a week off from weight training. I'm one of those people who always think "more is better" and I'd been weight training for three months without a break. I have two more days before my one week break is over and it's just killing me! I found that I'm addicted to the gym.

Anyway, the unexpected result of all of this is that I've lost 5 lbs over the past 10 days. It scares me a little because that's faster than I want to lose weight. I'm not sure what to do about it as I'm literally stuffing myself with food to follow the Diet Power recomendations. I guess the moral of the story is that you have to change things up occasionally.

oooh...don't get me started on the whisky...got 10 bottles of it at home, but I hardly touch the stuff....Balvenie single barrel 25yo, Lagavulin destillers edt. 20 yo, Springbank, Talisker, Oban...the good stuff :tu:


Mmmmmmmm single malt. Me too mate. i will never stop drinking that. I'd rather be fat!

the Diet Power software that Jeremy talks about Yeah hey where can you get that?, is it a freeware?. does anyone know any good diet freewares?