I am definitely down and out on the whole weight loss thing. I am still doing my workouts with the same consistency and gusto. During the week I am extremely meticulous and successful in charting what I eat and making sure it's appropriate. During the weekends I get in like 1.5 nights of drinking, making room in my diet for the extra calories, not eating crap after getting drunk, and it seems to completely negate all the work I do. I have been at this weight since I bought my scale, 3-4 weeks ago. I know that drinking is bad, and I have probably underestimated how bad, but I can't imagine that it's holding me back this much. I just don't know what to do. I have made revisions and improvement on my diet and its on point, not worth changing again before I have any idea of how well it settles. I am just furious that these weeks have been in vain. I desperately want to lose this weight, as bad as anyone else here, and I have made so many of the major changes in my lifestyle successfully. I see people succeeding all around me and I'm happy for them but deeply jealous. I have been making good improvements in my lifting and think I can see better definition, but that's nothing new for me, and that's never been difficult - hence it's not entirely rewarding. I am coming to terms with the fact that this is going to be a much longer than 3 month process. I am planning on how I can incorporate all these good habits once I move back home and then once I'm at school. But in the next three months, I plan on moving back in mid July, I NEED to see results. Not for this journal, not for the pictures thread, but for myself. I have tried and failed too many times. I need some serious and tangible results in order to keep my head in the game and my heart on the right track. I want this, bad.

This is my journal post from today. I am like teeming with anger over the whole situation. I never wanted to post anything just to get my frustration out but I couldn't hold back on this one. My gut that was so wonderfully diminishing just seems to be plumper than ever. I guess I just wanted to hear myself talk (or... read myself write?) but I feel like I just gotta put this out before I drive myself crazy

I'm not quite sure if you want anybody to answer that, but I will.

Drinking will not only make it harder to lose weight (since drinking is a wonderful way of getting far too many calories), it will also destroy what you're working for in the gym. Mixing alcohol and training is NOT the way to go. You might be gaining strength, but I doubt that it's because of bigger muscles. It's more likely the adaptation of the muscle, that you're "teaching" more muscle fibres to react, that increases your strength. For all I know, seeing better definition could be just a psychological reaction. You know that you're working out, and because of that you believe that your body is changing.

I'm not trying to be a complete bitch (even though I'm succeeding), but if you're serious about changing your body, cut the drinking out. Ask yourself what's most important: drinking, or changing your body.

You might be gaining strength, but I doubt that it's because of bigger muscles

Now that is pretty cynical...particularly with such limited info given above.

My belief is that if your body can lift more weight...and do more reps with more weight...that your are stronger period. The only way to get significantly stronger is to increase muscles mass and density. Both are gains in lean mass.

While I totally do not discredit your idea that you can force your muscles to adapt, I would like to think that a gain is just that..a gain......and no need to second guess where it comes from.

I know that drinking is bad, and I have probably underestimated how bad, but I can't imagine that it's holding me back this much.

Starting out on my weight loss, the ONLY change I made was to stop drinking. I was SHOCKED at how easily the weight came off just because of that one little thing. (I was drinking about 6 rum and 7-up a week, plus about 6 colas. I swapped them all for water and diet cola.)

After a while, I decided I wanted to make a BIGGER change. So I needed to be even more careful about what I put in my mouth. The less cake I eat, the tighter my tummy will be.

Some days, the tight tummy wins, some days the cake wins.

Right now, you want the drink more than you want the weight loss. It's pretty simple.

The only way to get significantly stronger is to increase muscles mass and density.
I may be cynical, but you're wrong in this statement. Nobody uses their muscles to their full potential. There are always unused muscle fibres that can be "taught" to react, as I stated in my previous post. It's basic biology.

A gain should be questioned, if more lean mass is what you're actually aiming for. Of course, if you're a top athlete trying to achieve greatness, a gain is a gain, that's true, but if a leaner body is the goal, then a gain might be of less importance, unless it's muscle growth.

Gains can be debated, but I surely hope that you can agree with me that drinking once or twice every weekend is not good for any progress. That was my main point...

I see people succeeding all around me and I'm happy for them but deeply jealous.

I had a bad week last week, when I realized that in order to look how I wanted to look, I'd have to work MUCH harder than I had intended to work. It's depressing to realize that something is not as easy as you thought it would be.

This forum environment makes it difficult because it's full of motivated people who are mostly committed to making big changes. Don't think about how well you are doing compared to how other people are doing, think about how well you are doing compared to how well you WERE doing.

Thanks for the advice, Guava especially. The whole thing was a little drama queen I must admit, coming off a long weekend and being at work generally makes me feel like crap (and I'm sure nobody can relate to that...) I am still going at it so I really can't complain in the grand scheme, I guess I just needed a little help and thats exactly what I got. Thanks for the replies.

I desperately want to lose this weight

I'm going to sound like a hard-ass for a minute, so forgive me. Is what you wrote above really true? I'm with Guava that right now your 1.5 nights of drinking IS a bigger priority for you than losing weight. I would get out a piece of paper and number your priorities in life. For me it would be something like this:

1) My relationship with my fiance and my family
2) Doing my best in school/preparing for my career
3) Improving my health and appearance
4) Having a good social life
5) Everything else

Then focus your mind on your top three priorities. If your health is as important to you as you say it is, you need to stop making excuses. Getting in shape is a worthwhile endeavor, and anything worthwhile takes effort. There is no need to be envious of the others on this forum. They are just like you, only they have made the necessary sacrifices to make their dream a reality.

Enough hard-ass now :D Bo, I believe you can do this. You have it in you--we all do--you just need to act on your intuition.

I'm with you, Bo Jones. You want to lose weight and you want to drink. No soul-searching needed. I've had some questions about alcohol and dieting, too, but within these parameters: you don't bust your daily calorie limit with the drinks, and you don't eat more after the drinks. It would seem to make sense that as long as you stay under your caloric needs for the day and don't pig out after a night out, alcohol shouldn't matter. I did some research, and I'm having a hard time getting a straight story.

One dieting web site (http://www.oregoncounseling.org/ArticlesPapers/Documents/ETOHBIOFx.htm) says:

Drinking causes a steep rise in the blood sugar; the pancreas responds by producing insulin which causes a fast drop in blood sugar and the symptom of low blood sugar or hypoglycemia.

okay, so resist eating...

Which is why Atkins bans it:
the initial 2-week ban on wine really has nothing to do with the carbs in wine. Wine is actually very low-carb. The ban is because drinking alcohol tends to make your blood-sugar levels jump around, which can make you feel hungry and crave sweets.

Another says:
...a major US survey has found that dieters who give up alcohol lose no more weight than dieters who include moderate amounts of alcohol in their diet.

WebMd says:
alcohol calories add up just like any other calories do.

but another said:
Calories in alcohol are used before stored fat calories.

it's this last opinion that I'm trying to track down and get more information on.

Can you exchange regular calories for alcohol calories? Or does alcohol do some evil work like preventing you from benefiting from the calorie defecit you so carefully planned? Still trying to find an answer to this.

hey bo, is your avatar glacius from killer instinct?

My belief is that if your body can lift more weight...and do more reps with more weight...that your are stronger period. The only way to get significantly stronger is to increase muscles mass and density. Both are gains in lean mass.

I kinda agree with Knubb. Just because a person has great muscle mass and density doesn't necessarily mean that they'll be equally as strong. I have personally seen a power lifter that was substantially smaller than one of the competitive bodybuilders at one of my old gyms back in Lexington, KY. The power lifter had always lifted for strength and was much stronger than the bodybuilder. I used to talk to them both and they both gave me some pretty good pointers from each of their points of view. They each trained for different purposes. One for strength and one for muscle size and definition and both competed.

I once read somewhere that we only use about 30-40% of working muscles potential, so, yeah, I'm sure there are ways to stimulate more muslce fibers; thus giving that particular muscle being worked more strength. One way was to give the working muscle tiny electrical shocks as resistance repitions were being performed which increased the muscles useage to around 60-70%. Hmmm, interesting idea! Here, let me shock myself while I bang out some more reps!!:D

Bo how much ar you drinking when you gou out to party? Are you drinking beer or liquor?

I gained 30 lbs. my freshman year in college!!!! This was ALL from pounding the brew. I have never packed on the pounds like I did in that 6 month period. Drinking does hold you back. The problem is, you are young and probably enjoying your prime partying years like I did. If you want this bad enough, you have to make the sacrifice. If you are doing a day and a half worth of drinking on beer you are pushing an intake of 2000 calories on liquid alone. This might be the source of the backslide you feel that you are taking.

Anytime that you feel like giving up, that is the moment you try even harder! We all want to see you successful in your goal.

Drinking causes a drop in testosterone levels, and fat metabolism.

Not good in any situation....bulking or cutting.

it also dehydrates your cells, also not good for either bulking or cutting. Quit drinking. You can drink when you are skinny, but when you are skinny you probably will find that you aint need the booze like you do now.

What do you want more, a good hard drunk, or a good hard body?

(sorry to be so harsh, but that's pretty much it...)

listen if you have to drink.... i mean if like its a social event and everyone else is, and it is tempting... drink liquor...

i mean before i started dieting i would go out and drink bud light... even though it is LIGHT, it is still beer...

so, this past weekend, we went out and I drank both nights... i drank diet vanilla pepsi and vanilla vodka... I ate a meal less that I normally do to save room for it...

and i still managed to loose 1.5 pounds over the weekend... :claplow: maybe just try liquor with a diet drink if you HAVE too... that is the only diet drink i have even drank since I started my diet 3 weeks ago...

Is the alcohol really that good? I guess you just have to ask yourself how bad you want a hard body.

I look at drinking like this. Calories are empty worthless so why consume them? If you are not consuming enough calories that is calories with nutrition your body goes into starvation mode and you can't lose the fat. I don't think you can exchange calories of good food with empty calories of booze, otherwise we could just eat snicker bars all day as long as we keep the calories at or below our mantiance level. I think not.

I do however enjoy a glass of wine each week for the specific benifit of my heart. Any other alcohol will do the job just as well studys have shown so don't cut it out completly but have a drink and switch to club soda on the rocks with a twist if your friends get too obnoxious after a wile because they are slobering drunk you can sit back and think about who your friends are and why they are your friends and perhaps you should look for some new friends that have fun doing things that don't involve drinking. There are a lot of things to do that don't focus on drinking. Scuba diving, Bike riding, Rock Climbing, Water Ski, snow ski, hiking, bodybuilding, to name a few.

There really is a reason that they call it a "beer gut". Beer is very high on the Glycemic Index. It's as bad as it gets for weight loss. I was drinking one to three beers per day and even more than that on Saturdays when I was home all day. Beer is the first thing I cut out when I started my transformation last October. The weight started dropping like a rock. I'll admit that I also cleaned up my diet and started cardio and weight training so I did much more than simply cutting out the beer although that was a big step in cleaning up the diet.

I'll agree that no drinking at all is the best approach to weight loss. If you want to do both, switch to red wine. I'll drink several glasses of red wine maybe once a week and that doesn't seem to be slowing me down much.

PS: I did more than my fair share of college age drinking so I'll stifle the parental instinct of lecturing you on underage drinking. ;)

Is the alcohol really that good? I guess you just have to ask yourself how bad you want a hard body.

Oh my goodness!

Everyone is so hard on this drinking!!!

You know what? Drink if you want. It IS important to you. So what? People say "If you want to lose weight, you have to stop eating fatty desserts." When I started my healthier body journey, I was not willing to give up fatty desserts. The closer I get to an ideal body, the more willing I am to make sacrifices to keep my physique, and so, each day, my consumption of unhealthy foods is reduced.

You don't NEED to stop drinking if you don't want to. (You're just not allowed to complain about how you're not making very good progress any more. ;) )

Bo I know exactly what you're going through and it's tough as hell. All my buddies are the hard-drinking, get completely obliterated the whole weekend type. And the whole cutting calories/replacing beer w/liquor & diet cola may work for a while, but you reach a plateau where you simply can't make any more gains without getting rid of the booze. I absolutely, positively could not bust through a weight plateau at 210 w/o cutting the drinking. It lasted for weeks and weeks, so I finally didn't drink and my progress picked up again. So while I don't like being the DD and the loser that orders the "diet coke with a lime" in a bar, seeing progress now without the drinking has given me a lot more motivation to not get hammered all weekend long.
Good luck brother!

I was just thinking about BoJones's comments about boozing on weekends....and it got me thinking about a runner name Steve Prefontaine...If any of you are familiar with his off the track habits as well as one the track...you'll all realize that Steve enjoyed a few libations with friends. In other words, the guy drank during the years when he owned every long distance record from the 2,000 to the 10,000 meter....Maybe not heavily...and I certainly don't konw the amounts or how often...but I do know that Pre did consume alcohol...

Now, this may be an exception...because Steve's awesome talent maybe allowed him to do this more than your average runner (like me.....who's VO2 max isn't off the charts like Steve's was)....I'm just providing an angle that if you train with intensity...and keep it moderation...that a few drinks isn't going to completely halt your progress. But, if you hit a plateau....you have a serious suspect. :tu:

Wow, sorry for being away so long. Didn't plan on this topic to take off. Yes, I was smart enough to go the diet coke and liquor route, I actually enjoy liquor more on the whole. stacykidd I think I'm in a similar situation to you, the diet & liq thing held me over but now it's not going to cut it. Although I don't have as much "bar pressure" because of the whole not being 21 thing...

I think it's very obvious that alcohol has got to go. And as much as I never wanted to put up a post like this, if I handn't done it and heard from all these people, I would have gotten hammered last night. Instead, I woke up at 225.5, my lowest yet.

Couple this with the fact that my (of age) friend got himself in some trouble with driving (blew a .078 and .074 where the legal limit is .08, lucky bastard) and even though they didn't stick him with a DUI, he thinks its gonna run him ~ $1000 when all is said and done.

So, this isn't too hard of a decision. Alcohol in moderation may have a place in my maintenance lifestyle, but not when I'm trying to burn this gut as fast as possible. A lot of my "freak out" was based on feeling sick and sleep deprived, coupled with the stir craziness brought on by literally wandering the internet all day at work because my boss is vacationing and nobody else wants me to do anything for anyone. Thanks for all the replies, I'm feeling better about everything and ready to keep going.

And Marcman, it's a default avatar from this site but I think it's one of the ninjas from GI Joe. Snakeyes is the black one, he's a good guy, and I can't put my finger on who mine is but I think it's a bad guy... I am looking forward to playing some Killer Instinct when I get back to Boston though and build myself a nice MAME cabinet. Mmmmm

On a tangent, all evidence points to being able to eat snickers all day long, and, as long as you stay under your maintence calories, you won't gain weight. I think a typical snickers bar has 300 calories, so most people could eat 5-6 a day.

The problem comes down to nutrition. You are going to get a host of health problems from only eat snickers, or (worse) drinking alcohol. We all know what these are, from acne to heart failure.

The ideas to repeat are moderation and preparation. If I know I'm going to a bar, I'll make sure to have plenty of calories below my BMR to accomodate. Even then, I will only get one or two beers and then I'm done. I could drink more, but to me, staying in shape is more important than getting loaded.