Seeing as Squats works Quads, and Deads work Hams, is it ok to do both exercises in the same workout?

Yeah sure. It is really hard though, especially if you're doing heavy weight. Make sure you are using correct form. Listen to your body and be sure to get a good warmup in. Especially make sure your abs and lower back are tight. Lower back would be a good place to get hurt doing these lifts together if you don't know what you're doing.

I do squats and RDLs together every week. I probably wouldn't do squats and regular deads together very often, if ever.

Thanks for that info :)

Would you advise splitting them up.

E.g. If I was doing a 3 day split, for fat loss, could I do what powerlifters do:

Day 1: Squat
Day 2: Bench
Day 3: Deads

And then throw in other lifts on those days? (Dips, Rows, Shoulder Press) Or will that not work for cutting? If it will, where would you put what?

Thanks for that info :)

Would you advise splitting them up.

E.g. If I was doing a 3 day split, for fat loss, could I do what powerlifters do:

Day 1: Squat
Day 2: Bench
Day 3: Deads

And then throw in other lifts on those days? (Dips, Rows, Shoulder Press) Or will that not work for cutting? If it will, where would you put what?

That looks good to me. Add the auxiliaries where they fit in with your 3 chosen core lifts. I like to use as many compounds as possible and even make the compounds more compound by using supersets, giantsets, and multiple moves like "the bear." This will really get you sweating and burning cals.

I do full body workouts, and generally will do one variant of each. However, I like do put a high impact choice with a low impact second exercise.

So, back squat will be paired with RDLs, SLDL, single legged stiff legged deadlift, snatch grip deads, etc.

Regular deads will go with front squats, hack squats, Bulgarian split squats, step ups.

This keeps the total spinal impact down and I recover great.

I used to be able to do both regular deads and back squats together, even supersetting them. However, as I added pounds to my working weights, I've trended toward NOT doing that :)

Monday:
BB Front Squat
BB Lunges
BB Calf Raises

Thursday:
BB Flat Bench
BB Close Grip Bench
BB Shoulder Press

Friday:
BB Deadlift
BB Pullover
BB Bentover Row

How does that look? I cannot do Chinups / Pullups as I will have no bar.

I think you would want to change the Monday Front Squat to a Back Squat.

I think you would want to change the Monday Front Squat to a Back Squat.

Why? Front squats are excellent, as long as you keep the reps lower per set to fight off the shoulder (and possibly wrist) fatigue. They hit the quads much more for me then back squats do, that get more glutes/hams.

IME, front squats also helped my back squats by teaching me better form. Much harder to cheat with front squats, or you dump the weight.

Not saying it would be bad to do back squats there, just that there is nothing wrong with his choice IMO. I would switch up in 3 or 4 weeks, though.

Another option for him is to do a couple of working sets of both. Split the volume. If I was to do that, I'd do back squats first, followed by front squats.

I think you would want to change the Monday Front Squat to a Back Squat.

Why?

I do full body workouts, and generally will do one variant of each. However, I like do put a high impact choice with a low impact second exercise.

So, back squat will be paired with RDLs, SLDL, single legged stiff legged deadlift, snatch grip deads, etc.

Regular deads will go with front squats, hack squats, Bulgarian split squats, step ups.

This keeps the total spinal impact down and I recover great.

I used to be able to do both regular deads and back squats together, even supersetting them. However, as I added pounds to my working weights, I've trended toward NOT doing that :)

Looking at your post, it appeared to me that you were saying front squats are a lower impact exercise than the back squat. I read it as you advocating to pair back squats with RDL's or SLDL and then pair deadlifts with front squats. To not do full deadlifts and back squats on the same day. I would tend to agree. Nowhere in his routine does he do back squats, a traditional bedrock of a solid weightlifting plan. I thought my post was clarifying your post. If you were not implying that he should do back squats, but not on days he does deadlifts, then I apologize. I misunderstood.

You're right. Front squats do work the muscle and can be a vital part of a routine. But, I would say that if he is only going to do one kind of squat, it should be back squats.

Looking at your post, it appeared to me that you were saying front squats are a lower impact exercise than the back squat. I read it as you advocating to pair back squats with RDL's or SLDL and then pair deadlifts with front squats. To not do full deadlifts and back squats on the same day. I would tend to agree. Nowhere in his routine does he do back squats, a traditional bedrock of a solid weightlifting plan. I thought my post was clarifying your post. If you were not implying that he should do back squats, but not on days he does deadlifts, then I apologize. I misunderstood.

You're right. Front squats do work the muscle and can be a vital part of a routine. But, I would say that if he is only going to do one kind of squat, it should be back squats.


I see where the confusion is from :) Sorry.

I like to work both. Sometimes in the same several week "cycle", sometimes going with one or the other. Since he isn't doing both on the same day, I'm sure either will do good things for him.

I've read several highly regarded trainers lately that have moved away from back squats entirely to reduce the risk of training injuries in their clients, some of which are pro athletes who can't afford to get injured in the gym. So, I think you could probably do pretty will avoiding back squats, but I personally wouldn't want to do so.

Ok. Now I am confused.

Front Squat = Barbell resting on top of your chest area
Back Squat = Barbell resting on your shoulders

If so, I think Ill do Back Squats.

Monday:
BB Front Squat
BB Lunges
BB Calf Raises

Thursday:
BB Flat Bench
BB Close Grip Bench
BB Shoulder Press

Friday:
BB Deadlift
BB Pullover
BB Bentover Row

How does that look? I cannot do Chinups / Pullups as I will have no bar.

I'd replace pull-overs on Friday with some sort of strong hip-dominant movement (romanian deadlifts, good mornings, cable pull-throughs, power cleans, etc.) and then replace calf raises on Monday with another back movement (a row since you don't have a bar for pull/chin-ups). If you want to do calf raises, arm isolation, shoulder isolation, etc. do it as an afterthought after your main workout.

Seeing as Squats works Quads, and Deads work Hams
It's not quite that simple, but it's okay to think of it like that. I had a discussion about this with canada in another thread: http://forums.johnstonefitness.com/showpost.php?p=427217&postcount=13

Cheers guys. Looks like I'm sorted. Now just got to convince my Dad to let me have the rack (I hope he will) :)

Monday:
BB Back Squat
BB Lunges
BB Upright Row

Thursday:
BB Flat Bench
BB Close Grip Bench
BB Shoulder Press

Friday:
BB Deadlift
BB Goodmornings
BB Bentover Row

I'll stick with that for about 4 weeks, then may change it around a bit.

Monday:
BB Back Squat
BB Lunges
BB Upright Row

Thursday:
BB Flat Bench
BB Close Grip Bench
BB Shoulder Press

Friday:
BB Deadlift
BB Goodmornings
BB Bentover Row

I'll stick with that for about 4 weeks, then may change it around a bit.

:claplow: :nod: Nicely done. Good comments all around. :tu:

Let's start tomorrow. I need to change it up anyway. Hell, I might do Monday tonight. I need to hit legs...

:claplow: :nod: Nicely done. Good comments all around. :tu:

Let's start tomorrow. I need to change it up anyway. Hell, I might do Monday tonight. I need to hit legs...

You can TarSeal :) I must wait to get my equipment.

Ooops. Forgot to ask, any ideas on set / rep schemes?

3 sets x 10 reps ???

You can TarSeal :) I must wait to get my equipment.

Ooops. Forgot to ask, any ideas on set / rep schemes?

3 sets x 10 reps ???

Good question, I hope the experts chime in.

:confused:

I was thinking of:

Back Squats
3x10 warmup, adding weight to each set
5x5 heavy sets (of 6-8 rep max)
then maybe 1 or 2 additional sets of 3 rep max if I'm really feeling it.

Then yeah, 3x10 for the other 2 lifts.

Good question, I hope the experts chime in.

:confused:

I was thinking of:

Back Squats
3x10 warmup, adding weight to each set
5x5 heavy sets (of 6-8 rep max)
then maybe 1 or 2 additional sets of 3 rep max if I'm really feeling it.

Then yeah, 3x10 for the other 2 lifts.

Sounds good. Let me know how you get on :D

So I just did the Foley Monday.

BB Back Squats 3x10
more Squats 5x5
BB Lunges 3x10
EZ Bar Upright Row 1x20
...that felt lame so I switched to...
EZ Bar Bent Over Row/ RDL Superset

I am wiped out. It works! :tucool: Holy Crap, BB Lunges are hard. I've never done those before.

Honestly I'd switch out the upright rows for something else. If you're only gonna do 9 moves, why pick upright rows? I say stick RDL right there. That felt good.

Do you have a link for the Romanian Deadlift?

http://www.t-nation.com/readTopic.do?id=818462&pageNo=0

Somebody asked about it here. I don't really do these that often (although I might start), but I'm pretty sure the putfile video is a good example of one...but as was mentioned in the thread could have a bit more ROM.

As mentioned in the same thread, read this as well: http://danjohn.org/II1.pdf

Ok thanks for the clarification.

I will be doing Deadlifts, and Romanian Deadlifts. :)

Ok thanks for the clarification.

I will be doing Deadlifts, and Romanian Deadlifts. :)

What did Pops say about the equipment purchase?

Well we are getting a new shed, so we will be moving all the shit out of the current one. He said maybe in there.

I also told him to keep both of the cars in our driveway so I can use the garage. Its my birthday in early April so MAYBE I will have all I need by then. He needs a good talking to :lol: :) :D

================================================== =====

Are you going to be doing the the next installment of the 'Foley Workout'? :lol:

Oh BTW, how many reps/sets did you do on the Bent Over Row / RDL superset on Monday?

I also told him to keep both of the cars in our driveway so I can use the garage. Its my birthday in early April so MAYBE I will have all I need by then. He needs a good talking to :lol: :) :D


Kids these days. I never would have gotten by with telling the parentals where to park there cars or how to use their real estate :D

Kids these days. I never would have gotten by with telling the parentals where to park there cars or how to use their real estate :D

:lol: He usually listens to me, so hopefully this will be one of those times :)

Well we are getting a new shed, so we will be moving all the shit out of the current one. He said maybe in there.

I also told him to keep both of the cars in our driveway so I can use the garage. Its my birthday in early April so MAYBE I will have all I need by then. He needs a good talking to :lol: :) :D

================================================== =====

Are you going to be doing the the next installment of the 'Foley Workout'? :lol:

Oh BTW, how many reps/sets did you do on the Bent Over Row / RDL superset on Monday?

I wish one could multiquote from a single post...

1> You need to find a way to get started now while your interest is piqued. Do something... April??? You should already be buff by then in time for spring, not just getting started. How about we put together a bodyweight and limited DB program for the meantime?

2> You bet your ass I'm doing the next installment of the "Foley Workout." "Thursday" workout will be tomorrow after work. Bench, close grip bench, and Shoulder Press.

3> 2 sets of 10 each, like 10 BB rows followed immediately by 10 RDLs without pause. Then a couple minutes recovery. You could up the effect even more by doing a giant set there of BB Row/RDL/Shrugs @10/10/10 no pause. :tucool:

I'll PM you about that plan :)

I'll PM you about that plan :)

I guess you're already going to the gym- I just saw your journal. Looks like you have it under control!

I guess you're already going to the gym- I just saw your journal. Looks like you have it under control!

Ok, so I send the PM and then you reply :lol:

Oh well :)