This is based on the weight I lift, which in general I think is not as heavy as most people I see in the gym who are a similar size as me and from reading on here.

What do you guys think?

Current weight 190 pounds, height 5'10"

If you are looking for pics, check my signature and mentally add a little bit more muscle (~5 pounds) and a lot more fat (~15 pounds).

This is my working weight for various exercises (the last time I did them). I generally do 8-10 reps for 3 sets. All exercises are the standard variation unless otherwise indicated. All weights are total weight in pounds (bar + plates, or both dumbells combined).


Chest:
155____BB bench press
080____DB incline (30 deg) bench press
060____DB decline (30 deg) bench press
080____Cable fly for chest

Back
145____BB dead lift
050____Bent over DB row
090____Triangle cable row
080____Cable face pull

Legs
145____BB squat
145____BB stiff legged dead lift
070____Standing calf raises in smith machine
055____Seated calf raises

Shoulders
070____DB seated press
030____DB side lateral raises
030____DB bent over side raises

Arms
075____BB preacher curl
050____DB curls
025____Tricep rope pulldown

The following is the number of reps to failure for various body weight exercises
10_____pullups
08_____chinups
10_____dips
30_____pushups

Oh and I never usually like to cheat a rep. I try to have the best form possible.

And I also believe I've answered every conceivable question about my weight lifting history down in Post #9.

I have some opinions on what my weakness are, but looking at the above, any thoughts?

how hard to you push yourself when you lift? do you go to failiure? what is your rep range? how many sets?

it looks like you could push your triceps more... but without knowing how many reps/sets I could be wrong ;)


oh... and everyone has a different level of strength... don't judge yourself against anyone but yourself ;)

This is my working weight for various exercises (the last time I did them). All exercises are the standard variation unless otherwise indicated. All weights are total weight in pounds (bar + plates, or both dumbells combined).
Can you provide sets/reps info?

For example, a set of bench press with 155x1 is one thing, but 4 sets of 155x15 is totally different. :)

how hard to you push yourself when you lift? do you go to failiure? what is your rep range? how many sets?

D'oh, excellent question, I'll go back and put that info in. I generally do 8-10 reps for 3 sets. There may be a warm up before that at much lower weight.


oh... and everyone has a different level of strength... don't judge yourself against anyone but yourself ;)
Well, I know that, but, you know.

Looks like Tanisha beat me to it! :)

oh... and everyone has a different level of strength... don't judge yourself against anyone but yourself ;)
Absolutely, excellent point here.

Do you go to failure?
Do you do rep progressions?
Do you do set progressions?
Do you do weight progressions?
Do you try to progress aggressively?
How often do you increase the weight lifted?
What were your strength levels like when you started?
How long have you been lifting? Consistently?
What's your tempo like?
Is your form good? Too good?
How long have you been using those exercises?
Do you switch up exercises often? Too often?
Do you stick to your routines? Too long?
Have you tried other rep ranges? Which ones?
Have you tried other styles of lifting? Which ones?
Do you use a split routine?

Alot more weight then I'm moving :-)
However that is most definatly a good thing as I only have a combined 100lb weight set haha

What's strange is looking at what you do on incline db press you should be able to do more on your bb bench unless you just have much bigger upper chest muscles. Like stated above its not a matter how much you can lift you can still build muscle, i bet your stronger then some bigger guys at the gym. Another thing to try is a strength focus regimen maybe a 3x5 or 5x5 routine you'll still gain size as well.

damn it chico, see below

1) Do you go to failure?
2) Do you do rep progressions?
3) Do you do set progressions?
4) Do you do weight progressions?
5) Do you try to progress aggressively?
6) How often do you increase the weight lifted?
7) What were your strength levels like when you started?
8) How long have you been lifting? Consistently?
9) What's your tempo like?
10) Is your form good? Too good?
11) How long have you been using those exercises?
12) Do you switch up exercises often? Too often?
13) Do you stick to your routines? Too long?
14) Have you tried other rep ranges? Which ones?
15) Have you tried other styles of lifting? Which ones?
16) Do you use a split routine?

1) for the most part, I go to one rep before failure, I guess. In that I just barely get the last rep with good form, and I know that if I started the next rep my form would break.

2) I do 8-10 reps each set.

3) I use the same weight every set.

4) I use the same weight every set. although I don't know the difference between 3 and 4

5) in terms of progressing I try to use the method where, If I can do 3 sets of 10 reps, I will bump the weight and got 3 sets of 8 reps next time. I also keep detailed logs of what I did and how I felt afterward, along with notes on form and such. If I felt like I didn't work hard enough, I will note to bump up next time.

6) I increase the weight lifted very slowly. I would say after a few months of lifting regularly I would increase 5-10 pounds depending on exercise.

7) I was pretty weak when starting out, about 3 years ago, and I didn't do most of the exercises. But for example my BB bench press was maybe 115 pounds for 3 sets of 8.

8) For the past 3 years My lifting went like this:

Year 1: 5 months straight (Jan-May)
Year 2: 6 months straight (Feb-Aug)
Year 3: 4 months straight (Jan-Apr) then 3 months (Jun-Aug)
Year 4: Just picked back up for the past month

9) my tempo is like 1 second positive, 2 seconds negative.

10) My form is good, I guess. Too good? I have no idea.

11) These aren't the exercises I am currently doing exactly, I just listed these so people would have several exercises to see weights for. But I try to mix things up every few months.

12) I do switch up exercises every few months.

13) Yes, when I am lifting, it is for several months at a time. But then I will have occasional periods when I slack off. I do take a week break if I have been going for 3 months in a row.

14) Currently the rep ranges are 8-10, and historically that has been what I used. I did go through a period where I used 6 reps, but that was only for a short time.

15) I have tried another style of lifting see next answer. (although I'm not so sure what you mean by that).

16) I generally do a 3 day split, where at first it was: chest/tricpes, back/biceps, legs/abs. But for more than a year I have switched to: chest/back, legs/abs, arms/shoulders. One time I did do an all compound routine twice a week, where I did squat, deadlift, bench press, and pullups.


whew...

Okay, so now what do you think?

specifically what do you think about the relative differences between the various exercises?

I'd say it's probably time to change up the set / rep scheme and probably a good time to switch to a different type of routine altogether -- upper / low split, full body, et cetera.

Using the same weight on every set and stopping a rep before failure is fine. However, make sure you are aggressive with your increases. I try to aim for another 5-10 lbs on a lift or another 2-4 reps distributed over my sets everytime I go to the gym. You'll need to deload or take time off more frequently the harder you push -- instead of every 12 weeks, every 6 weeks, for example.

As for relative differences, by mechanical advantage:

1. You should be able to lift more on the deadlift than on squats or SLDLs.
2. You should be able to lift more on decline bench press than incline bench press.
3. Based on your flat barbell bench, I'd expect you to be incline and decline benching larger dumbbells.

This is based on the weight I lift, which in general I think is not as heavy as most people I see in the gym who are a similar size as me and from reading on here.

This is my working weight for various exercises (the last time I did them). I generally do 8-10 reps for 3 sets. All exercises are the standard variation unless otherwise indicated. All weights are total weight in pounds (bar + plates, or both dumbells combined).




Some of the weights look good like the 075____BB preacher curl but then you wimp out on the 050____DB curls and 025____Tricep rope pulldown.

So you should have the strength but you do use light weights overall. Why? I think it is mental, in the mind. What can you do? Set goals for progressing - "I will increase all lifting weights 30% by 1 april." , get more rest - min 8 hours sleep a day. Push yourself to increase reps in range then incease weight 5-10% when you reach max of range.:tucool:

You might try going into the lower rep ranges. When I'm building strength, I shift into the lower rep ranges (3-5), take long rests between sets (often 5 minutes or more), and make each set as intense as possible. Doing 3 sets of 8-10 reps on every exercise with a 90 second rest between each set is fine for hypertrophy, but is not so great for building up strength.

Another key is to focus mostly on compounds....even for assistance work. For example, if you want to build up your bench press strength, it is much better to increase tricep strength with heavy close-grips than it is with skull crushers or pushdowns.

Also, just another random tip: ... avoid burnout sets (I don't know why so many people do these)....but they will kill your strength for the rest of your workout, and prevent you from overloading the muscles with as much weight as possible...which, from a strength perspective is bad.

If i read it correctly, you been training for 3 years? If so i would definitely look to increase your relative strength.

More weight recruits more motor units and muscle fibers IE more growth.

I would take alook at Primed for Muscle by Waterbury. The best program i've use so far for maximal strength, i put over 20lbs on my 5RM back squat in only 4weeks. It uses supramaximal holds to trick the nervous system.

It an upper/lower split.

http://www.t-nation.com/findArticle.do?article=05-082-training

What's strange is looking at what you do on incline db press you should be able to do more on your bb bench unless you just have much bigger upper chest muscles. Like stated above its not a matter how much you can lift you can still build muscle, i bet your stronger then some bigger guys at the gym. Another thing to try is a strength focus regimen maybe a 3x5 or 5x5 routine you'll still gain size as well.

I will look into routines that focus on strength, thanks.

I'd say it's probably time to change up the set / rep scheme and probably a good time to switch to a different type of routine altogether -- upper / low split, full body, et cetera.

Using the same weight on every set and stopping a rep before failure is fine. However, make sure you are aggressive with your increases. I try to aim for another 5-10 lbs on a lift or another 2-4 reps distributed over my sets everytime I go to the gym. You'll need to deload or take time off more frequently the harder you push -- instead of every 12 weeks, every 6 weeks, for example.

As for relative differences, by mechanical advantage:

1. You should be able to lift more on the deadlift than on squats or SLDLs.
2. You should be able to lift more on decline bench press than incline bench press.
3. Based on your flat barbell bench, I'd expect you to be incline and decline benching larger dumbbells.

What do you think about my squat vs deadlift vs bench press? Not what you would expect at all.

So the typical* person would be deadlift > squat > bench press right?

Some of the weights look good like the 075____BB preacher curl but then you wimp out on the 050____DB curls and 025____Tricep rope pulldown.

So you should have the strength but you do use light weights overall. Why? I think it is mental, in the mind. What can you do? Set goals for progressing - "I will increase all lifting weights 30% by 1 april." , get more rest - min 8 hours sleep a day. Push yourself to increase reps in range then incease weight 5-10% when you reach max of range.:tucool:

I'm wondering about it being a mental thing. I am very use to dealing with pain mentally when it comes to long distance running. Often many people who just think they can't do it are physically no different than those that do it, the ones that do it are just more mentally comfortable with running through pain.

How hard should a single rep be? I'll have to test this out.

You might try going into the lower rep ranges. When I'm building strength, I shift into the lower rep ranges (3-5), take long rests between sets (often 5 minutes or more), and make each set as intense as possible. Doing 3 sets of 8-10 reps on every exercise with a 90 second rest between each set is fine for hypertrophy, but is not so great for building up strength.

I will look into doing lower reps. This will naturally make the weight go up but hopefully it will allow for strength increases.

If i read it correctly, you been training for 3 years? If so i would definitely look to increase your relative strength.

More weight recruits more motor units and muscle fibers IE more growth.

I would take alook at Primed for Muscle by Waterbury. The best program i've use so far for maximal strength, i put over 20lbs on my 5RM back squat in only 4weeks. It uses supramaximal holds to trick the nervous system.

It an upper/lower split.

http://www.t-nation.com/findArticle.do?article=05-082-training

Thanks for the recommended routine.

Year 1: 5 months straight (Jan-May)
Year 2: 6 months straight (Feb-Aug)
Year 3: 4 months straight (Jan-Apr) then 3 months (Jun-Aug)
Year 4: Just picked back up for the past month
Hey GH, has all of this been at a caloric deficit?

Hey GH, has all of this been at a caloric deficit?

Well, I have never usually counted calories but I can tell from fat loss. The periods in year 1 and 2 were while losing fat. The 4 month period in year 3 was the only intentional try to get bigger and stronger and so eat more period. And then the 3 month period was again losing fat.

Right now, I guess I'm trying to lose fat.

What do you think about my squat vs deadlift vs bench press? Not what you would expect at all.

So the typical* person would be deadlift > squat > bench press right?.
My bench press was equal to my squat for about the first two years that I trained and I didn't deadlift at all. :nod: It wasn't until I really worked on the squat and started hitting the legs a couple times per week that this changed.

Keep at it and the weights will increase. :tu:

The only other thing I could suggest is finding a training partner who will know how to push you. Friendly competition can do wonders for your level of strength.

Thanks for the advice so far. Okay, so I'll give people my opinion on the numbers.

The ones that are most noticeable for me are the big three, bench press, squat and deadlift. These are all much lower in comparison to others, even bench press, which is the highest. What would I think would be better? I'd like to be able to bench press my weight.

I think my triceps may be the problem here.

Now the squat and deadlift numbers are just ridiculously low. Most people have these into the 200's or even 300's for deadlift (I know why do I care, well, I want to improve). But I think I know the answer for these. My legs in general are weak. I have only been lifting with my legs for the last 2 years. The first year I had bad tendinitis in my ITB from running so I avoided lifting with them.

Of my leg muscles, I think the hamstrings and glutes are the weak spots. IMO I feel the quads the most in the upper half of the squat and then when I get to the bottom that's when I feel it in my hamstrings and glutes. If I try to squat more weight I feel really unstable at the bottom of the movement and my glutes and hamstrings just don't feel right. like I am very close to breaking form and possibly pulll something in the process. When my legs get tired after set 2 and 3 it is my inner hamstrings that feel it way more than my quads.

So the typical* person would be deadlift > squat > bench press right? :nod:

I'm wondering about it being a mental thing. I am very use to dealing with pain mentally when it comes to long distance running. Often many people who just think they can't do it are physically no different than those that do it, the ones that do it are just more mentally comfortable with running through pain. :nod:
How hard should a single rep be? I'll have to test this out. Challenging, but not impossible

The only other thing I could suggest is finding a training partner who will know how to push you. Friendly competition can do wonders for your level of strength. :nod: Chic has something here GH. I used to lift weights like you're lifting until I joined a group of two other guys who were lifting regularly - and lifting heavy. The pushed me a little at a time - and with each bit of success I realized I wasn't pushing myself anywhere near as hard as I could have been. Now when we go to the gym (and we're all relatively the same strength on most stuff now) we have a habit of 'checking' the amount lifted on a set and assuming you're up to it we make it a point to do one more rep or 5lbs more than the last guy. It's never forced and in good spirit - but it certainly helps push you forward.

The ones that are most noticeable for me are the big three, bench press, squat and deadlift. These are all much lower in comparison to others, even bench press, which is the highest. You've already said you haven't been pushing your lower body... time to get busy on that one. :D
What would I think would be better? I'd like to be able to bench press my weight.

I think my triceps may be the problem here. This was the one I was scratching my head over? How can you knock out 30 pushups and 10 dips with bodyweight - but struggle with the flat bench? (The main reason I ask is I struggle with chest - my greatest weakness - but I find my triceps compensating all the time for it)
Now the squat and deadlift numbers are just ridiculously low. Most people have these into the 200's or even 300's for deadlift (I know why do I care, well, I want to improve). But I think I know the answer for these. My legs in general are weak. You ever ride a bike outdoors? I owe 98% of the legs I have to bike riding my fat ass around in my youth and probably some of the past 4 years too. Just a thought. I smoke my lifting partners in legs - it's the one area I have pulled THEM along in - which makes me feel useful in the group. :lol:

GH, if it's any consolation to you, I am almost identical to you on all lifts. I'm doing a little more on deadlift and squat but less on bench and cable fly. I'm too embarrased to list my actual weights, especially in bench press. But if you can see muscle growth over time, who cares how much you're putting up? I don't have a lifting partner. Too bad we don't live closer to each other, sounds like we could encourage the other to do better.

The ones that are most noticeable for me are the big three, bench press, squat and deadlift.


If you aren't seeing the progress you want:

1. Rule out medical issues.

2. Eat and sleep well.

3. Get a lifting program that targets big compounds for strength. It means lifting heavy stuff, but that's what it's about. If you want to lift heavy stuff, then you got to lift heavy stuff.

4. If you are too worried about injury or form? Get a trainer to help with your confidence. Nothing wrong with needing someone to lean on.

This was the one I was scratching my head over? How can you knock out 30 pushups and 10 dips with bodyweight - but struggle with the flat bench? (The main reason I ask is I struggle with chest - my greatest weakness - but I find my triceps compensating all the time for it)


Now, I can imagine that I am not pushing myself hard enough on some lifts. But flat BB bench press, is actually one that, a year ago, I had really tried to push myself on. 155 pounds, was seriously heavy for me. Even one rep quite strained my form. But with all out focus I could get the 8 reps. It is hard for me to imagine going heavier. That's why it is so disheartening to look over at the next bench and see a guy who looks smaller than me and has two 45s on either side. I just don't get it. The past 6 months I have been doing only dumbbell work because I lost my lifting partner when I switched to an all compound routine and I didn't like doing BB bench press without a reliable spot. I may ask him to do it again. But I find I spend so much more time at the gym when I'm there with a partner.


You ever ride a bike outdoors? I owe 98% of the legs I have to bike riding my fat ass around in my youth and probably some of the past 4 years too. Just a thought. I smoke my lifting partners in legs - it's the one area I have pulled THEM along in - which makes me feel useful in the group. :lol:
This could be something. I had a bike up until about 13 and then it was stolen and I never got another one. I was always a runner. I have biked now and then over just the last few years and it kills my legs, they are definitely weak.

One thing that I forgot to mention, is that I just recently added DB lunges to my routine. And, wow, this exercise definitely exposes a weakness. When I first did them 2 weeks ago, I did just body weight and that was hard. I'm now up to 12.5 DBs. I'm hoping as I progress I will see an improvement in the squat also.

I'm thinking I could also add some hamstring isolation exercises too.

GH, if it's any consolation to you, I am almost identical to you on all lifts. I'm doing a little more on deadlift and squat but less on bench and cable fly. I'm too embarrased to list my actual weights, especially in bench press. But if you can see muscle growth over time, who cares how much you're putting up? I don't have a lifting partner. Too bad we don't live closer to each other, sounds like we could encourage the other to do better.

Man that would be awesome. Where do you live Carguy? I'll be graduating this year, and I have no idea where I'll end up.

It's nice to know that someone who has been lifting at least for a few years is at the same place. I don't really care that much about the weight. But I've always been curious about how someone can be so much stronger but look nearly the same.

If you aren't seeing the progress you want:

1. Rule out medical issues.

2. Eat and sleep well.

3. Get a lifting program that targets big compounds for strength. It means lifting heavy stuff, but that's what it's about. If you want to lift heavy stuff, then you got to lift heavy stuff.

4. If you are too worried about injury or form? Get a trainer to help with your confidence. Nothing wrong with needing someone to lean on.
I think you have a trainer right Zen? How is it? Did he help you with your current program or come up with a completely new one?

Hey GH, has all of this been at a caloric deficit?
Great question George.

Okay so what's next GH? Are you wanting to get stronger now?

Are you willing to change your routine? Can you do a 4-day split?

What's your diet look like? On average, in general, I know you don't count calories, but you might have an idea...

If it makes you feel any better I only weigh 173 lbs and can't even do one pull up :D

I workout for ME I don't look at what other people can do or can't do. I see people looking at me when I load up the bench press and I'm sure they think what a weakling but I don't care. I feel better knowing that I'm doing the weight with good form, not cheating or using a spotter. I see guys put on like 315lbs+ and there spotter does all the work and they are arching the crap out of there back, to me that's more embarassing and something to snicker at. I am also proud to be the only person in the gym doing Full ATG Squats and now doing Deadlifts. People look at me like I'm from outer space when I perform those exesizes :lol: In my opinion I think you are moving good weight, a lot more than me in all of your lifts. Props to you for all your hard work GH :bow:

I think you have a trainer right Zen? How is it? Did he help you with your current program or come up with a completely new one?

I work with a trainer a lot. I learned a lot in the first year of training that would help set up programs. I expanded my exercise vocabulary a lot.

One point of view, and both of my trainers have come from this point of view, is that working out can be thought of as a conversation between you and your body. So planning a workout, or program, is like writing. Your body gets to have its say, and you want to listen as much as you want to talk. This idea leads away from the idea of a plan of a lot of workouts laid out in advance, and towards the idea that there is an overall strategy, but that you can adapt the tactics to fit the moment to moment situation.

So in the beginning, developing a large vocabulary of exercises and understanding how to do them, and how my body tends to respond, was the big part of what I learned from my trainer. Another big part was learning a safe but effective intensity that can be sustained over the long haul.

The second phase of learning, which we are in now, is more about developing the awareness of the larger picture - how we have set some goals, how we have progressed in those directions, and how we have progressed in other directions.

The big value of a trainer will depend on what problem you have - and so it's not going to be the same from one person to the next or one trainer to the next. Part of the value is you learning. Well that's a very personal process. Another part of the value is the trainer developing an independent and accurate assessment of your condition and capacity. If you have some uncommon issue that is holding you back, this can be really important. But most people have common issues that have to be addressed.

Great question George.

Okay so what's next GH? Are you wanting to get stronger now?

Are you willing to change your routine? Can you do a 4-day split?

What's your diet look like? On average, in general, I know you don't count calories, but you might have an idea...

So do calories really matter that much? I hadn't thought so as muscle size and muscle strength are at best, loosely correlated. If you consider a gymnast, they are able to become stronger and stronger, while attempting to stay roughly the same size (as they don't want the extra mass to move around).

What's next? hmm I will consider that today, and YES I want to get stronger.

I am willing to change my routine and I could probably do a 4-day split. I always felt shoulders get under worked in my current routine. I also saw the thread where you recommended that 4 day program for George.

My diet right now is a work in progress and changing for the better. I don't know if you've seen my latest journal, but I just came off a 3 month stretch last fall of completely ignoring the nutritional value of anything I eat. And when that happens usually the protein drops way down. I've been focusing to increase this lately.

Okay, I will flesh out a day of food, later today and also post my thoughts of where I want to go.

In my opinion I think you are moving good weight, a lot more than me in all of your lifts. Props to you for all your hard work GH :bow:

Thanks for the props NAC. This is a good point. I should have thought about that before posting this thread title, as people very well lift less and I don't want to make anyone feel bad. i'm going to ask to change it.

For most people it´s good enough to look strong and muscular. You don´t need to actually be strong. I mean it makes no difference if you can bench 200Lbs or 480Lbs if you look exactly the same anyway. As long as your muscles are growing and getting bigger it makes no difference how much you can lift. I know alot of people that lift weights. Some only train for fitness and BB and some are powerlifters. Actually I train at a powerlifting club so I often see powerlifters that are smaller than me that also are much stronger than me. But I´m not competing and it´s not really a problem for me.

If it makes you feel any better I only weigh 173 lbs and can't even do one pull up :D

I workout for ME I don't look at what other people can do or can't do. I see people looking at me when I load up the bench press and I'm sure they think what a weakling but I don't care. I feel better knowing that I'm doing the weight with good form, not cheating or using a spotter. I see guys put on like 315lbs+ and there spotter does all the work and they are arching the crap out of there back, to me that's more embarassing and something to snicker at. I am also proud to be the only person in the gym doing Full ATG Squats and now doing Deadlifts. People look at me like I'm from outer space when I perform those exesizes :lol: In my opinion I think you are moving good weight, a lot more than me in all of your lifts. Props to you for all your hard work GH :bow:
:blank:

:blank:
Why the blank smily 1fast?

Why the blank smily 1fast?
Because you snicker at me in the gym.

So do calories really matter that much? I hadn't thought so as muscle size and muscle strength are at best, loosely correlated. If you consider a gymnast, they are able to become stronger and stronger, while attempting to stay roughly the same size (as they don't want the extra mass to move around).

What's next? hmm I will consider that today, and YES I want to get stronger.

I am willing to change my routine and I could probably do a 4-day split. I always felt shoulders get under worked in my current routine. I also saw the thread where you recommended that 4 day program for George.

My diet right now is a work in progress and changing for the better. I don't know if you've seen my latest journal, but I just came off a 3 month stretch last fall of completely ignoring the nutritional value of anything I eat. And when that happens usually the protein drops way down. I've been focusing to increase this lately.

Okay, I will flesh out a day of food, later today and also post my thoughts of where I want to go.
I think calories matter, but I'm certainly no expert. A lot of my powerlifting friends are not as strict about diet as my bodybuilding friends are. But, still, it just seems logical that paying more attention to your diet would be useful.

Reading your journal now. I don't read a lot of journals but I just LOL'd when carguy told you to read the stickies. :D

Looking forward to your updates whenever you get time!

Because you snicker at me in the gym.
:lol: I don't snicker at anyone at all. I just meant in general people look more rediculous performing reps with horrible form and too much weight to handle than those who lift approriate weight with good form. In my gym most every guy there is younger and is there to pump up there ego. You are no joke, you actually know how to lift and are very knowledgable in weight lifting and nutrition. I'm sure you are not realizing the rediculous stuff I see in my gym I was not poking fun at you :D

Are you doing cardio?

If so, are you doing more than LISS?

I'm still learning about what works for me, and I know that there could be other factors as well but since I've cut back on my cardio (to one day a week above 70% Max HR). I've seen my strength increase and generally feel more recovered even thought the intensity of my WT sessions has increased.

Man that would be awesome. Where do you live Carguy? I'll be graduating this year, and I have no idea where I'll end up.

It's nice to know that someone who has been lifting at least for a few years is at the same place. I don't really care that much about the weight. But I've always been curious about how someone can be so much stronger but look nearly the same.

If you end up in this little town in the Midwest (pop. 800), I will be very surprised.:lol:

I would like to be stronger too, but only in the context that that would allow me to lift heavier weights which would allow me to build the kind of physique I'd really like to have.

I'm curious. Do you enjoy bench more then deadlifts etc?

I find I don't really enjoy bench press or military presses. So I just do them because they are on the list. OTOH I tend to enjoy deadlifts so I put more effort into them. This has led to my bench lagging my deadlifts.

GH, until recently I too was baffled by discrepencies in my progress. For example, my DL was well ahead of everything else (comparatively speaking), my squats were progressing reasonably well, my barbell bench press was lagging very far behind, pushups practically impossible and pullups inconceivable.

At first, I thought maybe it was just some inexplicable upper body weakness, but after working with a very highly qualified trainer for a short while I'm now understanding some of the mechanisms behind the problems. While it was a mystery, it was frustrating; but now that it is making sense, it is simply a challenge and I know I have the capacity to meet it.

Initially, the factors in my case didn't even make sense to me. For example, it turned out that my bench (and other movements) was hampered because I find it hard to activate my lats in a certain way. It took a little while for me to comprehend how this could be so, but now that I've made a change of emphasis in some of my exercises to address this issue, I am noticing genuine improvements. Moreover, this seems to be connected with some of my other issues (tightnesses, inflexibilities, niggling minor injuries in various places, all of which are now improving together).

In my case, just gritting my teeth and trying to continue as I was by brute force would probably not have worked. The moral is that if the way aheead is blocked, a diagonal move forward can sometimes work.

So do calories really matter that much? I hadn't thought so as muscle size and muscle strength are at best, loosely correlated. If you consider a gymnast, they are able to become stronger and stronger, while attempting to stay roughly the same size (as they don't want the extra mass to move around).

If you don't eat enough, you can't work hard and keep your muscle. You can get strong up to a point, and then to get much stronger it's a lot easier to get bigger.

For most people it´s good enough to look strong and muscular. You don´t need to actually be strong. I mean it makes no difference if you can bench 200Lbs or 480Lbs if you look exactly the same anyway.

There are a lot of health advantages to being stronger and not just looking stronger. Especially as you age.

I'm still learning about what works for me, and I know that there could be other factors as well but since I've cut back on my cardio (to one day a week above 70% Max HR). I've seen my strength increase and generally feel more recovered even thought the intensity of my WT sessions has increased.

You sort of have it backwards, but a lot of people think that way.

In reality, a high level of cardiovascular fitness gives you the fastest recovery and also provides for more work capacity in the lifting.

You sort of have it backwards, but a lot of people think that way.

In reality, a high level of cardiovascular fitness gives you the fastest recovery and also provides for more work capacity in the lifting.

Really? I always thought that more cardio would hinder your gains in a bulk puting you in a catabolic state. I guess there is a fine line between that though I think i need to up my cardio now. I do see it though cuz ever since I stopped cardio I feel more winded now which can result to fatigue.

You sort of have it backwards, but a lot of people think that way.

In reality, a high level of cardiovascular fitness gives you the fastest recovery and also provides for more work capacity in the lifting.

In the infamous words of Ronald Reagan, "Well....there ya go again." :rolleyes:

zen, if I've told you once, I've told you a thousand times...."I ain't doin no cardio buddy!!! :mad:

In a sneaky sort of way, that was a nice try, though. LOL :cool:

There are a lot of health advantages to being stronger and not just looking stronger. Especially as you age.

But it is hard to justify a 480 lb bench press for health in your older days. Anything above your body-weight is icing on the cake.

And on the question of body-weight, no one under 6 ft, should carry more than 200 lbs. When we start the monthly topic on what is causing an obese society, McDonald,s or Capitalism; one we forget is the acceptance of over weight levels. The insurance charts (http://www.med.umich.edu/1libr/primry/life15.htm) are extremely reasonable. We should be able to pile enough muscle on those figures to look good and stay healthy. When you tell someone to go there to determine a good target weight, they ignore the advice - the weight is too low in the normal mindset of today. Put more muscle on those numbers, a 6 footer can look good at 188.

Back to subject of strength for the average person, off the top of my head, I say after 3 years of training, you should reach the following levels:
Exercise --------% of bodyweight

Bench press - 100%
Squat -120%
Standing press - 80%
Bent over row - 80%
Curl - 55%
Deadlift - 140%
fly - 40%
tricep ext - 40%
calf raise - 160%

Anytime you try to put exact numbers on something, you will find disagreement. That is my guess. I also have in the back of my mind that someone's weight does not exceed the highest shown in the referred to charts based on height and sex. Barring phyical problems, I think the numbers are in the ball park.

For most people it´s good enough to look strong and muscular.

Maybe for most, but not all of us feel this way.

You don´t need to actually be strong.

You don't need to be muscular either -- Either goal can be a way to push your limits and challenge yourself....many of us have strength and/or muscularity goals that go beyond just meeting practical functionality and health goals.

Because you snicker at me in the gym.

Somehow, I doubt that you are one of those guys who has his spotter doing most of the work. :)

Really? I always thought that more cardio would hinder your gains in a bulk puting you in a catabolic state.

Depends on how much cardio you do and at what intensity. Cardio isn't bad on a bulk, but excessive high intensity cardio can limit your ability to put on mass.

And on the question of body-weight, no one under 6 ft, should carry more than 200 lbs.

I dunno about that. We have a few guys at JSF, that are well under 6 ft, who carry around 200lbs with a fairly low bf percentage.

But it is hard to justify a 480 lb bench press for health in your older days. Anything above your body-weight is icing on the cake.

And on the question of body-weight, no one under 6 ft, should carry more than 200 lbs. When we start the monthly topic on what is causing an obese society, McDonald,s or Capitalism; one we forget is the acceptance of over weight levels. The insurance charts (http://www.med.umich.edu/1libr/primry/life15.htm) are extremely reasonable. We should be able to pile enough muscle on those figures to look good and stay healthy. When you tell someone to go there to determine a good target weight, they ignore the advice - the weight is too low in the normal mindset of today. Put more muscle on those numbers, a 6 footer can look good at 188.

Back to subject of strength for the average person, off the top of my head, I say after 3 years of training, you should reach the following levels:
Exercise --------% of bodyweight

Bench press - 100%
Squat -120%
Standing press - 80%
Bent over row - 80%
Curl - 55%
Deadlift - 140%
fly - 40%
tricep ext - 40%
calf raise - 160%

Anytime you try to put exact numbers on something, you will find disagreement. That is my guess. I also have in the back of my mind that someone's weight does not exceed the highest shown in the referred to charts based on height and sex. Barring phyical problems, I think the numbers are in the ball park.

Some of those percentages are VERY weak IMO for someone who trains. And the reference to ideal weight is outdated junk. It applies to people who don't use resistance training.

Then again there's not a whole lot both of us would agree on. :p

Some of those percentages are VERY weak IMO for someone who trains.

I agree. Especially here, with all of the great information available to us from all of the great members here? After 3 years of solid training, you should be able to bench much more than 100% of bodyweight (for example).

Then again there's not a whole lot both of us would agree on. :p

I would say there is nothing, we agree on. I am dealing with averages, gravityhomer has been around the forums a long time. I am sure there are more people who can't or don't benchpress bodyweight then do. I am just saying, on average, they should be able to reach these levels.

As for the "outdated" tables, They are still valid but it is today's overweight society that is out of step. I have never seen a picture of you, you might be able to hold more weight than they suggest. The average person can't.

As Joe S. said "We have a few guys at JSF, that are well under 6 ft, who carry around 200lbs with a fairly low bf percentage." I am sure a "few" can. We have thousands of members.

I would say there is nothing, we agree on. I am dealing with averages, gravityhomer has been around the forums a long time. I am sure there are more people who can't or don't benchpress bodyweight then do. I am just saying, on average, they should be able to reach these levels.

As for the "outdated" tables, They are still valid but it is today's overweight society that is out of step. I have never seen a picture of you, you might be able to hold more weight than they suggest. The average person can't.

As Joe S. said "We have a few guys at JSF, that are well under 6 ft, who carry around 200lbs with a fairly low bf percentage." I am sure a "few" can. We have thousands of members.

Yeah i should get a pic up in a few months, once i finally get some HIIT on the go and shed some bellyfat.

I would say i'm a good bit above average physically and if someone that trains is not, their not training correctly.

Really? I always thought that more cardio would hinder your gains in a bulk puting you in a catabolic state.

You don't get catabolic very easily at all if your lactate threshold is high. The only way to get a high lactate threshold is to do cardio, typically some at high intensity.

So if you don't have a high level of cardiovascular fitness, you might have issues. But if you do maintain a high level of cardiovascular fitness, it's not really that much of a concern.

In the infamous words of Ronald Reagan, "Well....there ya go again." :rolleyes:

zen, if I've told you once, I've told you a thousand times...."I ain't doin no cardio buddy!!! :mad:

In a sneaky sort of way, that was a nice try, though. LOL :cool:

Why not have a peek at today's workout:

Barbell Bulgarian Squats:
5R/5L x 145#
10x145#
10x165#

Barbell Step ups:
50x125# on 6" Step
120x85# on 8" Step

14x40# Rotator Cuff

Cable curl: 8x120#, 2x150#, 10x100#

Cable triceps extension: 10x150#, 15x120#

One Arm Dumbell Bench Row: 12x70#

Barbell Step Up: 120x85# on 8" Step

1021 Calories in 1:07
MHR 186, AHR 154

Easy uphill walking
Moderately hard elliptical

463 Calories in 28 minutes
MHR 181, AHR 162

But it is hard to justify a 480 lb bench press for health in your older days. Anything above your body-weight is icing on the cake.

Actually 480# bench is pretty hard to achieve let alone justify.

The ones that really matter for heavy a lot are the squat and the dead. The point of these is that you can keep a lot of muscle mass on longer into your life - the threat is sarcopenia and, to a lesser extent bone loss. I'm going to aim for 200% bodyweight squat and deadlift for as long as I can keep it.

There are harder to understand things like fall resistance - but that seems to line up with loss of muscle mass. I've seen enough frail eldery people fall down and end up never recovering because of the complications. Time and time again. As far as I can see, the best option is to maintain as much muscle as long as you can.

Plus, outcomes from surgery and chemo seem to line up both with muscle mass and VO2max.

The insurance tables probably don't reflect this because not enough really robustly healthy people have gotten old enough to have skated past much of their chance of dying or being disabled. They might never get there.

The trick though, is to live as far off the end of the tables as you can.

GH, what do you want? Do you want to LOOK like someone who can bench and deadlift a lot of weight? (aesthetics) Or do you want to be strong? For example, in a bodybuilding contest, the judges do not care if you can deadlift 200lbs more than the guy standing next to you, if your back isn't up to par with the guy who isn't as strong as you. In a powerlifting meet, the guy who benches 150lbs more than you do, might not have as impressive a chest as yours.

My challenge to you is, you're not putting forth the effort. You can curse me out all you want, but if that's what is going to motivate you, then let me have it :nod: . Don't rely on a training partner to motivate you. Cultivate your own intensity and determination. A training partner always held me back.

Concentrate on a progressive strength training routine for the next 3 months where you are increasing loads on your squat, deadlift and bench press. Eliminate many other iso movements. Eat for mass. The nutrition aspect cannot be denied or thrown by the wayside anymore. This is the case now with elite strength athletes.

Keep a training log and train 3x per week. Deadlft (ancillory work), Bench Press (ancillory work), and Squats (ancillory work).

There's nothing complicated here

Why not have a peek at today's workout:
Barbell Step ups:
50x125# on 6" Step
120x85# on 8" Step



:cry::cry:

120 per leg? All in one set?

:cry:

:cry::cry:

120 per leg? All in one set?

:cry:

No those are alternating in that set so it's 60 per leg. After the Bulgarians, I didn't want to push it. But it's still good cardio.

No those are alternating in that set so it's 60 per leg. After the Bulgarians, I didn't want to push it. But it's still good cardio.

Now I'm confused. So the BB was 60 lbs?

And yes, that would be excellent cardio. I'm thinking of a powerclean complex followed by high rep fast squats today for a weight workout to also burn some fat and increase LT.

Now I'm confused. So the BB was 60 lbs?
I think he just used 60x85# per leg. :)

I think he just used 60x85# per leg. :)

Duh. Ok, I feel like an idiot now. I completely ignored the "#".

No those are alternating in that set so it's 60 per leg. After the Bulgarians, I didn't want to push it. But it's still good cardio.

I'm sticking with :cry:. I have trouble enough with 20 reps. Even if my arms didn't want to fall off I think 30 would make me explode :lol:

I want to thank people for all the comments and opinions here. I have to take it all in and digest it.

For completeness below is my current routine and approximate nutrition. For the short term I think I am going to go with my current routine and focus on breaking any mental barriers I may have for heavier weight. Then I can see if this is a problem. I wouldn't really be able to tell this, if I switched everything around immediately.

In addition I am going to try to target areas that I believe are weak by giving them extra work. I believe that my weak areas are hamstrings, triceps and my core.

My current routine: which evolved over the past 3 weeks.

Chest and back
Incline DB bench press
Bent over DB rows
Decline DB bench press
BB deadlift
Cable chest fly
Face pull

Legs and abs
BB Squats to parallel
BB SLDL
DB lunges
Standing calf raises in smith machine
Leg raises
Crunches

Arms and Shoulders
DB seated press
BB skull crushers on flat bench
DB standing curls
DB bent over raises for rear delt
Tricep cable pulldown with angled bar
BB standing curls with reverse grip
BB standing raises. Pulling a barbell held at the waist straight up .
Dips

A snapshot of my nutrition:
kashi cinna-raisen crunch with skim milk
1.5 scoop opticen shake in water
banana
1.5 scoop opticen shake in water
a sandwich consisting of whole wheat bread lettuce, tomato and turkey or tuna
large grapefruit
some sort of dinner, fish w/ veg, or soup (turkey and chicken and tofu w/ veg) or chicken w/ veg, etc.
dark chocolate w/ peanut butter (small serving)
2 hard boiled eggs

Portions would be consisted with cutting I suppose.

Reading your journal now. I don't read a lot of journals but I just LOL'd when carguy told you to read the stickies. :D

Looking forward to your updates whenever you get time!

cool, journaling always helps me stay on track. Yeah that was pretty funny when carguy said that. :lol:

:lol: I don't snicker at anyone at all. I just meant in general people look more rediculous performing reps with horrible form and too much weight to handle than those who lift approriate weight with good form.

Don't worry I think maybe Chris was just slyly letting slip his bench press numbers. ;)

Are you doing cardio?


At the moment, no.

If you end up in this little town in the Midwest (pop. 800), I will be very surprised.:lol:


Yes, I guess there is very little chance of that, sorry :lol:



In my case, just gritting my teeth and trying to continue as I was by brute force would probably not have worked. The moral is that if the way aheead is blocked, a diagonal move forward can sometimes work.

I think I am going to find this out soon. I wouldn't want to just continue on in the same manner if I had a weakness that I wasn't addressing.

There are a lot of health advantages to being stronger and not just looking stronger. Especially as you age.

I agree. I do have a goal of wanting to be stronger, although I do not have an equal goal of wanting to look bigger.

I would say my goals are this:

Aesthetically
To look fit and have good muscle definition and low body fat. The absolute size isn't that important but I would want to look proportional.

Functionally
I want to be stronger for several reasons. A few months ago I was giving my wife a piggy-back ride. Then later a friend of hers got on her back and then I tried to put them both on my back. The starting point was basically the bottom of an ATG squat, and it was maybe 210 pounds. I couldn't do it. I was crushed. silly story I know. But I work out, I should be able to do this. Also many movies, books tv shows feature post apocalyptic non-technological worlds where strength is a plus. I need to be ready for this.


Exercise --------% of bodyweight

Bench press - 100%
Squat -120%
Standing press - 80%
Bent over row - 80%
Curl - 55%
Deadlift - 140%
fly - 40%
tricep ext - 40%
calf raise - 160%

Anytime you try to put exact numbers on something, you will find disagreement. That is my guess. I also have in the back of my mind that someone's weight does not exceed the highest shown in the referred to charts based on height and sex. Barring phyical problems, I think the numbers are in the ball park.

Thanks for giving me some kind of numbers rtestes, even if they are rough, it will still give me something to compare to.

Now I'm confused. So the BB was 60 lbs?

And yes, that would be excellent cardio. I'm thinking of a powerclean complex followed by high rep fast squats today for a weight workout to also burn some fat and increase LT.

OK these are the step up sets:

Barbell Step ups:
50x125# on 6" Step
120x85# on 8" Step
....
Barbell Step Up: 120x85# on 8" Step

When I do an exercise that alternates (and these did, but maybe I should have explicitly noted that), I coulnt all the reps as one set. So in these sets, there were 25, 60, and 60, step ups with the left leg, each followed by a step up with the right leg.

The barbell weight can be determined because there is a pound sign (#) after it. So the first set of 50 alternating step ups was done with at 125# barbell, and the other two sets of 120 step ups was done with the 85# barbell.

In both the barbell step-ups and the barbell Bulgarians I did, the barbell is mounted from the floor - cleaned and pressed overhead to the shoulders, and dismounted to the floor - pressed and lowered. This is because there is no rack in the gym that makes sense to use for this exercise, otherwise I could go quite a bit higher on the step ups and somewhat higher on the Bulgarians.

Note that the Bulgarians do not alternate, so the set descriptions:

Barbell Bulgarian Squats:
5R/5L x 145#
10x145#
10x165#

Mean that the first set was 5x145# on the left leg and 5x145# on the right leg, but without dismount or rest, and then the next two sets indicate 10x145# on the left leg, then 10x145# on the right leg, 10x165# on the left leg, then 10x165# on the right leg.

Now sort of here was my point in mentioning yesterday's set. In the last 10x165# on the right leg, the heart rate monitor shows:

124 Calories in 1 minute of exercise and 6 minutes rest
Maximum heart rate: 180
Average heart rate: 149

Then the next set of 50x125# step-ups we have:

137 Calories in 3:20 exercise, 6 minutes rest
Maximum heart rate: 184
Average heart rate: 152

OK so which one was cardio and which was strength exercise? They are actually pretty similar from the cardio point of view.

And I claim they are pretty similar from the strength point of view - they were similarly tough on the glutes. The fact that the load was lighter in the step ups is more than compensated by the extra muscle fibers recruited through fatigue. The toughest sets I did in that workout from a "perceived effort" point of view were the long step-ups. Sure the first few feel like nothing, but right around 90 it starts to get after you pretty good.

GH, what do you want? Do you want to LOOK like someone who can bench and deadlift a lot of weight?


I want to be stronger, but I don't necessarily need to look stronger.


My challenge to you is, you're not putting forth the effort. You can curse me out all you want, but if that's what is going to motivate you, then let me have it :nod: . Don't rely on a training partner to motivate you. Cultivate your own intensity and determination. A training partner always held me back.

Concentrate on a progressive strength training routine for the next 3 months where you are increasing loads on your squat, deadlift and bench press. Eliminate many other iso movements. Eat for mass. The nutrition aspect cannot be denied or thrown by the wayside anymore. This is the case now with elite strength athletes.

Keep a training log and train 3x per week. Deadlft (ancillory work), Bench Press (ancillory work), and Squats (ancillory work).

There's nothing complicated here
I appreciate the challenge. Can I not do this with my current routine? But I will consider it when I change my routine which I am sure I will do in not too much time.

OK these are the step up sets:



Zen, maybe you guys can take the discussion to a new thread?

Zen, maybe you guys can take the discussion to a new thread?

So you're not getting it. OK.

So you're not getting it. OK.

I'm not sure what you mean. but the reason I asked is because it's a pretty long detailed post on your workout, which you are explaining for someone who asked about it. I'm 100% positive that someone will have a further question on something you wrote and so it's probably best to go to a new thread than continue it here. I was not trying to be a smart ass.

I'm not sure what you mean. but the reason I asked is because it's a pretty long detailed post on your workout, which you are explaining for someone who asked about it.

I've been looking into "Fighting Gravity" since you started this thread and there are no new reps in it for days. The point of me taking mastover's bait about cardio and using the details of my most recent workout, which has some notable work in it, is that I don't have to look back very far in the journal to see some good work.

That's the advantage of having a detailed journal so that you can prove to yourself that you are putting some miles between you and your starting point.

The way you started this thread - with a pretty detailed set of weights for lifts - would not be a bad thing to have in your journal over time. It's a lot easier to become confident in your ability to become stronger if you collect some evidence.

I actually don't care what particular program you settle on. To the extent that you are not strong now, lots of stuff can make you stronger.

You won't know until you do the reps, and also track them in your journal though. It's OK to have weight measurements in the journal, but for strength you have to start getting some lifts in there.

That's the advantage of having a detailed journal so that you can prove to yourself that you are putting some miles between you and your starting point.


I agree. :blank: That's why I've kept a real life journal for weight lifting for the past 3 years. I have all the sets, reps, weights and exercises for every workout I have ever done since I began weightlifting in Feb. 2004 recorded in a spiral bound notebook that I take to the gym with me. So that when I am there I can look back at the last time I did any exercise and see how it went. I also record any comments about the workout on form or how I felt. I mention this in post 9 of this thread.

I don't typically put that information in my on-line journal because I personally don't have a need to.

So I am quite aware of the progress or lack of progress that I have made.

Do you honestly want me to believe that you wrote a long detailed post on your cardio/resistance workout, in order to make a point to me of the usefulness of keeping detailed journals? I find your last post very condescending. although perhaps I am reading it wrong.

Partly. Partly I was just taking mastover's bait for comedy value. Almost nothing anyone ever does is exclusively for one purpose.

But the fact remains that you are the one who is not satisfied with your strength, despite years of lifting and careful documentation.

Either you have a medical condition (hormones? I don't know, that would be one for a doctor) or else there is something about your workout history that does not add up.

Ok, so anyway...

Chest and back
Incline DB bench press
Bent over DB rows
Decline DB bench press
BB deadlift
Cable chest fly
Face pull

Legs and abs
BB Squats to parallel
BB SLDL
DB lunges
Standing calf raises in smith machine
Leg raises
Crunches

Arms and Shoulders
DB seated press
BB skull crushers on flat bench
DB standing curls
DB bent over raises for rear delt
Tricep cable pulldown with angled bar
BB standing curls with reverse grip
BB standing raises. Pulling a barbell held at the waist straight up .
Dips
Do you want to keep this routine? I think you can get strong with it, but I could honestly think of better splits to suit your goals. At the least I think I'd separate chest and back, especially if you plan to bench and deadlift in the same week.

Does it need to remain a 3-day split?

A snapshot of my nutrition:
kashi cinna-raisen crunch with skim milk
1.5 scoop opticen shake in water
banana
1.5 scoop opticen shake in water
a sandwich consisting of whole wheat bread lettuce, tomato and turkey or tuna
large grapefruit
some sort of dinner, fish w/ veg, or soup (turkey and chicken and tofu w/ veg) or chicken w/ veg, etc.
dark chocolate w/ peanut butter (small serving)
2 hard boiled eggs

Portions would be consisted with cutting I suppose.
This isn't exactly an "unclean" diet but I do think you should adjust it.

I'd probably throw out all the cereal and the chocolate. The Opticen can stay but I'd probably opt to use it only once per day and add Nitrean or another protein blend to the mix, but mix that protein blend with other foods (oats, peanut butter, heavy cream, and maybe flax once in a while).

Thos are just some very general thoughts. I'm still thinking about it.

Also, what are your goals as far as bodyfat is concerned? Are you okay with adding some bodyweight over the next few months? Or would you rather attempt to gain strength while bodyfat is reduced (or at least maintained as much as possible)?

Do you want to keep this routine? I think you can get strong with it, but I could honestly think of better splits to suit your goals. At the least I think I'd separate chest and back, especially if you plan to bench and deadlift in the same week.

Does it need to remain a 3-day split?


No I definitely am not married to it, I've only done it for one solid cycle. Nor do I need to keep it 3 days. what do you have in mind, in terms of partitioning the body parts.

how about:
day 1 - legs
day 2 - chest, abs
day 3 - back, shoulders
day 4 - arms

or some reordering of that.


This isn't exactly an "unclean" diet but I do think you should adjust it.

I'd probably throw out all the cereal and the chocolate.


:eek:
woah, woah, let's not be too hasty here. :D The cereal is bound to me and I to it. it's my favorite food. But I am willing to go without sometimes. What would you substitute? What if I added 2 hard boiled eggs along with it?

Now the chocolate. it's dark, so it good for me right :blank: . This is a mental compromise. m&m's is my all time favorite candy and in order to avoid having it I have been having, a very small serving of dark chocolate (60% cocao, 140 calories) with some PB.



The Opticen can stay but I'd probably opt to use it only once per day and add Nitrean or another protein blend to the mix, but mix that protein blend with other foods (oats, peanut butter, heavy cream, and maybe flax once in a while).

no problem I have Nitrean too, and actually mis up which one I take. The oats you say are, the dry oats right? Do you have a specific brand to start me off? And it just gets poured right in the shake no prep right? Never did the flax thing, but I will.


Also, what are your goals as far as bodyfat is concerned? Are you okay with adding some bodyweight over the next few months? Or would you rather attempt to gain strength while bodyfat is reduced (or at least maintained as much as possible)?
Right now I want to lose body fat. As I just put a bunch on. I guess I wouldn't mind adding body weight as long as it looked good on me. But no, I think for my present goal right now I want to get back to a lower body fat percentage. Then I will be working to maintain. Then in the future I could add mass if it is needed to get stronger.

I'm actually pretty happy with my size. I'm not big at all, but I am far from a pipsqueak. I certainly don't feel that I meet the classic, you need to bulk, answer. But I must be able to gain in strength even without bulking right? or maybe not.

My hamstrings are weak, need these to get stronger. Will only work by eating more? I definitely wouldn't mind maintaining in order to get stronger.

Right now I want to lose body fat. As I just put a bunch on. I guess I wouldn't mind adding body weight as long as it looked good on me. But no, I think for my present goal right now I want to get back to a lower body fat percentage. Then I will be working to maintain. Then in the future I could add mass if it is needed to get stronger.

I'm actually pretty happy with my size. I'm not big at all, but I am far from a pipsqueak. I certainly don't feel that I meet the classic, you need to bulk, answer. But I must be able to gain in strength even without bulking right? or maybe not.

My hamstrings are weak, need these to get stronger. Will only work by eating more? I definitely wouldn't mind maintaining in order to get stronger.

You're not going to believe this, or maybe you don't want to hear it, but your "problem" or goals are the number one thing guys want to achieve. Exactly as you described it. Most never attain it. Ever. Yet it's the easiest to attain. Not to repeat myself from an earlier post here, but there's nothing complicated in ultimately getting what you outlined. People just think it's complicated and difficult.

Yup, you gotta clean up the diet first - eliminate the junk and replace with lean proteins and clean carbs. Combine that with a progressive weight training program. Just imagine what transformation your physique would go through if you added 5 lbs to your squat and deadlift each week for the next 6 - 9 months. Let's say you added 130 lbs to each exercise at the end of 9 months. Do you think that your strength levels would be the same as they are now? Do you know what kind of impact all that muscle would have on your metabolism? With no exageration, I'd go out on a limb and say that you'd drop a ton of bodyfat, have a better V taper, wider shoulders, more defined and dimensional body, along with a ton of newfound energy AND strength. An all-inclusive with no unnecessary bulking/cutting scenarios or routines where only a NASA scientist would understand.

All it takes is commitment, perseverance, determination, and will. Do you have these attributes? I'm betting Yes :tu:

3. Get a lifting program that targets big compounds for strength. It means lifting heavy stuff, but that's what it's about. If you want to lift heavy stuff, then you got to lift heavy stuff.



Concentrate on a progressive strength training routine for the next 3 months where you are increasing loads on your squat, deadlift and bench press. Eliminate many other iso movements. Eat for mass. The nutrition aspect cannot be denied or thrown by the wayside anymore. This is the case now with elite strength athletes.

Keep a training log and train 3x per week. Deadlft (ancillory work), Bench Press (ancillory work), and Squats (ancillory work).




Okay so what's next GH? Are you wanting to get stronger now?

Are you willing to change your routine?

I could honestly think of better splits to suit your goals. At the least I think I'd separate chest and back, especially if you plan to bench and deadlift in the same week.



Okay I think it is starting to sink in now. I feel like Neo in the first matrix, "I know what you're trying to do." And you guys say, "You're faster than this, stop trying to hit me and hit me."

Just imagine what transformation your physique would go through if you added 5 lbs to your squat and deadlift each week for the next 6 - 9 months. Let's say you added 130 lbs to each exercise at the end of 9 months.

Ok I'm in. Is it this simple? I just add five more pounds to each exercise each week and eat right? This is it? Ok, I'll do it.

Okay I think it is starting to sink in now. I feel like Neo in the first matrix, "I know what you're trying to do." And you guys say, "You're faster than this, stop trying to hit me and hit me."



Ok I'm in. Is it this simple? I just add five more pounds to each exercise each week and eat right? This is it? Ok, I'll do it.

You won't be able to increase the load with every excercise every week.

I suggest you also go with an upper/lower split and after every 4 weeks change your excercise selections. Mostly just using different varations.

eg.
Flat BB press - Flat DB press

Ok I'm in. Is it this simple? I just add five more pounds to each exercise each week and eat right? This is it? Ok, I'll do it.

OK, I can feel your excitement here bud, but let's be reasonable LOL...

Not to EVERY exercise, but the prime, multi-joint exercises - mainly SQUATS and DEADLIFTS

You won't be able to increase the load with every excercise every week.


OK, I can feel your excitement here bud, but let's be reasonable LOL...

Not to EVERY exercise, but the prime, multi-joint exercises - mainly SQUATS and DEADLIFTS

Oh, yeah, I only meant those two. Still before, I would not have thought that I could just simply add 5 pounds a week to my deadlift and squat. But I will give it a shot. Good thing my gym has 2.5 pound plates.

Here's what I have for a new routine:

Day 1:
DB flat bench press
DB incline bench press
DB decline bench press
Dips

Day 2:
Deadlift
DB Rows
Pullups

Day 3:
BB Squat
DB lunges
Calf raises
(maybe those hamstring curls here)

Do I add a fourth day? Do I not directly work triceps, biceps, or shoulders?

1FastGTX what do you think too?

I'd swap Day 1 and Day 3 and then swap Day 2 with Day 3, so the order is:

Day 1: Squats
Day 2: Bench
Day 3: Deadlift

Or vice versa (3, 2, 1). M-W-F would be a good pattern to use with this split. I recommend squats first because of the priority principle -- whatever you do first in the week or a workout will have the most intensity devoted to it and improve the fastest. As Hatfield said, the squat is capable of more and faster growth than any other exercise, which is why I would recommend starting with it.

As far as the exercises on each day, I'd suggest something like this:

1. Start with a few heavy sets of the main exercise of choice (back squat, flat bench, or deadlift) for low reps (1-5). Wave intensity from week to week and go for a new maximum every 2-4 weeks.
2. Then move to assistance exercises for that main exercise with higher reps (6-12), a moderate volume (24-36 reps), and near failure. Work variations of the bench press, partial deadlift movements to build strength at your weak point, and variations of the squat (front squats, box squats, etc.).
3. Follow up these general assistance exercises, using a similar volume prescription, with one or two exercises specifically addressing the weak muscles in your movements. For bench press, tricep and shoulder exercises would be likely canidates -- floor presses, push presses, board presses, etc. For deadlifts, extra posterior chain work would be a great idea -- romanian deadlifts, snatch-grip deadlifts, cable pull-throughs, good mornings, etc. For the squat, unilateral exercises to boost quad strength (bulgarian split squats, step-ups, plain old split squats, etc.) or further posterior chain work would be appropriate.
4. Finally, for the remainder of your workout, distribute upper back and core work throughout the week to balance out the other work.

Here's what I have for a new routine:

Day 1:
DB flat bench press
DB incline bench press
DB decline bench press
Dips

Day 2:
Deadlift
DB Rows
Pullups

Day 3:
BB Squat
DB lunges
Calf raises
(maybe those hamstring curls here)

Do I add a fourth day? Do I not directly work triceps, biceps, or shoulders?

1FastGTX what do you think too?
For a one-bodypart-per-week-3-day-split it's ok, though I would definitely do what Chic suggested with the order.

If you do that you're going to definitely need more hamstring and lower back work in there. You should also throw in some tricep work.

And I might be in the minority here, but I would also say that flat barbell bench press should be in your list of "wanna get stronger" exercises. And you should be doing this exercise once in a while. No spotter? Get in the cage and bench press. :)

I think I saw a good 3-day split posted by Mastover once. Might want to search by his posts.

I like Canada's upper/lower split idea better myself.

SUN: Squat/Dead (Lower)
TUE: Bench (Upper)
THU: Squat/Dead (Lower)
FRI: Bench (Upper)

Probably just because I'm biased though (that's my split). :)

I'd swap Day 1 and Day 3 and then swap Day 2 with Day 3, so the order is:

Day 1: Squats
Day 2: Bench
Day 3: Deadlift


Thanks for the input chico! This sounds like a great routine. I would need to implement it over time as I have to look up the correct method for performing nearly all of the exercises you recommended. :doh:

The exercises I need(ed) to look up and have never done:

romanian deadlift
box squat
floor presses
push presses
board presses
cable pull-throughs
bulgarian split squats
step-ups
plain old split squats

a few quick questions:

1) a split squat is pretty much the same as a lunge? at least they look almost identical to me.

2) For the romanian deadlift. My hamstrings are pretty flexible and I have short legs (I can palm the floor easily), So the descriptions (http://www.webs.uidaho.edu/strength/romanian_deadlift.htm) I've read say to bend forward until your hamstrings feel a stretch. I can bend all the way over. So would this make the bulgarian deadlift almost identical to a SLDL with knees slightly bent, which I am familar with?

3) oh and 1-5 reps? how do I approach this? Do I decide to do a certain number of reps for each set that day and then vary the weight accordingly? Like on week I say, okay I will do 5 reps for 3 sets and then pick a weight I think I can do. And then the next week I decide to go for 3 reps for each set and then bump the weight up. Just wondering.

And I might be in the minority here, but I would also say that flat barbell bench press should be in your list of "wanna get stronger" exercises. And you should be doing this exercise once in a while. No spotter? Get in the cage and bench press. :)

will do. Thanks Chris. For your split, so you deadlift and squat on the same day twice in one week? Wow. Is one day for max weight and the other for high volume, like that Defranco routine?

a few quick questions:

1) a split squat is pretty much the same as a lunge? at least they look almost identical to me.
I only recently learned the difference. The split squat puts almost all your weight on your front foot. A lunge distributes the weight between the two legs and often uses a larger stride. From a side view, a split squat looks like a squat, while a lunge looks like a lunge -- if that even helps. :lol:

I prefer bulgarian split squats to split squats anyways and they're much easier to perform (as far as form).

zens is an expert on lunging so you might want to PM him. :eek:

2) For the romanian deadlift. My hamstrings are pretty flexible and I have short legs (I can palm the floor easily), So the descriptions (http://www.webs.uidaho.edu/strength/romanian_deadlift.htm) I've read say to bend forward until your hamstrings feel a stretch. I can bend all the way over. So would this make the bulgarian deadlift almost identical to a SLDL with knees slightly bent, which I am familar with?
There have been a couple good threads on RDL vs. SLDL in the past that you might want to search for. I assume you mean romanian deadlift in that last sentence. For the RDL, the big thing is that you hold the bar at lockout with the knees bent slightly and then you thrust your butt backwards, which forces you to lower your torso. You keep pushing the butt back until the torso can go no lower or you are about to lose your balance. Your knees can bend a bit further, but they cannot bend too much or else the emphasis on the hamstrings / posterior chain lessens. Once you've reached this limit, you pull the hips back in which returns your body upright.

In a RDL, it's not really about your toe touch stretch. It's more about your good morning stretch (not the exercise). Keeping your knees straight and your back straight, how far can you lower your torso? Just getting to parallel can be hard. :)

Most people perceive the ROM in an RDL, good morning, or even SLDL wrong. It's not about how low your torso is to the ground, but the change in the angle of your torso to the legs at the hips.

3) oh and 1-5 reps? how do I approach this? Do I decide to do a certain number of reps for each set that day and then vary the weight accordingly? Like on week I say, okay I will do 5 reps for 3 sets and then pick a weight I think I can do. And then the next week I decide to go for 3 reps for each set and then bump the weight up. Just wondering.
There's a couple different ways you can do this. The easiest is just to work up to a RM each week. For example:

Week 1: Work up to 5-RM
Week 2: Work up to 3-RM
Week 3: Work up to 5-RM (greater than Week 1)
Week 4: Work up to 1-RM
Week 5: Work up to 5-RM (greater than Week 3 and reestimated based off of new 1-RM)
Week 6: Work up to 3-RM (greater than Week 2)
Week 7: Work up to 5-RM (greater than Week 5)
Week 8: Work up to 1-RM (greater than Week 4)
Week 9: deload or week off

If you're not comfortable with 1-RM's, a 2-RM would work great and they can be more accurate since they're harder to cheat.

will do. Thanks Chris. For your split, so you deadlift and squat on the same day twice in one week? Wow. Is one day for max weight and the other for high volume, like that Defranco routine?

I remember last year, I was working with my 16 year old 138 lb grandson. I asked how much he deadlifted with at school. He said 80 lbs, I said that was good. I set that up and said let me see you do 10 reps. He did 10 reps in good form. In fact everything he did was in good form, his high school taught that well.

After he rested a minute, I put 110 lbs on and said give me 10 reps. He did, it was hard, but he kept form. Then after a minute or so rest as I put 20 more lbs on. I ask him to give me 10 reps, he said he couldn't. I said give me as many as you can. With a little " don't be a girl, quit wimping: and etc. on last reps he gave me 8.5 reps. a 62.5% improvement in 10 minutes.

The point, we are all stronger than we think we are, just try. How many times have you gone to same weight because you know you can do that.

There is a beauty in rep ranges, also. Say work in a range 8-12 reps, then simply Do as many reps as possible, if you can't complete 8 reps in good form, reduce weight next workout. If you can do 12 or more, increase weight next workout. See there is no set number of reps, you do as many as you can, but it tends to keep you in range. Triple progression!

I only recently learned the difference. The split squat puts almost all your weight on your front foot. A lunge distributes the weight between the two legs and often uses a larger stride. From a side view, a split squat looks like a squat, while a lunge looks like a lunge -- if that even helps. :lol:
yes, it makes sense. thanks :tucool:


zens is an expert on lunging so you might want to PM him. :eek:

uh, I think I'm on the outs with him.

There have been a couple good threads on RDL vs. SLDL in the past that you might want to search for. I assume you mean romanian deadlift in that last sentence. For the RDL, the big thing is that you hold the bar at lockout with the knees bent slightly and then you thrust your butt backwards, which forces you to lower your torso. You keep pushing the butt back until the torso can go no lower or you are about to lose your balance. Your knees can bend a bit further, but they cannot bend too much or else the emphasis on the hamstrings / posterior chain lessens. Once you've reached this limit, you pull the hips back in which returns your body upright.

okay, now that you've described the goal in each they seem like completely different exercises


In a RDL, it's not really about your toe touch stretch. It's more about your good morning stretch (not the exercise). Keeping your knees straight and your back straight, how far can you lower your torso? Just getting to parallel can be hard. :)


Okay with these restrictions I can get to parallel. Without bending my back or knees I can reach to about 2 inches from my toes (I have short arms as well as legs, I'm all torso :lol: ).



Week 1: Work up to 5-RM


when you say work up to it, do you mean, I know I'm going to do 3 sets so I use the first two in order to pick the right weight for a 5 rep max on the last set. is this what you mean?

In searching for your exercises I came across these two articles involving Defranco that I thought were really cool:


http://www.strengthcats.com/JDfabulous15.htm

http://www.defrancostraining.com/articles/archive/articles_t-mag_promaker.htm

The point, we are all stronger than we think we are, just try. How many times have you gone to same weight because you know you can do that.


way too often. this combined with inconsistent dedication is probably why some exercises have not progressed much in the last year.

After he rested a minute, I put 110 lbs on and said give me 10 reps. He did, it was hard, but he kept form. Then after a minute or so rest as I put 20 more lbs on. I ask him to give me 10 reps, he said he couldn't. I said give me as many as you can. With a little " don't be a girl, quit wimping: and etc. on last reps he gave me 8.5 reps. a 62.5% improvement in 10 minutes.

The point, we are all stronger than we think we are, just try. How many times have you gone to same weight because you know you can do that.



I saw this first hand last Wednesday when I did my leg workout.
For some reason in my log book I wrote deadlifts at the top with the weight I was going to use (increased because I completed 10 reps with good form the week before :tu:) even though I do back squats first.
So anyway I did a few warm up sets of squats, then looked at the log book and loaded on the weight. However I loaded on the weight I was aiming to do for deadlifts which was 25lbs heavier then what I aimed to do for squats.
I didn't realise till I came to doing my deadlifts what I had done, but I completed 3 sets of squats with 10 reps each with a much heavier weight then last week BY ACCIDENT!
Just shows that sometimes its our mental side which stops the physical side from performing to its best. :bb:

Instead of working today, I spent the day making a routine for the week. We'll see how week 1 goes. (Tues, Thurs, Sat.)

Day 1: Squat day

3 sets of 4-5 reps of Squat
3 sets of 9 reps of DB Bulgarian split squats
3 sets of 9 reps of DB lunge
3 sets of 9 standing calf raises
3 sets of 9 hamstring isolation (not sure yet what)
Ab work

Day 2: Bench day

3 sets of 4-5 reps of DB flat bench
3 sets of 9 reps of incline DB bench
3 sets of 9 reps of decline DB bench
3 sets of 9 reps of seated DB press
3 sets of 9 reps of close grip BB flat bench press

Day 3: Deadlift day

3 sets of 4-5 reps of deadlift
3 sets of 9 partial dead lifts (the bottom of the lift)
3 sets of 9 snatch grip deadlifts
3 sets of 9 cable pull-throughs
3 sets of 9 good mornings.
pullups

when you say work up to it, do you mean, I know I'm going to do 3 sets so I use the first two in order to pick the right weight for a 5 rep max on the last set. is this what you mean?
Yes. Just a regular pyramid:

Bench Press: 5 x 70, 5 x 80, 5 x 90, 5 x 100

You increment the weight over a few sets until you hit failure for the RM.

In searching for your exercises I came across these two articles involving Defranco that I thought were really cool:

http://www.strengthcats.com/JDfabulous15.htm

http://www.defrancostraining.com/articles/archive/articles_t-mag_promaker.htm
:nod:

He has some good stuff.

Instead of working today, I spent the day making a routine for the week. We'll see how week 1 goes. (Tues, Thurs, Sat.)

Day 1: Squat day

3 sets of 4-5 reps of Squat
3 sets of 9 reps of DB Bulgarian split squats
3 sets of 9 reps of DB lunge
3 sets of 9 standing calf raises
3 sets of 9 hamstring isolation (not sure yet what)
Ab work

Day 2: Bench day

3 sets of 4-5 reps of DB flat bench
3 sets of 9 reps of incline DB bench
3 sets of 9 reps of decline DB bench
3 sets of 9 reps of seated DB press
3 sets of 9 reps of close grip BB flat bench press

Day 3: Deadlift day

3 sets of 4-5 reps of deadlift
3 sets of 9 partial dead lifts (the bottom of the lift)
3 sets of 9 snatch grip deadlifts
3 sets of 9 cable pull-throughs
3 sets of 9 good mornings.
pullups


That seems like a lot of volume to me.......I'd try to reduce the volume and also shift reps to the 3-5 range (assuming strength is your goal).

Yeah i think GH is stuck in the bodybuilding split world still. :)

Higher frequency is better for strength gains GH because motor learning is very important.

Each session should have 1-2 main compound lifts for a 3RM and some assesory work, 8-15reps IMO.

Edit: No offense meant GH i just think an upper/lower split is probably your best route for strength gains and of course hypertrophy won't suffer.

I didn't realise till I came to doing my deadlifts what I had done, but I completed 3 sets of squats with 10 reps each with a much heavier weight then last week BY ACCIDENT!

Ha, maybe a fun study would be to work with a trainer and don't look how much weight he uses and then the whole focus would be on form and the movement and not the mental issues with the weight. blind weightlifting. :nod:

That seems like a lot of volume to me.......I'd try to reduce the volume and also shift reps to the 3-5 range (assuming strength is your goal).

Yeah i think GH is stuck in the bodybuilding split world still. :)

Higher frequency is better for strength gains GH because motor learning is very important.

Each session should have 1-2 main compound lifts for a 3RM and some assesory work, 8-15reps IMO.

Edit: No offense meant GH i just think an upper/lower split is probably your best route for strength gains and of course hypertrophy won't suffer.

:bang: :bang: I knew you guys would say this. Well I have to start somewhere. And I'm sure I'll modify things when I get to the gym. I'm going to stick with 3 days for now and see what happens. I will always change things around to keep it interesting. as long as I keep getting stronger.

You can still do an upper/lower split using three days. Just rotate them. Some weeks, you get two uppers, one lower, the next you get two lower one upper.

Or, if you're stuck at 3 days, full body is an option, with different exercises every day of the week. About 5-7 total exercises per day, primarily compound movements.

The key I think is progression and intensity. Whether it's weight, sets, reps, training density, or whatever, you need to always strive to do more than last session. No matter what you end up doing exactly.

You can still do an upper/lower split using three days. Just rotate them. Some weeks, you get two uppers, one lower, the next you get two lower one upper.

Or, if you're stuck at 3 days, full body is an option, with different exercises every day of the week. About 5-7 total exercises per day, primarily compound movements.

The key I think is progression and intensity. Whether it's weight, sets, reps, training density, or whatever, you need to always strive to do more than last session. No matter what you end up doing exactly.

Good point MB.

GH you can do that - 2 upperbody sessions and 1 lowerbody session one week and reverse that the next week.

Good point MB.

GH you can do that - 2 upperbody sessions and 1 lowerbody session one week and reverse that the next week.

Okay mannish and canada, I will definitely consider it. But Mastover and chicanerous recommended this type of routine, so I am going to give it a shot in the beginning. At least for a month.

I did a fullbody workout twice a week (all compound movements) this past summer and I think it was too much, i was always still sore by the next workout. But maybe your guys method will space it out by just enough to recover.

Oh, I'm not trying to get you to go a different route than suggested by chicanerous and mastover, I was just pointing out you could still do upper/lowers on a 3 day week based on your other response if you decide to in the future.

As for fullbody and recovery, you have to plan it full body and not over do it. Seems many going from splits to full body still try to get way too many exercises into those sessions. 5 or 6 is plenty if they're mostly big compound movements.

GL.

Okay mannish and canada, I will definitely consider it. But Mastover and chicanerous recommended this type of routine, so I am going to give it a shot in the beginning. At least for a month.
You got the right idea down with the new routine you posted, but it's still leaning toward a bodybuilding split.

Strictly as an example, here's something based exactly off what I recommended:

Day 1. (assuming your squat weak point is quad strength in general)

BB Back Squat: work up to a rep max
BB Front Squat: 4 sets of 6-10 reps
BB Step-up: 3 sets of 8-12 reps

Unilateral DB Row: 3 sets of 8-12 reps

Day 3. (assuming your triceps are a weak point in your bench press)

Flat BB Bench Press: work up to a rep max
Flat DB Bench Press: 4 sets of 6-10 reps
Close-Grip BB Bench Press: 3 set of 8-12 reps

Cable Crunch: 3 sets of 8-12 reps

Day 5. (assuming your deadlift weak point is pulling off the floor)

Conventional BB Deadlift: work up to a rep max
Snatch-Grip BB Deadlift: 4 sets of 6-10 reps
Romanian BB Deadlift: 3 sets of 8-12 reps

Cable Row: 3 sets of 8-12 reps

I would try not to fail on any set but the last set of an exercise, but constantly attempt to use more weight or increase the number of reps I do. If I started to plateau on an assistance exercise, I would switch to a different one. I'd also regularly vary at least one of the assistance exercises on each day (i.e. the second or third exercise in each workout) every 3-4 weeks as well as at least one of the back exercises (i.e. the last exercise on day one and five).

I would also make sure that both my assistance exercises are not near the top of their rep ranges at the same time, otherwise I could be doing a bit more volume than I'd recommend (e.g. 4 x 10 + 3 x 12 = 76 total reps :eek:).

For the maxes, I would use the wave scheme:

Week 1: Work up to 5-RM
Week 2: Work up to 3-RM
Week 3: Work up to 5-RM (greater than Week 1)
Week 4: Work up to 2-RM
Week 5: Work up to 5-RM (greater than Week 3 and reestimated based off of week 4's 2-RM)
Week 6: Work up to 3-RM (greater than Week 2)
Week 7: Work up to 5-RM (greater than Week 5)
Week 8: Work up to 2-RM (greater than Week 4)
Week 9: deload or week off

:nod:

He has some good stuff.
You should see his new DVD. It's pretty good. Shoot, I need to do a review thread.

will do. Thanks Chris. For your split, so you deadlift and squat on the same day twice in one week? Wow. Is one day for max weight and the other for high volume, like that Defranco routine?
It's sort of like Defranco's. Sort of. It's usually EITHER squat OR deadlift on each squat/deadlift day.

Sometimes it's squatting twice per week. Sometimes it's deadlifting twice per week. Sometimes it's squatting once per week and deadlifting once per week. Sometimes it's box squatting on one day and A2G on another. Sometimes it's box squatting followed by DB Stiff-Leg Deadlifts, etc. It varies. :)

Sometimes it's squatting twice per week. Sometimes it's deadlifting twice per week. Sometimes it's squatting once per week and deadlifting once per week. Sometimes it's box squatting on one day and A2G on another. Sometimes it's box squatting followed by DB Stiff-Leg Deadlifts, etc. It varies. :)

wow, sounds fun to have it so vary so much. How far in advance do you plan?

I squat today :evil:

Hey GH I know you already said you tried Full Body Routines and they were taxing on you but what about Rippetoes Starting Strength? It's low reps, high intensity. I am currently doing this program and I love it. I tried Chad Waterbury's stuff and wasn't to happy after a while. I find this one fun and easy to stick to.

Here's a slight variation of the program if you haven't already seen it. I've followed this thread pretty closely and lot's of people are pleased with it and making great gains. It's a little bit of a read but well worth it I think.
http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=750551

I squat today :evil:

The results (http://forums.johnstonefitness.com/showpost.php?p=426612&postcount=103) of my first workout :D

The results (http://forums.johnstonefitness.com/showpost.php?p=426612&postcount=103) of my first workout :D

Awesome GH! A 35lb increase! :claplow:

Awesome GH! A 35lb increase! :claplow:

yeah seems like I just needed a kick in the ass. so much of it is mental. I swore 145 was damn heavy a week ago.

I have to admit, when I was lining up to do 180, I was thinking "lightweight, lightweight" in my head. :o :lol:

The results (http://forums.johnstonefitness.com/showpost.php?p=426612&postcount=103) of my first workout :D

Post (well, link) of the month!!!!

Great job GH!

yeah seems like I just needed a kick in the ass. so much of it is mental. I swore 145 was damn heavy a week ago.

I have to admit, when I was lining up to do 180, I was thinking "lightweight, lightweight" in my head. :o :lol:

:lol:

You sure it wasn't, "bright light, bright light". :)

:lol:

You sure it wasn't, "bright light, bright light". :)

I'm gonna pretend that you didn't just compare me to gizmo :blank:
Now that I'm squatting 180 you better watch out canada :D ;)

Post (well, link) of the month!!!!

Great job GH!

thanks coach!

I'm gonna pretend that you didn't just compare me to gizmo :blank:
Now that I'm squatting 180 you better watch out canada :D ;)

You go gizmo! :p

The results (http://forums.johnstonefitness.com/showpost.php?p=427678&postcount=111) of the first day of Bench in my new program. :D

GH i don't get your 75 BB press? 75Kg?

Or is it a DB press with 75lb dumbells?

GH i don't get your 75 BB press? 75Kg?

Or is it a DB press with 75lb dumbells?
The next step is to sign GH up for handwriting lessons. :whistle:

GH i don't get your 75 BB press? 75Kg?

Or is it a DB press with 75lb dumbells?

:doh: It says DB flat press. so yes I was using 75 lb DB, my chicken scratch is hard to read I know.

The next step is to sign GH up for handwriting lessons. :whistle:
:tu:

:doh: It says DB flat press. so yes I was using 75 lb DB, my chicken scratch is hard to read I know.


:tu:

Decent weight dude, keep up the good work. :)