Hi All!

I need some serious advise/critique on my girlfriend's routine and nutrition.
She has been following this routine & diet for about 4 months now and ....well.....nothing. She's actually put on a kilogram or 2. This is becoming very frustrating for both of us - she needs to see some results or she's gonna throw in the towel very soon.

Here's her diet:

5:30 - 250ml Orange Juice (Pre-Workout)
8:00 - 2 Biscuits of ready-to-eat Shredded wheat with 200ml Fat-Free Milk.
10:30 - 150ml Fat-Free Yogurt with an apple/pear/2 tangerines
13:00 - Sandwich made with wholewheat bread, 2 slices of turkey/chicken/beef/ham, lettuce, tomato, cucumber, 2 small slices mozarella cheese, mustard/low-fat mayo and small amount of low-fat margerine. Always with about 2 cups mixed salad on the side.
15:00 - Snack bar/Muffin with an apple/pear/2 tangerines.
19:00 - 1 Chicken Breast with 1/2 cup brown rice and 1 cup mixed vegetables.

I've entered this all on DietOrganizer and it normally comes to about 1500kcal.

She drinks about 2 litres of water/day.

She lifts weights 3 times per week (mon,wed,fri) with a very decent 3-day split - always with a 10min warmup on a stationary bike/treadmill.
On Tues and Thurs she does 40min cardio (LISS). All workouts are done in the early morning.

She is 25 years old, weighs 75kg, 32% body fat and is 1.65m tall.

Her goal is to lose about 10kg and get that body fat % way down.

Please help!!!!

Regards,
AngeliX

My opinions... :)

Hi All!

I need some serious advise/critique on my girlfriend's routine and nutrition.
She has been following this routine & diet for about 4 months now and ....well.....nothing. She's actually put on a kilogram or 2. This is becoming very frustrating for both of us - she needs to see some results or she's gonna throw in the towel very soon.
Well, be sure to remind her that she might be gaining muscle as well, and not to look just at the scale when determining progress. Have her judge progress by how her clothes fit, how she looks in the mirror, how she feels, by a tape measure, etc. :tucool:

Now for some general thoughts on diet, though I won't really get into total calories or macros just yet...

5:30 - 250ml Orange Juice (Pre-Workout)
I might change this to actual fruit instead of fruit juice.

8:00 - 2 Biscuits of ready-to-eat Shredded wheat with 200ml Fat-Free Milk.
This isn't terrible but I would change it to something like oatmeal, eggs, egg whites, and possibly a strip or two of turkey bacon.

10:30 - 150ml Fat-Free Yogurt with an apple/pear/2 tangerines
Need to get some protein in here I think. It's kind of high on the carbs too IMHO, lots of fruit there. I'd drop some of them, and add in some protein like chicken breast, ground beef or turkey, etc. If she likes protein powder a good protein blend would work nice here too.

13:00 - Sandwich made with wholewheat bread, 2 slices of turkey/chicken/beef/ham, lettuce, tomato, cucumber, 2 small slices mozarella cheese, mustard/low-fat mayo and small amount of low-fat margerine. Always with about 2 cups mixed salad on the side.
This isn't too bad. I'm not a huge fan of sandwiches on a strict diet but it can certainly work. What does she have in the salad? What kind of dressing?

I MIGHT drop the cheese and margerine here.

Glad to see her getting a lot of veggies though. :tucool:

15:00 - Snack bar/Muffin with an apple/pear/2 tangerines.
I think she can do much better than this meal. :) Again, add some protein here, and I personally would drop some of that fruit.

19:00 - 1 Chicken Breast with 1/2 cup brown rice and 1 cup mixed vegetables.
Decent. :tucool:

She might want to consider taking the 19:00 meal and moving it to 15:00 (replacing 15:00 with what she eats at 19:00), then having an additional meal right before bed, something like cottage cheese with a handful of peanuts, or natural peanut butter, or flax seed oil (not a handful of flax seed oil, just maybe 1/2-1 tablespoon :D ).

Well, be sure to remind her that she might be gaining muscle as well, and not to look just at the scale when determining progress. Have her judge progress by how her clothes fit, how she looks in the mirror, how she feels, by a tape measure, etc. :tucool:

I just don't think this is true. While we all think the scale weight going up means we're gaining muscle, 9 times out of 10, it's the diet that's at fault.

Fast's other advice is great. Food choices do make a difference. Otherwise, have her do more cardio- more like 5-6 days a week. At 32% (and if you're not amazing at taking very accurate readings, it's probably higher), she should cut some fat. A good diet with lots of cardio (with some lifting) will do that.

Good luck.

I just don't think this is true. While we all think the scale weight going up means we're gaining muscle, 9 times out of 10, it's the diet that's at fault.

Fast's other advice is great. Food choices do make a difference. Otherwise, have her do more cardio- more like 5-6 days a week. At 32% (and if you're not amazing at taking very accurate readings, it's probably higher), she should cut some fat. A good diet with lots of cardio (with some lifting) will do that.

Good luck.
I never said the scale weight going up means she is absolutely gaining muscle, I said "might."

I just think there are better tools for judging progress. Don't you agree?

1FastGTX - To answer some of your questions:

The salad is a basic green salad with lettuce, cucumber, tomato, spring onions, mozzarella cheese & sometimes olives.

The dressing is a home-made dressing with lemon juice, soya sauce, pepper, apple cider vinegar and a splash of olive oil.

I don't think she'd go for Protein Shakes - so I need to source the protein from actual food.

Also - you say that there is too much fruit - but when I say "apple/pear/2 tangerines" I mean either an apple or a pear or 2 tangerines. Same with all others - replace "/' with "or".

Also - swopping out her 7pm meal with the 3pm meal is not an option.
She only comes home at 18:30 and I prepare our evening meal.

Also - I forgot to add that she does Ballet (quite intense) for 2 hours every afternoon after work except for wednesdays.

Regards,
AngeliX

Her clothes are not fitting any different either - to answer another question. :cry:

5'4" 165lbs (for the metrically challenged).

I think the balance is off....cals looks about right but let's break that down.

Average Calories
grams cals %total
Total: 1697
Fat: 39 350 21%
Sat: 16 141 9%
Poly: 8 73 5%
Mono: 11 97 6%
Carbs: 241 842 52%
Fiber: 30 0 0%
Protein: 109 435 27%
Alcohol: 0 0 0%


I guesstimated on quantities a bit but I'm not far off in cals.

It's not horribly bad, but for weightloss I'd bump up protein a bit. I'd also try to put together more complete "meals".


5:30 - 250ml Orange Juice (Pre-Workout) <---Have an orange
8:00 - 2 Biscuits of ready-to-eat Shredded wheat with 200ml 1% Milk + cottage cheese (or eggs).
10:30 - 150ml Fat-Free Yogurt with handful of almonds + some jerky + 3 fish oil caps
13:00 - Sandwich made with wholewheat bread, 2 slices of turkey/chicken/beef/ham, lettuce, tomato, cucumber, 2 small slices mozarella cheese, mustard/low-fat mayo and small amount of low-fat margerine. Always with about 2 cups mixed salad on the side. <---Personally I'd kill the mayo and margarine and possibly the cheese slice (or back off to 1 slice) and throw an extra slice of meat on there (though she'd be better off with a whole chicken breast)
15:00 - Snack bar/Muffin with an apple/pear/2 tangerines. <---redo this (Jerky or cottage cheese or canned tuna or chicken etc... + sunflower seeds + apple + 3 fish oil caps) Have the muffin on Fridays as a cheat.
19:00 - 1 Chicken Breast with 1/2 cup brown rice and 1 cup mixed vegetables (+ 1/4 avocado).

Also mix up the cardio....do some moderate paced cardio (stuff that gets you breathing hard) for say 20 mins one day and then LISS the next and then have a really intense sprint the following session for say 10 to 15 mins (something that wipes you out and was a real true challenge to get through)....

Try that once in a while instead of always 40 mins of LISS.

1500 cals/day seems about right. When I can't seem to drop fat it's usually due to the fact that I'm eating more than I think I am. Recheck all portions. Make sure to weigh EVERYTHING. Don't just rely on the box to give you correct calorie information. Make sure you count everything, including veges!

You might also want to get some blood tests done... just to make sure there isn't anything medically wrong with her (thyroid problems, etc.)

The day you posted - is that a typical day, a "being good day" or a "sample day". I don't eat the same every day, and would be suprised if your dear gf does. Are there any extra calories creeping in there, a cookie at work? A full sugar soda? Sugar in the odd cup of tea? Forgotten calories count too.

To echo the others, she needs to boost her cardio. I have been fortunate enough to lose 64lbs so far, but have plateaued for a while. My body fat is still coming down, but slower now. I have just shaken up my cardio. It's really important to completely revisit your exercise routine and your diet regularly. I mark it on my calendar to do this every six weeks.

Has she any support? Diet buddies? Workout buddies? I find this makes a huge difference. I have got everyone on board with my weight loss, everyone from the staff at my work cafeteria, to the lady at the newsagent, to the barmaid at our local pub! It makes it a lot harder to buy a chocolate bar or a barcadi and coke if everyone knows your watching what you eat ;)

If these readings are accurate, and Gordo's calculations are approximately on point, the 241 grams of carbs per day is overboard x10. Way overkill. Especially all the simple carbs.

There might be other "nickel and dime" carbs in there that all add up. Not to mention the junk calories with the margerine and mayo.

IMHO the cardio would be unnecessary, especially if she is as active as you say she is with the ballet.

Bring those carbs down, eliminate starchy carbs from the final 2-3 meals for the day, increase lean proteins, and I guarantee she will begin to drop nicely.

With the decrease in carbs, make sure she is getting her EFA's in there as well.

I read your first post. She's either eating too much or should up her cardio. Also, nobody should ever do something for 4 months without progress. If things aren't changing quickly, the program is not working. Doing the same useless program for extra time won't make it any more effective!

Have her do cardio 6 times/week and see how that works and cut cal down to 1300-1400.

Have her do cardio 6 times/week and see how that works and cut cal down to 1300-1400.
Isn't it possible her calories are too low? At 165 pounds, a "normal" caloric range for maintenance (by the "quick method") (http://www.femalemuscle.com/nutrition/calculate.html)should be about 2300 - 2600. Her target calories for fat loss could be about 1900 - 2000 calories based on Tom Venuto's advice. Maybe boosting up her calorie intake would increase her metabolism.

Help me out here, I'm not good on the science behind this.

Have her do cardio 6 times/week and see how that works and cut cal down to 1300-1400.
I STRONGLY disagree. Here is why:

Also - I forgot to add that she does Ballet (quite intense) for 2 hours every afternoon after work except for wednesdays.

So, she is already doing 2 hours of pretty intense cardio a few times a week. No need to add to this.

First off, dump the orange juice. Especially in the morning like that. Have her switch here cardio workouts to right away in the morning if possible.

ALso, 1500 cals or so is way too low for the amount of work she is doing. (Lifting weight 3 times/week plus dancing). Go up to at least 1800-2000.

Thirdly, there is hardly any protein in her diet. Protein is thermogenic, and she will also need it to help keep the muscle tissue around while losing fat. If you can't get her to use protein shakes then she's gonna have to at least add another chicken breast meal in there somewhere. They are only around 110 calories anyway so it will help get here protein and calories up where they should help.


Also toss the yogurt. It's got milk, which seems to cause lots of issues with people. Also, it's "Fat Free" which means instead its loaded with sugar. Sugar + diet = bad. That's why orange juice is bad, too much sugar.

Really she needs to form a better taste for foods other than the "conventional" mainstream marketing diet foods (i.e., yogurt and salad). Better that she start to enjoy almonds for some fat and calories, and chicken and tuna for protein (and some red meat too if needed), and breads and rices for carbs. No yogurt (worthless) and no fruit (also worthless).

-niko

Isn't it possible her calories are too low? At 165 pounds, a "normal" caloric range for maintenance (by the "quick method") (http://www.femalemuscle.com/nutrition/calculate.html)should be about 2300 - 2600. Her target calories for fat loss could be about 1900 - 2000 calories based on Tom Venuto's advice. Maybe boosting up her calorie intake would increase her metabolism.

Help me out here, I'm not good on the science behind this.

I'm with you on that Guava... 1500 calories a day WITH two hours of ballet AND weight training/cardio is probably too little.

IMHO the cardio would be unnecessary, especially if she is as active as you say she is with the ballet.

Might not be necessary for fat loss, but it might be necessary for her to be up to that ballet.

I don't know about the ballet. If she's 75kg and 1.65m tall then I wonder why the 8 hours a week of ballet isn't frying the calories. That kind of weight + ballet should be a good deal of work. Ballet work is not all that different from fencing footwork, and two hours of that can be a lot of calories. Let me make that concrete as well as I can:

Just the other day I set the treadmill for 1.5 mph and did fencing footwork for a few minutes as part of my cardio. 1.5 mph is slow. No incline, no added weight. No leaping stuff - just advance and retreat. But it got my heart rate up into the middle 150s range, and that would mean, going on my other workouts, about 830 Direct calories an hour - in other words not counting EPOC (after burn). I weigh about 88kg at the moment. So someone weighing 75kg could burn about 700 Calories per hour doing that sort of thing. OK, so she doesn't just hammer away for two hours continuous, suppose she is working half the time of the two hours. That is still about 700 Calories on those days.

That is upwards of 2800 Calories per week of the ballet, if it is intense, and you did say intense.

How does she feel about the ballet workouts? Does she have energy through the whole two hours?

If she is doing this sort of calorie expenditure - then maybe she's not eating enough?

Are there symptoms of low energy and lack of enthusiasm for activity?

No yogurt (worthless) and no fruit (also worthless).
I'm curious about how you came to this conclusion. I find a LOT of worth in yogurt and fruit.

I'm curious about how you came to this conclusion. I find a LOT of worth in yogurt and fruit.

ya know... I was going to ask the exact same question this afternoon, but then I remembered the last time someone argued the merits of dairy and fruit, and decided it wasn't worth the beatdown. :spank:

I like dairy I like fruit I like foods that make me toot

Might not be necessary for fat loss, but it might be necessary for her to be up to that ballet.

I don't know about the ballet. If she's 75kg and 1.65m tall then I wonder why the 8 hours a week of ballet isn't frying the calories. That kind of weight + ballet should be a good deal of work. Ballet work is not all that different from fencing footwork, and two hours of that can be a lot of calories.

I agree, but don't see how the extra cardio can help with the ballet.

From a different angle, my mother was a ballerina, toured the country, South America, etc. She never did any treadmill, or HIIT, or LISS, or anything else. Ate a lot, and was always slim. I'm sure all the dancing had a big impact upon it all. As well as genetic disposition.

Another example, I do no cardio whatsoever yet have no probs completing my high intensity leg training workouts. Heck, I don't even know what my target heart rate is for fat loss, nor do I care. I know bodybuilders who perform regular bouts of cardio year round, that train legs with me on occasion, yet give out half way through. Not because I'm a badass, but because their lungs give out before their legs do. Otherwise, they are more then capable of using and exceeding the weights I use.

I don't mean to praise the worth of good nutrition, but I'll do so again here. In the mean time, if this girl hasn't done so already, I'd get a complete physical before anything else.

I agree, but don't see how the extra cardio can help with the ballet..

It's for shifting the metabolism over by increasing the mitochondria population in the muscle. That, and providing a low increase in the blood pressure to force nutrients into the avascular parts of the connective tissue.

She's kind of heavy to do ballet, so it's probably doing a big number on her joints compared to the usual weightless ballerina types. The LISS cardio, especially low impact, is one thing you can do for prehab/rehab of the joints.

Since her ballet is probably a lot of "hurry up and wait" activity, that is probably getting her the work near the lactate threshold to build VO2max and lactate threshold. But like the round-based fighting sports, the LISS cardio increase in mitochondria helps recovery. Same reason boxers do roadwork. The actual fighting in fencing is like 90% dependent on the ATP/PC energy system - the fastest one you have. So why do any cardio at all? Why not just lift? But unlike sumo wresting, where one really good shove can win, you need to score a lot of touches (such as 15) to win a bout. If the other guy is any good, and there are actions that don't score, then you can end up with 30-50 reps of leaping and sprinting before you win (for example I counted 44 actions in this bout (http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=1478623914238877457&q=fencing)). The key is that between touches and rounds, you catch your breath - you recover. Or you get beat. Being good at "catching your breath" is essentially all down to how much LISS is in your program.

As you know, I regard LISS as a stepping stone only in fat loss. You have to do it to get to where you can do better stuff. But for overall cardiovascular performance, it turns out that LISS has a role to play even for advanced trainees, which is more like this situation.

okay zen... I give up. I guess we'll never agree on anything :rolleyes: You advocate and enjoy cardio, and I despise it.

I believe our friend here is of endomorphic qualities. An endomorph has to pay unique attention to their diet. Nothing of non-nutritive value, or empty calories can be consumed on a regular (or irregular) basis if fat loss and getting lean is the goal. They must also avoid a sedentary lifestyle and seek ways to remain active. This is where sports activities become critical.

HIIT cardio would benefit these bodytype individuals. For resistance training the endo can benefit from volume and higher bouts of work. I.E., different rep speeds, supersets, rest between sets, negatives, drop sets, you get the picture. This I've found to be more effective for capiilary intrusion (and expansion) for increasing the mitochondrial population and pathways. But to be fair, my experience in this regard, is limited.

Again, we are not putting any emphasis on her nutrition, which is the catalyst for all things related to our discussion.

Additionally, have I ever expressed my revulsion towards cardio?? :mad:

:cool:

Regarding the fruit.

Fruit is sugar. Milk is sugar. When you are dieting you should avoid simple sugars if possible. Go for complex carbohydrates like rice, bread, beans, and veggies. Fruit is water + sugar plus stuff you could get with a vitamin supplement. If you've run in the morning, and then you come back in, and down a piece of apple or orange, you've just killed your fat burning process dead in its tracks now, whereas you could have let it continue for another couple of hours at least and then had some complex carbs, which will be better at fueling your workout tommorrow.

And yogurt, it is completely worthless. It is a marketing diet food. Have some chicken or a protein shake. Especially fat free yogurt, is nothing but sugar as well - unless you get one that is fat - free and with splenda - well, then you have nothing worth of value in there! Eat something that is going to give you nutrition.

Also, obviously her diet is not working right now, so this was my suggestion. Kill the fruit and yogurt.

-niko

Thanks for the support, philly.:rolleyes:

That's okay. I'm a big girl. I'll take the beatdown myself. It is worth it.

Regarding the fruit.

Fruit is sugar. Milk is sugar. When you are dieting you should avoid simple sugars if possible. Go for complex carbohydrates like rice, bread, beans, and veggies. Fruit is water + sugar plus stuff you could get with a vitamin supplement. If you've run in the morning, and then you come back in, and down a piece of apple or orange, you've just killed your fat burning process dead in its tracks now, whereas you could have let it continue for another couple of hours at least and then had some complex carbs, which will be better at fueling your workout tommorrow.

And yogurt, it is completely worthless. It is a marketing diet food. Have some chicken or a protein shake. Especially fat free yogurt, is nothing but sugar as well.


Fruit and yogurt offer so many nutritional benefits that even if it were true that they had some kind of magic power to slow fat loss, I still would not avoid them.

Yogurt: (http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=foodspice&dbid=124)
Not only is yogurt a wonderful quick, easy and nutritious snack that is available year-round, but researchers are finding evidence that milk and yogurt may actually add years to your life as is found in some countries where yogurt is a dietary staple.

Lactobacillus, a pro-biotic (friendly) bacteria found in yogurt offers "remarkable preventive and curative" effects on arthritis.

Helicobater pylori the bacterium responsible for most ulcers, can be shut down by yogurt.

Enjoying full-fat yogurt and other full-fat dairy foods, such as whole milk, kefir, cheese, cream, sour cream and butter, may significantly reduce risk for colorectal cancer.

Lactobacillus casei, a strain of friendly bacteria found in cultured foods like yogurt and kefir, significantly improved the immune response and ability to fight off pneumonia.


Fruit: (http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=faq&dbid=4#disctopics.)
Plant foods have long been known to promote health and wellness. Cultures whose diet primarily features plant-based foods such as fruits, vegetables, whole grains and legumes have been found to have increased longevity and reduced rates of the many cancers and chronic diseases so common in populations consuming the standard American diet.

Researchers traditionally have attributed the health-promoting affects of plant foods to their comprehensive array of vitamins, minerals, and fiber. More recently, however, research studies are uncovering a new story. Plant foods contain thousands of other compounds in addition to the macronutrients (complex carbohydrates, proteins, fats, and fiber), and the micronutrients (vitamins and minerals). These many other compounds are collectively known as phytonutrients (phyto=plant). Simply put, phytonutrients are active compounds in plants that have been shown to provide benefit to humans when consumed.

New research is uncovering that many of these phytonutrients act synergistically; that is, they help each other and provide more benefit when taken with other phytonturients than alone. This is a major reason for eating whole foods over taking an individual supplement of beta-carotene or vitamin C. The whole food can contain not only the beta-carotene or vitamin C, but also other phytonutrients that act synergistically to support even more benefit to your health.

The array of phytochemicals offered by plant-based foods such as fruits, vegetables, whole grains and legumes further supports the fact that these foods can make important contributions to our health. Although they are officially considered "non-essential nutrients," meaning that their intake is not necessary for survival, phytochemicals seem to truly be essential for the sustenance of a good life, one full of health and abundant energy. Hopefully, one day as the accepted nutrition paradigm changes from preventing outright deficiencies to one that emphasizes that foods can help prevent disease and promote longevity, the true importance of these phytonutrients will be recognized.

But, you're talking fat loss. I'm talking optimum health, longevity, freedom from disease. Different goals.

Thank-you for your explanation. I never knew the science behind it.

okay zen... I give up. I guess we'll never agree on anything :rolleyes: You advocate and enjoy cardio, and I despise it.

It's a tool. If you want the thing it does, then you should do it. In your case, it's not really any significant volume of cardio that is indicated, just a little bit to take the edge off those insane workouts you do.

Any form of exercise has an effect. Is it a valuable effect? That is entirely dependent of the goals.

Remember that "cardio" does not have to be on a treadmill. In principle, any exercise can be cardio - for cardio all you care about is heart rate, so whether it is rack pulls or thumb curls, your heart only cares about how big the demand for oxygen is.

I don't actually do much LISS myself - I still think intervals make a lot more sense for me - but that's different than not understanding when it could be helpful to other people or why they might do it. When you look at sports as diverse as boxing and rowing, and you find LISS cardio as part of the program, it's worth figuring out why. It was actually from reading what the rowers have figured out that I finally understood why they even do any LISS at all.

In this particular case, I don't think the LISS will be a big part of the fat control. But it might be important for her to feel energized enough to do her other work. I don't know if that is actually true in her case, but I've known some people like that. Plus keeping the joints going. Ballet is notoriously awful on joints, especially while carrying the extra weight.

For resistance training the endo can benefit from volume and higher bouts of work. I.E., different rep speeds, supersets, rest between sets, negatives, drop sets, you get the picture. This I've found to be more effective for capiilary intrusion (and expansion) for increasing the mitochondrial population and pathways. But to be fair, my experience in this regard, is limited.

To focus in on this detail: Yes, for the vascularization, the high intensity is better.

But it turns out for recruiting mitochondria, LISS is actually really good. I didn't understand this until I made the connection with how much it improves recovery. As you might expect, high intensity stuff trains the body to adapt under high intensity exertion, and there is one set of biochemical conditions that goes along with that. LISS trains the body under low intensity exertion - and that is a different set of biochemical conditions. So it sort of follows by specificity that the body will get better at recovery after exertion when the exercise is closer to no exertion.

Now why is that good for recruiting mitochondria? That one isn't so obvious, at least to me. It makes sense that it isn't good for vascularization because there isn't that much stress on the circulation, and that it wouldn't do much heart hypertrophy, since there isn't much intensity required for those contractions. It's easy to convince yourself that it's not going to be good for much other than burning calories, but they actually have found that the increase in VO2max from LISS is highly correlated with mitochondrial density, so that's what seems to happen.

Fruit is absolutely fine.

Thanks for the support, philly.:rolleyes:

No problem... you're welcome. :D

As you probably know, I endorse (and try to subscribe to) many of the same theories as you do in terms of eating for health as well as for weight management/fat loss (and lately, muscle growth as well).

That said, I have yogurt and a banana every day (with some flax meal). If I'm feeling particularly hungry, I've been known to reach for an apple. And late at night, if I still have room in my nutrition plan, a cup of fat free no sugar added chocolate ice cream. :drool:

Fruit is absolutely fine.

With this one sentence, 1Fast brings brings understanding, clarification and finality to the entire mish-mash of this thread.

My nominee for "Post Of The Year" (POTY)

:tucool:

Regarding the fruit.

Fruit is sugar. Milk is sugar. When you are dieting you should avoid simple sugars if possible. Go for complex carbohydrates like rice, bread, beans, and veggies. Fruit is water + sugar plus stuff you could get with a vitamin supplement. If you've run in the morning, and then you come back in, and down a piece of apple or orange, you've just killed your fat burning process dead in its tracks now, whereas you could have let it continue for another couple of hours at least and then had some complex carbs, which will be better at fueling your workout tommorrow.


Not to get into the yogurt thing (where I disagree as well to a degree), but fruit isn't just water and suger and part of a multivitamin. Depending on your choice of fruit, it is full of antioxidants, fiber, etc. Also, the GI of a lot of fruits is nowhere near what most simple sugar stuff is. Stuff like apples, pears, peaches, strawberries, blueberries, citrus, etc are low GI, low GL.

I posted this (http://www.t-nation.com/findArticle.do?article=06-044b-diet) earlier today about apples, and I believe it applies here, too.

However, 1FastGTX probably summed it up better than this post :)

If the goal for her is to reduce bodyfat, have her eat grapefruit only. Half of one with the first meal, and half with the final meal. Grapefruit has properties, mainly naringin, which helps shed fat and water. It is the only fruit (with occasionally strawberries and kiwi) that I'll consume the final few weeks leading into a bodybuilding show, particularly the final "peak" week. Grapefruit is a secret weapon for many natural champions in getting that hard, dry look, when combined with a moderate to high protein diet. Works great with women too!! Eat the whole fruit!! :tu:

Kiwi, and berry's would be my second choice. Steer away from fruit juices and starchy fruit.

It is no coincidence that I started eating grapefruit twice a day several months ago. :D

Regarding the fruit.

Fruit is sugar. Milk is sugar. When you are dieting you should avoid simple sugars if possible. Go for complex carbohydrates like rice, bread, beans, and veggies. Fruit is water + sugar plus stuff you could get with a vitamin supplement. If you've run in the morning, and then you come back in, and down a piece of apple or orange, you've just killed your fat burning process dead in its tracks now, whereas you could have let it continue for another couple of hours at least and then had some complex carbs, which will be better at fueling your workout tommorrow.

And yogurt, it is completely worthless. It is a marketing diet food. Have some chicken or a protein shake. Especially fat free yogurt, is nothing but sugar as well - unless you get one that is fat - free and with splenda - well, then you have nothing worth of value in there! Eat something that is going to give you nutrition.

Also, obviously her diet is not working right now, so this was my suggestion. Kill the fruit and yogurt.

-niko

nevermind

:eek: