I notice a lot of folks 'round here use spreadsheets and calorie counters and stuff to plan their diet out a day or even week in advance. While I'm glad this works and I admire the discipline, I don't think I can do that. "Real life," so to speak, is a factor that comes into play.

For one thing, I'm temporarily living with my parents, which makes food preparation a touchy thing, though I manage to get the nutrition I feel is right (Jewish mothers have a weird, messed up thing about food). I was considering waiting until I move out to adapt this eating plan, but was afraid it would be just another excuse (which, of course, it would be).

Lunch with colleagues, going out with friends/dates, eating out, sleeping late on weekends (a luxury I refuse to sacrifice, especially since I get up so damn early to do cardio in the morning, anyway) are issues to deal with and can't be avoided or, worse, treat as "exceptions."

So I'm not counting calories or measuring myself. I do take food to work, which covers 4 or 5 meals every weekday and which I can plan the day before, so it's not totally chaotic, but beyond that, I'm just trying to make wise choices every moment.

Anyone else not going with the counting/measuring stuff? Have you had success?

Anyone else not going with the counting/measuring stuff? Have you had success?

Ugh. I'm from the opposite side. I quantify everything on a set interval basis and apply the most accurate formulas to the data I can find.

When people are reluctant to count these things, I usually advise that they do it for a little while anyhow, so that they can 'wing it' with a little more accuracy.

There is a certain degree of intellectual honesty required to lose weight, moreso when you're going on estimates.

You're also not learning about what works for you - cause and effect - to lose weight. Something that could help you for the rest of your life.

So, no, I haven't done what you're asking about, but I thought my two cents were appropriate anyhow.

I'm in the middle- I put what I eat into fitday.com, but if I don't know the exact measure of something, I'll usually just estimate. I may not be 100% accurate, but I'm usually pretty close. It takes maybe 10 minutes at most a day, and I get a good general idea of my intake.

i spent a few days maybe a week where i counted everything and made all my meals my self. doing this is got a good feel for how much im getting each time i eat, and if ate one meal where i went under or over i try to compensate for it later.

im in a very similar situation where eating out with friends and stuff causes a problem, i ussually just try to eat what ever has the most protein and try to not let 'eating out' ruin my fun.

and my mum/family are the same, some times i just have to eat what ever they make, and that too ussually aint good for me. if its maxed out in butter and fats just pass and SAY your on a diet, even though that'l open you up to heat - thy kinda have to respect/understand.

ive been seeing good results but i think i might go back to a few days to strict calorie and percentage counting just to make sure i havent gone off - ive seen good results, i go all by apperance and feel rather then weight and stats.

Anyone else not going with the counting/measuring stuff? Have you had success?

How can they tell if they haven't been keeping track? ;)

Just kidding. I guess what it comes down to is levels of dedication. Some people can't or won't do certain things in their efforts to lose weight or get in better shape. That's fine. They're going to have a much fuzzier idea of how they're doing. If I wasn't keeping track of my intakes, taking regular photos, and weighing myself every morning, I'd have no idea where I was. "Real life" does get in the way for all of us. When you have stirfry cooked for you by your husband you can't very well sit down to dinner, separate out each veggie, put them into measuring cups, and write down exactly how much you ate of what. But even guesstimating will give you a much clearer picture of what you're eating than not keeping track at all. Not to mention that it's difficult to know if you're getting enough protein, too many carbs, too many or too few calories if you just wing it.

If I wasn't taking photos, I would have to rely on me ever-larger clothes and the compliments of others to realize I'm losing weight. I don't look all that different to myself in the mirror. A lot of people would probably say the same unless they've lost a LOT of weight. But by keeping photographic track I can see how I'm doing, which areas I'm losing in, and what areas I need to work on in my weight training.

And if I wasn't weighing myself daily (some people suggest weekly; what is important is watching the trend over time) I wouldn't have a clear picture of how what I eat and how much of it I eat directly affects what I weigh. Not to mention that all of the above- the intake log, the photos, and the scale- are consistent motivators. It's much easier to keep it up when I can see how much progress I've made.

Either way, good luck!

I "wing it" all the way and it's worked for me so far. I just use the Body For Life "open palm/closed fist" method and I usually read labels, but I don't use spreadsheets or anything, too complicated for me :)

Then again, I've done this once before, so I have a pretty good idea of what works and what doesn't. If this is your first time, I would recommend documenting everything you can. It's more fun to look back on it that way.

I'm not interested in recording what I eat using spreadsheets. I have nothing against those who do it, but to me it's not sustainable. The same goes for writing down each set or rep. I map out workout schemes in general (splits) but I like some spontenaity in my workouts and eating.

To me, success comes down to controlling your impulses. Before I put anything into my mouth, I ask myself "Do I really want to eat this?"-that helps eliminate eating empty carbs, sweets, sodas, and alchohol.

To prevent going into starvation mode, I eat the PowerBar High-Protein version during gaps which has 25g of protein.

Any habit that appears to be unsustainable is out in my book. Transformations are a result of a change in mindset and motivation, not by following specific routines to a tee for a certain period of weeks.

Andi,

A big AMEN!!!!! I hardly ever post anything, but I'm always tuned in to what everyone is doing, but I had to post this time. I've always wondered how on earth all of these people can manage to keep track of everything. I get up at 4:30 to cadio and get ready so that I can drive 30 miles and be @ work by 7:00. Getting off at 5:30 puts me home at 6:15 or so, and since I'm a mother of two there is always ball practice, homework, not to mention supper and then house work to catch up on. So at 10:30 I'm too exhausted to worry about anything else!!!! So now that I posted a novel, yea, I definetly do wing it!!!!!!!! I'd put a smiley on here, but I'm still learning this site, and I can't find them on this quick reply box!!! ha! ha!

So I'm not counting calories or measuring myself.

I'm not counting calories or measuring the amount of food I take in, but I do measure myself. I eat what I feel is right, and what I feel I need. So far, since january 4th, I've lost 30 lbs and 10 inches of my waist.


I don't look all that different to myself in the mirror. A lot of people would probably say the same unless they've lost a LOT of weight.

Guess I'm not like a lot of people. On good days, when I feel like a million bucks, I can't stop admiring myself in the mirror, wondering where the rest of me went... I find that strange too actually, since I've read about people losing beyond 80 lbs without noticing the difference. I LOVE the way I look having lost 30, which I don't see as all that much, and I can't stop dreaming of what I'll look like when I lose another 20-25 lbs. I may even develop a confidence...

At least for me, if I don't track it, I stray. It depends on the person.

I tried tracking my food multiple times in the past, using the same tools I have now (PocketDiet on a PocketPC handheld). I would always stick to it for a week or two, but then it would just become too much of a hassle to enter everything in after I ate it. One day I would have something my wife made for dinner (say a casserole of some sort), where I didn't know exactly how to track it. So, I'd skip entering that meal. Then, maybe a day or so later I would forget to enter a snack. After a few days of this, the "what's the point" attitude would lead me to drop the tracking altogether.

At the same time, "just five jellybeans" after I get home from work (dutifully entered into the food tracker) would progress to "Oops, forgot to enter those yesterday, today maybe I'll have ten, can't forget to input those now, and correct yesterday", and finally to a handful every time I passed the pantry and "Why bother logging these?"

The thing I learned here that has FINALLY gotten me over the hump is to PLAN the food BEFORE eating it. I lay out my food plan either the night before or first thing in the morning, and THAT'S what I eat.

If I need to make a change, it has to be in the log BEFORE I eat it.

Plus, I now analyze every recipe and enter it as a custom food before the meal, so I can't use the lack of information as a crutch to skip it.

The only exception I allow is if I go out to eat, or if I'm a guest at someone's house. I'm not going to ask for the recipe for everything someone serves me, I'll just try to approximate and control my portions. Of course, I don't eat out nearly as much right now.

Believe me, I get lots of comments about being a "Nutrition Nazi", "Why spend so much time, just eat right", etc.

For me, it's just not possible. I tried that for years, and have finally found a way to succeed. Hopefully, once I get the right type of eating ingrained enough, I'll be able to give up some of the tracking, since even I don't want to have to do it forever.

I keep track of everything. Food/ weights/ cardio/ mood/ stats/...everything... it helps me stay motivated. And coincidentally, the people who make the most progress are the same people who systematically and methodically track everything. Why not take those odds and arm yourself with every tool possible that can help you hit your goal?

I sympathize with you Take5 about the living situation. I remember when I went through my first official "cut" back when I lived with my parents...it's almost impossible when mom cooks up fatty dinner every night!

So, if you think you can "wing" it more power to you! I couldn't do it!

Oh- and (not to sound negative) I can't stand excuses such as..."real life gets in the way" or "I'm too busy..." Are you assuming that everyone else on this board is not busy? or dosen't lead a "real" life?

/end rant...

And coincidentally, the people who make the most progress are the same people who systematically and methodically track everything.
Where is the proof of this statement?

I know that there's a lot of people who succeeded by tracking their every move, but I also know that there are many who failed, just because they got sick of it all when trying to do everything right. Also, there has been people making great progress by simply learning what to eat and what not to, so I think a general statement like that is kinda missplaced. I believe you're right, if we were to talk about top athletes, but for the average Joe this doesn't have to be the case.

I can't stand excuses such as..."real life gets in the way" or "I'm too busy..."
I do agree 100% that there are no excuses. If you're not happy with your appearance, you CAN change it. It's all about a state of mind. No matter where you go or when, you can always make adjustments to fit a healthier lifestyle.

I'm not seeing my goal as to lose a certain amount of weight by a certain date. My goal is to continue to become more healthy as each day goes on.

I don't count calories, because I wouldn't want to count calories for the rest of my life. I'm not on a diet, this is my life plan of maintaining a healthy body.

If I counted calories, I'd end up feeling deprived that I couldn't have something, or I'd beat myself up over the times that I'm hungry and not allowed to eat. I'd rather eat too much and gain 1/10 of a pound than feel miserable that I don't have the willpower to say no to chocolate.

As Nico says, each piece of food that goes into my mouth gets the "Do you really want to eat that?" test. It's simpler than "I'm trying to lose weight", it's "I'm trying to do the best that I can for my body."

[Oh- and (not to sound negative) I can't stand excuses such as..."real life gets in the way" or "I'm too busy..." Are you assuming that everyone else on this board is not busy? or dosen't lead a "real" life?

I didn't think I was giving excuses or assuming anything. I was just telling Andi that I also wing it. (Chill out!!!!) :) :)

Hey there, winging-it buddy :')

I'm sort of in the same boat as you. I also live with the folks, but my mother is Irish. She thinks that I'm forsaking my heritage because I don't eat potatos, butter and bacon any longer. My younger brother constantly derides my meals as "dirty hippie-food" and my Father enjoys reminding me of my food choices by saying things like "Oh, that's right, you don't eat <insert food here> anymore".

Despite the unconditional support of my loving family, I have managed to lose about 40 pounds over the last 6 months. I fell off the wagon (and into the ditch) over Christmas and I ocasionally give in to the myriad of tempting foods that I'm surrounded by, but I have managed to make progress nevertheless.

The key for me has been to have a general idea of how many calories I'm taking in without resorting to daily calorie counting. I have accomplished this by eating a fairly narrow range of foods accompanied by copious amounts of fruit and vegetables. I also eat as little refined/processed food as possible and drink plenty of water.

So, I guess my point is that it's possible to have success at losing weight/eating healthy even when presented with less than ideal circumstances. Just try your best and know that you're building up your willpower for when you move out and have more control over your diet.

I'm not seeing my goal as to lose a certain amount of weight by a certain date. My goal is to continue to become more healthy as each day goes on.
My goal is not this either, even though I'm one of the everything-trackers, including my weight. But an increase or decrease in my weight, while tracked, does not cause either a "WooHoo!" or a "Dagnabbit" response in and of itself. Right now I am at a weight (177lb) that I have not seen since some time in high school (started at 106lb, graduated at 216). However, I'm not in the best shape ever since then, which is my goal.


I don't count calories, because I wouldn't want to count calories for the rest of my life. I'm not on a diet, this is my life plan of maintaining a healthy body.
I count calories to try and determine a correlation with my appearance and fitness. Over time, I hope to naturally acquire the ability to control the calories in / calories out appropriately without counting.


If I counted calories, I'd end up feeling deprived that I couldn't have something, or I'd beat myself up over the times that I'm hungry and not allowed to eat. I'd rather eat too much and gain 1/10 of a pound than feel miserable that I don't have the willpower to say no to chocolate.
I understand. I simply accept that right now I can't do it without the added step of tracking.


As Nico says, each piece of food that goes into my mouth gets the "Do you really want to eat that?" test. It's simpler than "I'm trying to lose weight", it's "I'm trying to do the best that I can for my body."
For me, unfortunately, only using the "Do you really want to eat that" test leads to a "Yes" answer too often for me to accomplish my goals. I admire those who have already made that work. I'll get there. :nod:

Anyone else not going with the counting/measuring stuff? Have you had success?

I just can't do it. I keep track of my workouts, but I can't do the same with food. I eat small healthy portions with a lot less fat and carbohydrates than I used to eat. This place has really helped me to understand the science behind food and I'm not going to forget that, but I can't beat myself up for getting things slightly wrong on occasion. I figure that I'm going to have to keep this up for life, so I'll learn the lessons and remember them rather than keep a permanent food diary. Like you say, there's too much else to do, and as I travel at home and abroad regularly I have to make sure I have fruit, nuts, seeds available instead of fatty snacks.

Andi, A big AMEN!!!!! I've always wondered how on earth all of these people can manage to keep track of everything.

I'm confused. :confused: My entire post was in favor of keeping track.

If you want to get down to 7-8% BF I think that you will need to keep everything under control...It will be very difficult to wing it if your goal is that ambitious. It might make a huge difference if you often eat a bit to much or a bit to little in that case. Most of the time everything that you eat should be part of the plan.

But I think that you could wing it if you only want to maintain what you have. Even if you have very low BF. At least if you eat healthy food and can estimate fairly well how manny calories you eat.

Regards!

I'm confused. :confused: My entire post was in favor of keeping track.


I was saying amen to the fact that you weren't the only one who wings it. I was beginning to think I was the only one who didn't keep track. I'm just glad to know I'm not. Keep up the great work!!!! :tu:

Whoops, my bad. I hope my post didn't offend anyone!

Knubb- Good point, there really isn't any research or proof to back up my claim. The only information I ever post is from my own personal experience. I used to be one of those people you speak of...logging my food for a while, getting sick of it, quitting and then, for me at least, my progress would halt. Now, I've found that I've made much greater progress logging everything.

So I guess this argument is dependant on ones goals. If you want to make a health lifestyle change and slim down a bit, you probably don't need to keep a log. If you want to be on the cover of Mens Fitness anytime soon...you better start logging!

Melissa Dennis- Noted. My apologies if I offended you. I just want it to be known that there's no excuses to achieving your fitness goals!

I'm still in planning and research mode but I am wingin' it until I have a good list of foods for each meal and a gameplan.

I can't see eating the same thing every day for the rest of my life so the ability to learn to eat smart without calculators and protractors and stuff.

I imagine there will be a period of logging as part of the educational process... but I've got to learn some more before I start.

A lot of interesting and diverse responses.

Oh- and (not to sound negative) I can't stand excuses such as..."real life gets in the way" or "I'm too busy..." Are you assuming that everyone else on this board is not busy? or dosen't lead a "real" life?


FWIW, I never said I was "too busy." I make time to hit the gym every single day for cardio and a second time in the evening for weight lifting, despite my hectic work schedule and annoying commute (which my soon become extremely difficult).

By "real life" getting in the way, I meant of how to count the calories, not of being dedicated to fitness. If someone else prepares your meal, you don't know what kind of oil they used, how much of each ingredient is in it, etc. Yeah, I could estimate, and I'll give that shot for a few days.

I think my goal as of now is similar to guava's: not a particular weight of bf% per say as much as a fit lifestyle and, for me, serious weight loss.

I'm going to check out fitday.com

I notice a lot of folks 'round here use spreadsheets and calorie counters and stuff to plan their diet out a day or even week in advance. While I'm glad this works and I admire the discipline, I don't think I can do that. "Real life," so to speak, is a factor that comes into play.

For one thing, I'm temporarily living with my parents, which makes food preparation a touchy thing, though I manage to get the nutrition I feel is right (Jewish mothers have a weird, messed up thing about food). I was considering waiting until I move out to adapt this eating plan, but was afraid it would be just another excuse (which, of course, it would be).

Lunch with colleagues, going out with friends/dates, eating out, sleeping late on weekends (a luxury I refuse to sacrifice, especially since I get up so damn early to do cardio in the morning, anyway) are issues to deal with and can't be avoided or, worse, treat as "exceptions."

So I'm not counting calories or measuring myself. I do take food to work, which covers 4 or 5 meals every weekday and which I can plan the day before, so it's not totally chaotic, but beyond that, I'm just trying to make wise choices every moment.

Anyone else not going with the counting/measuring stuff? Have you had success?


I am in the EXACT boat as you, except for the jewish mother part.

I have "winged" it. The only thing that seems to have kept consistant was going to the gym 4 times a week. I started going to the Gym and running on the eliptical machines at the end of August, I weighed myself and i was 264 pounds. I took the Tanita body comp test at my gym on Sept 25th/03.

my results are as follows:

weight: 252.8lbs
BMI: 34.3
fat%: 29.1%

fatmass: 73.6lbs
FFM(lean tissue): 179.2lbs
TBW(water): 131.2lbs

Shoulders: 50.5
arm: 15
chest: 43
waist: 47
thigh: 29.5
calf: 17

Around mid november everyone in the office got really sick and that kept me away from the gym. Work then got busy (excuse) and i never went until mid feb when i started going back. During this time i felt i fell off the boat. I was eating pizza a couple of times a week and other crap. But for the most part i was watching what i was eating, just by own knowledge and talk amongst friends about health and whatnot. I felt i was eating smaller meals, and more healthier during this offtime, but still i didnt feel that I was doing a very good job.

I did a re-measurement just last week and this is what I am at now:

Mar 16/04

weight: 231.6lbs
BMI: 31.4
fat%: 24.7

fatmass: 57lbs
FFM(lean tissue): 174.2lbs
TBW(water): 127.6lbs

Shoulders: 47.5
arm: 13.5
chest: 43.5
waist: 38.5
obliques: 42.5
hips: 45.5
thigh: 26.5
calf: 16.25

With all that being said, I think I could do a lot better, and I am about to start being a lot more focused and start recording things a bit more, so I have a better idea of what really is going on in my food intake, which i find is the hardest part about losing the weight.

FYI, I am 22 yrs old.


Geoff

You'll have as much success as you put into it. A few things I noticed:

While I'm glad this works and I admire the discipline, I don't think I can do that. "Real life," so to speak, is a factor that comes into play.

If you don't think you can, you can't. It all starts in the mind. Anyone can do it, it's just a question of whether it is a priority and you allow yourself. Right now, you're choosing not to. That's fine - we are all able to make our own choices. I have times when I choose not to as well, but then I get back under control and realize how living healthy feels so much better than limiting myself ever could.

"Real life" is what we all live. Those who track calories - are you saying we don't live real life? I have had clients who worked 60 hour weeks, went to night school, raised children, suffered from injuries, and still managed to find time to live healthy - it's what gave them the energy and helped them create time to enjoy the other moments in life.

Lunch with colleagues, going out with friends/dates, eating out, sleeping late on weekends (a luxury I refuse to sacrifice, especially since I get up so damn early to do cardio in the morning, anyway) are issues to deal with and can't be avoided or, worse, treat as "exceptions."

I had lunch with a colleague today - ordered chicken and a mixed greens salad with oil and vinegar on the side. No problem. Friends and dates? I bet your dates will admire someone striving to live healthy. Sleeping late on weekends? Recovery is great - what's that have to do with recording calories? When you refuse something, you are simply deciding it is more important - which again, is fine. Sure, these are issues to deal with. You are right, however, they are not excuses. If you are trying to say you choose healthy foods but just don't know the exact calorie count, that is great - I do that all the time. If you are somehow trying to justify overeating, grabbing beer and ordering the chicken wings ... then just admit you want to eat those things and that your situation is no different than anyone else's - you have a choice and choose those foods instead.

So I'm not counting calories or measuring myself. I do take food to work, which covers 4 or 5 meals every weekday and which I can plan the day before, so it's not totally chaotic, but beyond that, I'm just trying to make wise choices every moment.

Anyone else not going with the counting/measuring stuff? Have you had success?

I have not had much success with this - I tend to put on fat easily when I am not strictly managing my calories. However, to me, counting calories gives me MORE freedom, because then I can enjoy the occassional dark chocolate, slice of pizza, etc -i.e. a few free meals here and there - because I track them and know how they impact the bottom line.

My wife, on the other hand, has NEVER counted a calorie or weighed/measured a food in her life - yet she has lost over 40 pounds and maintains I would guess right around 17% body fat.

So it works different ways for different people. It sounds like you are focused on eating right, and you are compromising to work what fit best with your situation. To that, I raise my occassional glass of red wine and say, "TO YOUR SUCCESS!"

Jeremy

I'm a little of both. I record body measurements, weight, and body fat% every Saturday. I have the results in a spreadsheet with calculations showing how much fat I need to lost to get to 15%, 12%, and 10% bf. I find that it really helps the motivation to see some kind of progress each week. The weight may stay about the same, and occasionaly even go up but there's always a stat somewhere that improves.

As far as the diet goes, I rarely cheat and I eat a very clean diet. I try to eat at least 4 times per day but I don't count anything. As long as I keep making progress, I'm not going to bother counting. When I reach the inevitable plateau, I'll reconsider.

Hey there, winging-it buddy :')


The KEY for me has been to have a general idea of how many calories I'm taking in without resorting to daily calorie counting. I have accomplished this by eating a fairly narrow range of foods accompanied by copious amounts of fruit and vegetables. I also eat as little refined/processed food as possible and drink plenty of water.



Agree with the above statement but to have a general idea how many calories you eat you need to be aware of how many calories are in the food you eat. I also go light on the fruit, mornings only 1/2 apple with my oatmeal.

For me I tracked protein,carbs,fat fat has 9 calories and the other two have 4 calories per gram for everything I ate for about 2 weeks, Then I had an idea how many total calories I was eating. I don't do that any more and I am still losing about 3 lbs per week down 30 lbs in 58 days.

Just keep a list of the major food items you eat each day then take a few minutes before you go to bed to go over the list and find out how much protein,fat and carbs and total calories those foods have. The next time you pull in to a burger king you will already know the whopper has a full days calories in one bite and you will order the chicken on a bun and throw away the bun. Down will go the pounds.

At other times when pasta is the only thing on the table and mom made it you just don't eat a big portion and later grab a protein bar out of your stash to keep you feeling full. Skip the garlic bread and have some more salad.

Restraunts are fine, order the steak, chicken or fish, green veggies and salad, forget the bread.

I'm not able to plan in advance either, but I do record what I eat during the day. That provides me with a great learning experience on what intake will give me my target of 2400 - 2500 kcal. If I go avove that, I know what to avoid the next time, and if I'm below when I summarize the day, I just have some whey protein to reach the target level.

I've been recording for five weeks, and will continue for at least a few more weeks more. In two weeks, I expect to switch into maintenance, and then I will have to learn how much I can eat then (3000 kcal)

If you are somehow trying to justify overeating, grabbing beer and ordering the chicken wings ...

I wouldn't dream of coming into a forum full of people dedicated to fitness and do that.

And no, I didn't say people who count calories don't live "real life" because I wasn't referring to a time issue. I was talking about circumstances, where the exact nature of the food that is available isn't under my control sometimes. But I still can and do make choices under those circumstances that are healthier than others. Like when going out, for example, I have a set of rules:

- Nothing fried
- No cream or white sauces
- Only drinking water or, in a fancy place, wine with my meal
- No potatoes, especially french fries
- No dessert unless it's really, really good and a special occassion, in which case I'll have a taste
- Preference towards fish as entree
and so forth

I call this winging it because I don't know what I'm eating before I go (or if I go). But I consider things like if I already ate a certain amount of protein earlier, getting a vegetarian dish, etc.

As an aside anecdote regarding the idea that a date would appreciate someone who looks after himself, I had a date get turned off because I ordered a vegetarian dish. "You're not, like, one of those vegetarian guys, are you?" Man, sometimes the beautiful ones can be so stupid.

But I totally see where you're coming from Jeremy and do agree with most of the post. You get out what you're putting into. I guess I'm still figuring out how exactly to work that. I've failed diets before and part of the reason was the sense of inevitability of being overweight and the unreasonable, inflexible nature of what I was doing. I'm determined to not have that happen again.

Using fitday.com and some very rough estimations, I ate 2100 calories yesterday. I'm about 220 lbs (but haven't weighed myself in a while). I'll do this for a week to come up with an average approximate calorie count and go from there. Since I have to be measured for a tux, I'll have a waist measurement as well.

My experience:

When I first started my program I dropped 9 lbs. the first month just "winging it" (add exercise and subtract booze and Haagen Daz...you don't need a spreadsheet to figure out that something positive will happen).

Then I hit a plateau that lasted 5 weeks.

So I started using fitday, which really opened my eyes as what was going into my body in terms of calories and protein/carb/fat ratios. It takes me about 5 minutes a day, and now I'm back on track with gradual (= sustainable) weight loss. I'm not very careful as to exact quantities and I just do a rough estimate when I eat out. (BTW, I'm no expert but I suspect the "calories burned today" calculations on fitday are way off...anyone with thoughts on that?)

I can maintain this "5-minutes per day" level of exactitude, and I'm getting results from the added control over my diet. I agree with a previous post that long-term sustainability is the key - if I tried to do more I'd eventually just blow it off.

Whoops, my bad. I hope my post didn't offend anyone!

Knubb- Good point, there really isn't any research or proof to back up my claim. The only information I ever post is from my own personal experience. I used to be one of those people you speak of...logging my food for a while, getting sick of it, quitting and then, for me at least, my progress would halt. Now, I've found that I've made much greater progress logging everything.

So I guess this argument is dependant on ones goals. If you want to make a health lifestyle change and slim down a bit, you probably don't need to keep a log. If you want to be on the cover of Mens Fitness anytime soon...you better start logging!
I don't think you insulted anyone. You're entitled to your opinions, and as far as excuses goes, I agree with you (as I stated in my previous post).

The reason why I reacted to the other statement is that I hear a lot of so called truths where people state something, and then just say "oh, I read it in this newspaper and therefore it is true". That kind of argument isn't really longlasting if you ask me.

^Good call. There are way to many false "truths" out there!

I only eat 3 different types of meals but I eat 5-6 times per day. I measured out each meal to be 35-40 grams of protien, 10 or less grams of carbs, very low sugar, and between 300-350 calories per meal. I only had to calculate my meals once and now I just eat them 5-6 times per day and I always know i'm staying around 500 below maintenance and getting enough protien to sustain muscle mass.

Like I said, just calculate your different types of meals and tweak them so that 6 of them come out to be what you need for weight loss for your specific body.

I have 5 meals on cardio days 1700 calories+flax seed oil 110 calories=around 1800.

Weight training days is around 2000 calories cause of the extra meal from the post workout shake.

To each their own. However I "guessed" for about the last year!

I was honestly trying to eat right, and not consuming any junk food. I still hardly made progress, on either muscle gain or fat loss. The last month alone of consistent record keeping has brought the best progress.

You may have more luck "winging it" but I suspect your results would be better.

BTW using a spreadsheet is not complicated. If you have made it to an internet forum to chat, I think learning a spreadsheet would be an easy task.. :)

I wing it when it comes to diet. I do BFL. 1 good carb, 1 good protein, 6 times a day. I don't write down any foods, and I don't measure them. (Unless using the scoop in the bag of protein powder counts.) I just have palm sized portions.

I have no problem eating out with family. Like others have said, I just find the healthiest thing I can on the menu (good cut of meat, vegetables, and a water) and go with that.

Seems to work okay for me.

I do write down my sets and reps for weight lifting though. That's extremely useful for me. I never allow myself to do less than I did the time before.

I"m a guidlines kinda guy....

1. Small meals 6-7 times a day...
2. Never skip breakfast
3. Drink at least a gallon of water
4. No caloric beverages
5. Plenty of sleep
6. Whole grains
7. Vegetables whenever possible
8. No carbs after 5pm

Started at 161lb and down to 152..after 8 weeks......but I'm of slender build so I'm not as concerned about weight loss as I am building LBM and improving my composition. I'm sure when the time is right...I'll start getting more accurate if and when I reach a pleateu. But for right now, I'm still trying to improve my VO2 max and lifting a little more weight each week.

Good luck everybody...

I think I'm clinically insane because of the way I track my food. I measure a lot of things to within *grams* and I use fitday almost religiously. My main reason for doing so is that I'm bulking and I want to be sure to get enough calories, in good proportions, without getting too many. Once I get to my goal (around 170 at 8% bf) I'll stop the measuring and then just wing it.