Hi all. I really need some advice. Im torn. I dont know if I should clean bulk and eat alot of calories or create a calorie deficit to lose my belly flab. Im 5'7", 29 yrs old, and 160 lbs. I do not wanna be skinnier but I do wanna lose my gut. I would love to be muscular and weigh more. Im confused and dont know what to do with my diet. I work out 4 times a week - weight training and cardio. I have attached my photos. Please view them and advise me. If i create a calorie deficit then I will lose my gut but then I will look too skinny. If i try to clean bulk, will I get more of a gut? I would ideally like to be 175 or more. Should I shave down first then try to build up afterwards? Or since i have gained 10 lbs this winter from unhealthy eating and laziness, should I capitalize on the extra weight and go for bulking? Im confused

Thank you for your help

definitely cut. you will not turn the existing fat into muscle, so what's already there is going to stay there until you decide to get rid of it.

sounds like your bigger challenge is nutrition and not exercise, and learning the correct way to fuel your body will pay far more benefits than anything at this point. are you doing cardio four days a week AND weight training four days a week? IMO, you could stand to lose twenty pounds and you still wouldn't look too "skinny."

plus, if you decide to "bulk" and don't follow through with the weight training, you'll just be eating a lot of unused calories. if you decide to cut, the worst case if you don't follow through with the training is that you'll still lose weight.

Why not eat at or slightly below a maintainence level and hit the weights hard? You'll need to reduce your bodyfat % if you want to look muscular but since cutting's not a high priority for you you're in a good position to try and increase your lean mass without bulking specifically.

I would definetly advise against a bulk.

M@

Why not eat at or slightly below a maintainence level and hit the weights hard? You'll need to reduce your bodyfat % if you want to look muscular but since cutting's not a high priority for you you're in a good position to try and increase your lean mass without bulking specifically.

I would definetly advise against a bulk.

M@


I agree with M@ and Phillydude... eat at maintanance or cut... you shouldn't bulk at this point... hit those weights HARD and make sure your diet is clean... can you post what you eat in a typical day... the times and amounts would be helpful.. then we can see if we can help you tweak it :tu:

definitely cut. you will not turn the existing fat into muscle, so what's already there is going to stay there until you decide to get rid of it.

sounds like your bigger challenge is nutrition and not exercise, and learning the correct way to fuel your body will pay far more benefits than anything at this point. are you doing cardio four days a week AND weight training four days a week? IMO, you could stand to lose twenty pounds and you still wouldn't look too "skinny."

plus, if you decide to "bulk" and don't follow through with the weight training, you'll just be eating a lot of unused calories. if you decide to cut, the worst case if you don't follow through with the training is that you'll still lose weight.

Thanks for the advice. I know I cant turn fat into muscle. I work out 3 days of HIIT and do 20 mins cardio afterwards, and on the 4th day I do all cardio. I hit the weights hard but I assume its genetics because I no one in my family is muscular. I wanna build muscle. So thats why I was asking if I should eat heavy or light. Not working out is not an option. I will work out hard everyday no matter what. I guess what im striving for is - losing fat while building lean muscle and what kind of diet would help me acheive that goald.

Why not eat at or slightly below a maintainence level and hit the weights hard? You'll need to reduce your bodyfat % if you want to look muscular but since cutting's not a high priority for you you're in a good position to try and increase your lean mass without bulking specifically.

I would definetly advise against a bulk.

M@

Thank you. Makes sense

No bulking yet. In the future? Yes, you need it. Now? Need to cut. Sorry about that. Cutting is no fun, but you'll enjoy the results, I'm sure.

I see two good options, both were mentioned. The first is easier. Cut, lose that fat! If you decide to do this, be sure to read up on your nutrition. Marcus's article, "My guide to nutrition for weight loss" is at the top of this forum. It is an excellent place to start. Until you have a good diet program in place, I would not waste time with exercise. Of course, once you've got your diet up and running, hit the weights hard.

Second, eat just below maintenance and hit the weights hard. This would be an effort to bulk and cut at the same time. Possible, but quite difficult. It can be discouraging, too, because even if you succeed, you won't see fast progress either direction. This is probably a better choice if you are very disciplined and very motivated, but if you are like the rest of us, I would suggest a regular cut.

If you cut carefully, you can go shirtless for the summertime, I think. Then, bulk hard in fall/early winter, cut again next spring, and you'll be looking great!

I agree with M@ and Phillydude... eat at maintanance or cut... you shouldn't bulk at this point... hit those weights HARD and make sure your diet is clean... can you post what you eat in a typical day... the times and amounts would be helpful.. then we can see if we can help you tweak it :tu:

My daily meals:

Morning: 3 egg whites and 1 egg, 2 whole wheat toast, tea. Sometimes i'll add oats to it if im still hungry.

Lunch - Tuna in a whole wheat pita, rice and chicken or whatever is leftover from dinner.

After workout - Muscle Milk - 1 and half scoops and Glutamine.

Dinner: Rice and grilled chicken, salmon, or steak. Im learning how to cook now so i expand on dishes now. Sometimes ill just make rice and red kidney beans.

Late night snack: fruit or bowl of cereal - Honey Nut Clusters in Soy Milk. I dont eat or drink dairy.

Im trying to control my portions now. Diet bad?

Im trying to control my portions now. Diet bad?

Not bad, but could be better. If you've made recent changes, that's great. Hold there for a little, I would suggest. In the mean time, read marcus's post on nutrition for weight loss. This will help tremendously even if you want to eat at maintenance.

I have found that small, gradual changes are usually more likely to become permenant than dramatic, instant changes. You're on the right track. Keep up the good work.

I assume its genetics because I no one in my family is muscular.

Anybody in your family devoted to a lifestyle of healthy eating and calorie monitoring combined with a solid resistance and cardio exercise program?

You can get ripped. You can get big. Hell, you can get HUGE. All the information you need to do those things is here. If anything, from your photos it looks like genetics have given you the blessings of a well proportioned skeletal structure that would look phenomenal if you built up some beefy lean mass on it and cut your fat % down.

Your diet doesn't look bad at all. Do you have a FitDay.com (http://www.fitday.com/)account? Do you know what your BMR is (http://www.bmi-calculator.net/bmr-calculator/)? Do you have an idea of your maintainence level (http://forums.johnstonefitness.com/showthread.php?t=1222)?

Is there someone out there you want to build your physique to look like? You can get from where you're at to where you want to be, wherever that is, and the folks here will help.

M@

My daily meals:

Morning: 3 egg whites and 1 egg, 2 whole wheat toast, tea. Sometimes i'll add oats to it if im still hungry.

Lunch - Tuna in a whole wheat pita, rice and chicken or whatever is leftover from dinner.

After workout - Muscle Milk - 1 and half scoops and Glutamine.

Dinner: Rice and grilled chicken, salmon, or steak. Im learning how to cook now so i expand on dishes now. Sometimes ill just make rice and red kidney beans.

Late night snack: fruit or bowl of cereal - Honey Nut Clusters in Soy Milk. I dont eat or drink dairy.

Im trying to control my portions now. Diet bad?

where are the veggies? what about good fats? have you read Marcus's sticky on diets? how about Gravityhomers fat loss guide.. I'd suggest reading those, figure out your maintanance calories and throw all your food for a full day (or two) into fitday.com (like M@ suggested) and see how many calories it comes out too.. my guess is that you might be eating too little.. you don't mention portion sizes for a lot of what you put down... rice could be 1/2 cup cooked or a full cup cooked... chicken could be 2 oz or 10 oz... so I can't really tell if your eating enough or too much right now... so far your food choices look pretty good though... with the exception of no veggies and no good fats (ie: flaxseed oil, olive oil, peanuts, natural peanut butter, etc.)

keep us posted ;)

Definitely agree with Chameleon on veggies and fats, they're very important. Also that you should cut first, or possibly maintain weight but aim for losing fat and gaining muscle at same time, but probably cut - you'll be able to see results sooner.

Can you post your weights routine on here as well?

For the next few months your training should be progressive with the basics - squats, deadlifts, dips, military press, pullups, barbell rows, and heavy incline benches.

Here's a diet you can do which is easy and will guarantee results if you are training with the movements above:

Meal #1: 4 egg whites, 1 whole egg, 1/2 cup oatmeal, 3 oz chicken breast

Meal #2: 6 oz eye of round steak, 1/2 cup brown rice, 2 cups broccoli

Meal #3: 6 oz chicken or turkey, 6 oz sweet potato, 1 cup green beans or broccoli,

Meal #4: 2 scoops blended protein powder, 2 tbls heavy cream, mixed in water or 7 oz chicken + 1 oz walnuts or Deluxe Nuts

Meal #5: 6 oz chicken or codfish or any white meat fish, 4 cups salad ( tomatoes, romaine, onions, mushrooms, peppers) 2 tbls. extra virgin olive oil with apple cider or balsamic vinegar

Meal #6: 8 egg whites, 1 tbls natty PB + 1 grapefruit, or 1 cup lowfat cottage cheese + 1 grapefruit

If you desire to have a post workout shake, use 2-3 scoops of a quality blend with no added sugars or dextrose, mixed in water.

I would also recommend fish oil caps taken with meals 1,3,5 as well as a good multi/vit-min

Increase the weights from week to week in good form on the squats and deads, and you will totally restructure and recompose your physique. :gl:

For the next few months your training should be progressive with the basics - squats, deadlifts, dips, military press, pullups, barbell rows, and heavy incline benches.

Here's a diet you can do which is easy and will guarantee results if you are training with the movements above:

Meal #1: 4 egg whites, 1 whole egg, 1/2 cup oatmeal, 3 oz chicken breast

Meal #2: 6 oz eye of round steak, 1/2 cup brown rice, 2 cups broccoli

Meal #3: 6 oz chicken or turkey, 6 oz sweet potato, 1 cup green beans or broccoli,

Meal #4: 2 scoops blended protein powder, 2 tbls heavy cream, mixed in water or 7 oz chicken + 1 oz walnuts or Deluxe Nuts

Meal #5: 6 oz chicken or codfish or any white meat fish, 4 cups salad ( tomatoes, romaine, onions, mushrooms, peppers) 2 tbls. extra virgin olive oil with apple cider or balsamic vinegar

Meal #6: 8 egg whites, 1 tbls natty PB + 1 grapefruit, or 1 cup lowfat cottage cheese + 1 grapefruit

If you desire to have a post workout shake, use 2-3 scoops of a quality blend with no added sugars or dextrose, mixed in water.

I would also recommend fish oil caps taken with meals 1,3,5 as well as a good multi/vit-min

Increase the weights from week to week in good form on the squats and deads, and you will totally restructure and recompose your physique. :gl:

:claplow: :claplow:

the only thing I would add to this is to write down what you do in the gym... keep track so that you KNOW you're making progress ;) it's helped me immensely ;)

For the next few months your training should be progressive with the basics - squats, deadlifts, dips, military press, pullups, barbell rows, and heavy incline benches.

Here's a diet you can do which is easy and will guarantee results if you are training with the movements above:

Meal #1: 4 egg whites, 1 whole egg, 1/2 cup oatmeal, 3 oz chicken breast

Meal #2: 6 oz eye of round steak, 1/2 cup brown rice, 2 cups broccoli

Meal #3: 6 oz chicken or turkey, 6 oz sweet potato, 1 cup green beans or broccoli,

Meal #4: 2 scoops blended protein powder, 2 tbls heavy cream, mixed in water or 7 oz chicken + 1 oz walnuts or Deluxe Nuts

Meal #5: 6 oz chicken or codfish or any white meat fish, 4 cups salad ( tomatoes, romaine, onions, mushrooms, peppers) 2 tbls. extra virgin olive oil with apple cider or balsamic vinegar

Meal #6: 8 egg whites, 1 tbls natty PB + 1 grapefruit, or 1 cup lowfat cottage cheese + 1 grapefruit

If you desire to have a post workout shake, use 2-3 scoops of a quality blend with no added sugars or dextrose, mixed in water.

I would also recommend fish oil caps taken with meals 1,3,5 as well as a good multi/vit-min

Increase the weights from week to week in good form on the squats and deads, and you will totally restructure and recompose your physique. :gl:


Thanks for the response and meal plan. Question though - wouldnt this plan give me too many calories? I did my BMR and then minus 500 to lose 1 lb a week comes out to 2200 calories.

Today my diet was:

1932 cals

71 grams of fat (17 saturated)
153 grams of carbs
170 grams of protein


I do track my workouts on paper and I add more weight per week so I am seeing strength gains.

Any thoughts?

I did my BMR and then minus 500...

Your BMR shouldn't be minus anything. You want to be eating above your BMR to minimize the risk of muscle loss. I think what you're talking about is your BMR multiplied by your estimated activity multiplier, which should give you your maintainence level (i.e. the calories you need to take in, daily, to maintain your current weight).

That diet might be too many calories. There's no one-size-fits-all diet so you need to know what your specific energy needs are and tweak preexisting plans accordingly. This is probably the only reason Mastover isn't driving around his own private island in a gold-plated rocketcar.

Any thoughts?

I think you're on the right track. I think your ratios look good. I think you may want to increase fats by 2% and decrease protein by 5%, making up the difference in carbs. I'm curious as to why you're eating 250+ calories below your evaluated 1 lb/week weight loss rate. I also still don't know your BMR.

M@

My BMR is 1705

after adding the estimated activity number, it becomes 2642

then it says less 500 to lose 1lb a week - that equals 2142

Awesome! I'd say try to maintain that 2000-2200 number. Keep track of your daily caloric intake and see how much you're losing per week. Take measurements too and, if you've got access to a pair of bodyfat calipers or a nurse/healthcare professional who can measure BF% for you, another bodyfat % measurement so that you can nail down your fat loss and lean mass gain in the weeks to come. :tucool:

M@

Thank u for all your help!! im off to the supermarket to stock up on chicken, cottage cheeze, fruits, and veggies

Thank u for all your help!! im off to the supermarket to stock up on chicken, cottage cheeze, fruits, and veggies
Mastover presented a good program!

He sure did. I am certain I cant eat all that food overnight but I will surely try to up my intake of meals according to his meal plan.

He sure did. I am certain I cant eat all that food overnight but I will surely try to up my intake of meals according to his meal plan.

At this point, I would throw all numerical calculations regarding BMR or anything else, out the door. IMHO, your goal should be to eat and train to put on an appreciable amount of muscle while minimizing fat gain.

Take 2 or 3 weeks to ease into the diet. It may seem like a lot, but once you get into it, combined with lifting more intensely with compound movements, you'll discover that you will become hungry for more food. Your metabolism will begin to soar, while your hormonal response to exercise and nutrition will begin to change, albeit not dramatically at first, but over the coarse of time, yes.

Don't worry i also started out like that... skinny fat, think my arms are skinnier than you are. Maybe taking supplements (glutamine, whey etc.) will help a little to prevent muscle loss while cutting, of course need to couple with weight training. :bb:

Update!!

That pic was taken on March 13th.

Here are my pics as of today. I am at 157 lbs. I have lost fat but havent lost much muscle (I hope).

After posting here, I started creating a calorie deficit. I was losing weight fast and I went down to 152 lbs (from 162)... I did not like the way I was looking. A little too skinny for me. I checked my BF% and I had 18% body fat so I would have to be down to 140 to be all muscle. I didnt wanna be that weight so I changed my diet and now I am eating frequently but eating clean. I eat about every 2 hours and I dont count calories much anymore. I listen to my body.. if its hungry I throw down a meal.. If it isnt hungry and 2 hours have passed, I munch on cashews or oatmeal in water. I started drinking Nitrean one week ago. I take in 4 scoops total thruout the day (100grams). Im also on Cellmass and No-Xplode. I have tried other CEE products but even though people complain about Cellmass' price, I see it working for me quite well.

Im still far from where I want to be so if you guys can offer anymore advice, i'd appreciate it. If the pic doesnt show a vast improvement from March till now then let me know - be honest!

Thank u all for all ure help so far!!!:tu:

now that I look at the pic on page 1 of this post - I sure had a "pear" shape going on a couple of months ago...