Macros this, protein that, 4 egg whites, 1 whole egg here.
No protein now, this later, don't drink that, drink this.......

UGH!!

I read these forums and you guys/gals are GREAT to share all this info.
This is honestly one of the only forums I've been on where it's an actual community of people that care about each other. Simply amazing. :tu:

That being said, I've been 'lurking' around here for over a year now, but lately alot more and I'm ready to make my life transformation.
I gotta tell ya, I'm ready to spend the money like JSF did on a digital camera, a cycling machine and the Powertec Weight bench and weights. It obviously won't be cheap.

Thing is I can't wrap my head around all the dietary info. It's ENDLESS.
I mean, I am a Network Engineer in Minnesota and can read manuals that an average joe would puke on, but this stuff baffles me to death.

I guess maybe I'm hoping somebody would share with me their diet and why they eat what they eat and when. For example, JSF says he eats 2-3 egg beaters (or similar) for his 2nd meal. How does he prepare it? Is it nuked, fried, raw??

Any help would be appreciated. Believe me, I've done the search on this site, and I just need some basic explanation of it. There's a TON of information here, but it seems to be so scattered it's almost impossible to find out what is right for me..... :confused:

Anyway, I'm M, 34, 6'1", 220lbs. Estimated BF of 30%.
WILL be: 185lbs, BF 10% by May 30, 2006

ANY SUGGESTIONS PLEASE?

ETA: I attached a picture that REALLY bothers me........Flame away if you must, but I'm making a stand with myself and my life right now.

I'm still learning about diet i know where your coming from. There's a number of journals if you haven't checked that out with people outlining there diets.

Diet is the hardest to learn and get down in my opinion. Maybe someone can tell you about a good book..Good Luck.

John works from home, so i think he makes his egg beaters scrambled on the stove.
And yes, about diets... there are many different ways to lose fat successfully.

Here is the dietary advice i go by.
http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/layne36.htm

There are calculators as you're reading where you enter in your weight, and it will tell you how many carbs, fats, and protein to eat everyday.
It will also tell you when you should be eating carbohydrates, and when you should stick to meals containing mostly protein and fat.

John works from home, so i think he makes his egg beaters scrambled on the stove.
And yes, about diets... there are many different ways to lose fat successfully.

Here is the dietary advice i go by.
http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/layne36.htm

There are calculators as you're reading where you enter in your weight, and it will tell you how many carbs, fats, and protein to eat everyday.
It will also tell you when you should be eating carbohydrates, and when you should stick to meals containing mostly protein and fat.


Thank you. I will review this information.

If you are looking for a "manual", consider getting Burn the Fat Feed the Muscle by Tom Venuto. John has a link at the bottom of this page. (http://www.johnstonefitness.com/php/sponsors.php) A ton of good basic information that should get you on your way.

Jason

If you are looking for a "manual", consider getting Burn the Fat Feed the Muscle by Tom Venuto. John has a link at the bottom of this page. (http://www.johnstonefitness.com/php/sponsors.php) A ton of good basic information that should get you on your way.

Jason

I second the BFFM recommendation. It really is a good source of information.

My understanding of SwoleCat's SGX program is that it provides a complete diet plan. Its more expensive than BFFM, but its a program tailored for you, and it includes consultations, which easily explains the extra expense. I've not tried the program, but it might be something to consider if you want really detailed nutrition guidelines.

I think part of the issue is that there is no one right answer regarding diet, so a lot of ideas are batted back and forth on the forums, so yeah, it can get a bit confusing.

Here are a few things that I think are important:

Learn what the macronutrients are, and which foods are a good source for one or more of them.

Be extremely aware of what you eat, especially at first. Ideally track your food intake. Awareness of what you eat is a huge part of having a successful diet.

Adopt a diet that you can stick to i.e. you have to want to eat it, and it should taste good to you, otherwise you probably won't be able to stick with it. After all, you're looking at a lifestyle change, not punishing yourself.

Cheating is OK. Just keep an eye on it.

Eating 5 or 6 small meals a day, rather than 3 large meals, has really helped me.

You gotta eat breakfast. I used to be a cup of black coffee guy. No wonder I couldn't lose weight.

If you don't like vegetables, its time to start liking 'em. ;)

Diet is extremely important. What you see here and all over the net are differing views. You need to read and study enough to make a decision on what school of thought you will join. Here are my thoughts:

Calories count. You will lose weight if you take in less than you expend and you will gain weight if you take in more than you expend. Estimate how many you expend and adjust intake accordingly. You might do that using a BMR calculation.

Food is broken down into 3 major forms Fat, Carbohydrates, and Protein. Here people differ on what should be the % ratios of each form. 40C/40P/20F is popular in these forums. But you will see others. If you have no problems with blood sugars, you might explore 60C/25%F/15%, also. If you have seen problems with blood sugars, a 25C/30F/45P might be a path.

I bet that you have heard all your life the things that mothers and doctors said don't eat that, too much is not good for you: Alcohol and sugar and some fats come to mind. I say eat clean, and bet you know what you shouldn't eat if you eat clean.

See it is fairly simple. Eat what you need of clean food and drink plenty of water.

Also, here is a list I made of 20 steps to fat loss, may help get you started as well.


1. Avoid drinking your calories, aside from post workout shakes.

2. Keep track of EVERYTHING that you eat, no matter how small.

3. Eat 6-7 times per day, with 2-3 hours between meals.

4. Make your first meal your biggest and your last meal the smallest.

5. Include a fibrous vegetable (spinach, broccoli) with at least 4 of your meals.

6. Limit whey protein to your post workout shake only.

7. Drink at least 6 liters of water per day.

8. Avoid all fried foods.

9. Avoid processed foods, such as microwave dinners and protein bars.

10. Get a minimum of 7 hours sleep per night.

11. Avoid overtraining, as muscles grow at rest, not at the gym.

12. You can do ab work until you puke, but you will not get a six pack until your bodyfat is low enough.

13. Eat whatever you want for 1 meal per week. 1 meal, not 1 day.

14. Prepare the days meals ahead of time. This will prevent skipping meals or eating fast food out of convenience.

15. Get creative. There are a million ways to cook a chicken breast.

16. Keep alcohol consumption to a minimum. Drinking leads to unplanned cheats and missed workouts, in addition to stalling fat loss.

17. Take measurements every few weeks and adjust calorie intake accordingly. 1-2 lbs per week is ideal for fat loss.

18. Avoid enriched foods such as white bread and white rice. Stick to 100% whole wheat and brown rice instead.

19. Lift weights! If you decide to do cardio, don’t get caught up in whether you should do it at night or in the morning, just do it! Consistency is more important than timing.

20. Just because something works for one person, does not mean it will work for you. Try it for yourself and see what works best for YOU.


Here (http://alamofitness.com/katchcalc.html) is a calculator to figure out how many calories you need based on activity level(most are moderately active)

Here (http://www.alamofitness.com/macrocalc.html) is a calculator that tells you how many grams of each macro needed based on calories and ratios.


Jason

Awesome list, Jason.

We can lay this bag of snakes out pretty straight for you, Chandler. You really do need to understand many of the things you "can't wrap your mind around" - it's important to understanding why you're going to do what you're going to do. Understanding that is the key to unlock the power of fitness, man. There's nothing more cool than that.

Can you better clarify what you read that confused you? Also, did you perouse the stickies in the beginner's forum? Most of them have a good amount of rudimentary information in plain-speak that I think anyone starting out should be able to digest, but if you can't, be more specific in what you're having trouble with and we'll help.

You don't live near Minneapolis, do you? I'll be staying downtown near the Nicollet Mall in early November for a business trip.

-R

Don't worry so much about the details for now. Jump right in with both feet and do what you think is best based on the information you have right now.

There are no rules to improving your body. Lots of different people have lots of different theories about what works best. But different diets and exercise programs work differently for different people, whether by affecting their moods in different ways, changing their metabolisms in a negative or positive direction, and creating different energy levels. It's not as good to copy someone else's diet plan as to find one that YOU enjoy that YOU can stick to. It doesn't have to be a perfect one for now; once you learn more, you can adapt it to be better.

The truth is, many of the nutritional strategies described here are "overkill" and should mainly be considered by people who are already in good shape and are looking to get into sub-10% body fat shape. If you're at 30% body fat, the amount of calories that you eat is about ten times as important as any target macronutrient ratio you think you should be aiming for.

Jason- that list is an unbelieveable framework. Thanks for that.

Diet is sooo much more complicated than any of the other components. It's not even close - look at the number of debates on the other boards and you will see so many arguments about nutrition it will make your head spin.

The only thing that I can add to that is that it's really hard to change everything at once. Start by drinking a lot more water; getting rid of obvious junk foods; and eating more often, with smaller amounts. In and of themselves, that gets you started. After that, learn about the differences in various fats (good/bad/trans) and carbs (High GI/Low GI).

Give yourself a little time. You are doing the right things by thinking about it - there is no doubt about that - but changing all of your habits at once is almost impossible. Cut yourself some slack and start with the basics - they go a very long way.

Keep it up. Frustration here is actually a good sign in that it shows that you are trying.

...Frustration here is actually a good sign in that it shows that you are trying.
except it's actually bad, because frustration/stress will elevate cortisol levels, which will eat away at your muscles. :spaz:
try to research this stuff in a happy mood. :D

The only thing that I can add to that is that it's really hard to change everything at once. Start by drinking a lot more water; getting rid of obvious junk foods; and eating more often, with smaller amounts. In and of themselves, that gets you started. After that, learn about the differences in various fats (good/bad/trans) and carbs (High GI/Low GI).

Give yourself a little time. You are doing the right things by thinking about it - there is no doubt about that - but changing all of your habits at once is almost impossible. Cut yourself some slack and start with the basics - they go a very long way.

Keep it up. Frustration here is actually a good sign in that it shows that you are trying.

True, and wise cautionary words to help prevent burnout/failure.

There are two schools of thought here - John did his transformation over a very short amount of time whereas it's taken me two years to knock on the door of sub-10% body fat. I don't know what Chandler's ultimate goal is, but rather than telling him to "jump in with both feet" or to gradually ease into it, I'd tell him this: find a pace he's comfortable with, that he can sustain, that he can improve upon, and that he can accomplish within the framework of his life as he sees it.

For someone like John, zero-to-fitness works. For others, yours truly included, a snail's pace is what it took. It's all about considering the options and finding the right path for yourself.

-R

Thanks everyone for the input.

I'm reading www.fatlosstips.com right now and it's explaining alot of the stuff I wasn't sure about.

Even now though, there is speculation about WHEN to work out too.
Before breakfast, after dinner.....I guess just doing it is better than not doing it, and I can learn on the fly.

Again, I appreciate the input, and that's a great list Jason. Thanks for the work.

BlueStreak, I live about 1.5 hrs from Minneapolis.

One more thing. Does anybody have a link to a site with what foods are high in protein, high in Carbs, and high in unsaturated fats (or even better, recipes with nutrition informaition)?
NEVERMIND>>>>FOUND IT..
http://www.fatlosstips.com/downloads.html


Thanks again!!!

Welcome mate! Well. you can find some very good recipes right here on this site
http://forums.johnstonefitness.com/showthread.php?t=10500

>Word of warning: Don't get too caught up in getting every single vitamin and mineral every day.

>Concentrate on eating healthy and getting the calories with the right amount of protein, carbs and fat. Have your portion of carbs (brown rice, wholewheat pasta), your portion of protein(chicken,tuna) and your portion of veg (brocolli, spinach, tomatoes, peppers) 6 times a day. Don't forget to have a healthy amount of olive oil or other good source of fats.

>Eat what you can of what you like. I for example love beef steak and pork chops. I haven't cut them out of my diet. I just get the lean kind or remove as much fat as I can and I'm left with 7-10g of fat per 100g. More than chicken and fish but still tolerable.

>Get some books on weight training, cardio and proper diet. Loads of programs and diets out there, choose one you like or make one based on the knowledge you gather from the books. If you want to remove all guesswork, give Swolecat a call. Exceptional results.

>I will be a bit of a devil and say every week, have a DAY off. That's right, a whole day. Don't go absolutely crazy but have a couple (not a dozen!) beers and a pizza. But the other 6 days, do it right!

Protein:
+ Tuna or most any fish.
+ Cottage cheese.
+ Eggs (especially the whites).
+ Chicken breast (boneless skinless).
+ Turkey breast (boneless skinless).
+ Lean beef.
+ Low fat or no fat cheese.
+ Low fat pork.
+ Milk protein isolate.
+ Whey protein.
+ Soy protein.


Carbohydrates:
+ Sweet potatoes.
+ Oat meal, oat bran, oat bran cereal (i.e. cheerios).
+ Bran cereal.
+ Brown rice.
+ Wheat bread (try to limit to 2 slices per day).
+ Beans.
+ Low fat popcorn (low fat butter spray makes this a delicacy).
+ Fruits (limit to 2-3 servings per day).
+ Malto dextrin (during workout).
+ Dextrose (during workout)
+ Vegetables.
+ Stay away from refined grains and anything that says "enriched" or "high fructose corn syrup" on the label!


Fat:
+ Omega 3 capsules (i.e. fish oil capsules).
+ Flax seed oil.
+ Primrose oil.
+ Borage oil.
+ Olive oil.
+ Nuts (limit to 1 serving per day),
+ peanut butter (as long as it does not contain hydrogenated oils).
+ Egg yolks.
+ Fish (salmon especially).

Does anybody have a link to a site with what foods are high in protein, high in Carbs, and high in unsaturated fats (or even better, recipes with nutrition informaition)?

See the recipes section of this site as well. Tons of great ones I use often and most recipes are given with their nutritional breakdowns.

-R

Honestly, the best time to work out is when you can schedule your time to do it.

Fasted cardio? Unfasted cardio? Pre and post workout eating patterns and ratios? What to eat before sleep? What to eat when you wake up?

It's a lot of information, a lot of theories and there are comparatively few "universal truths". Don't panic. Hit the big ones first (eat 5x/day; drink 40% more water than you are right now; minimize alcohol and get rid of doritos, etc.) . The really basic rule to start with is:

Cal in > Cal burned = weight gain.
Cal in < Cal burned = weight loss.

On day 1, that's enough. Figure out how to burn a few more calories and consume a few less and you will start down a road to fat loss.

Also, here is a list I made of 20 steps to fat loss, may help get you started as well.
5. Include a fibrous vegetable (spinach, broccoli) with at least 4 of your meals.

6. Limit whey protein to your post workout shake only.

7. Drink at least 6 liters of water per day.

8. Avoid all fried foods.


I agree with most of the list, but those points fall strictly into "whatever works for you" category, NOT hard and universally accepted rules for weightloss. A person can lose weight by not following those rules just as well as one who does.
- Vegetables are beneficial, but you don't have to eat them 4 times a day.
- You can drink more than one protein shake a day as meal replacement, whatever works for you.
- "At least 6 liters" of water is much exaggerated. 2-3 is just fine, also it depends on the person and above all temperature
- You have to get a proper amount of fat in your food, so frying food is OK if you cook with canola/olive oil, monitor the amount of oil and temperature, and generally know what you're doing.

I'm afraid that's the kind of confusion the original poster was worried about... people on this board don't really distinguish as much between universal rules that everyone should follow, methods proven to work on most people by scientific studies, personal experience/anecdotes, and stuff that simply works for them.

... people on this board don't really distinguish as much between universal rules that everyone should follow, methods proven to work on most people by scientific studies, personal experience/anecdotes, and stuff that simply works for them.

Sure they do; but rather than state these points as concrete rules (which would elicit more debate than we have server space for) it's implied that these are suggestions, not rules. Posters who'll put forth a list like that understand that it's subjective - subject to the readers' interpretation - and in fact, it requires their interpretation. It has many guidelines - not hard and fast rules, but guidelines for weight loss. It's up to the person reading the information to decide if it's within the confines of something they would like to include and/or sustain for the length of time necessary to change one's lifestyle and/or complete a body transformation.

When I first got into fitness, I couldn't get my hands on enough reading material. I absolutely immersed myself in it - and that time investment has paid dividends. How? Fitness isn't something I think about now. It's automatic. It's part of everyday life.

At some point, people will just have to realize that they need to knuckle down and make a serious effort to understand that fitness and being fit are dynamic concepts. It requires an initial investment of time and significant cognitive effort... but it's a point that seems to whisk over the heads of forum goers.

-R

I'm realizing that alot of the information is subjective and that I'll have to work out in the long run what works for me and what doesn't. Thanks to wh0areume for the breakdown on the foods. I really appreciate the effort.

Thanks again to everyone for their efforts. I will read and learn as much as I can. I'm hoping to start as early as next week, but I want to be prepared, including personal (and realistic) short and long term goals.

I did have one question about salt/seasonins/salad dressing.
I see JSF having a salad for lunches but no mention of any dressings. Is that true?

Also, what do you use to season your chicken, etc. Is salt a BIG no no?

Also, I'll see an 6 oz can of tuna for lunch with 2 slices of wheat bread.
Do you mix it with anything, or just drain it and slap it on the bread that way?

I did have one question about salt/seasonins/salad dressing.
I see JSF having a salad for lunches but no mention of any dressings. Is that true?
No reason why you couldn't have some light dressing, but read the labels carefully. Mayo and many other salad dressings can contain A LOT of calories, not to mention oils that are pure fat (but you do need some fat in your diet).

Also, what do you use to season your chicken, etc. Is salt a BIG no no?
Use whatever you can. Any spice other than salt is great. As for salt, someone here once said that if it comes from your sprinkler, it's alright. Too much salt is unhealthy, but you won't be having too much salt if you follow general guidelines from the stickies, and no salt is even unhealthier.

i'll try and help you out cause i know it's all confusing as hell

the food you eat is like gas for a car without gas a car will not run ...the thing with the calories is that when your trying to gain weight you gotta eat more calories then your body burns because when you excercise your body burns calories, for everything you do you burn calories so in order to gain you gotta eat more then you lose and vise versa for losing weight

the carbs,fat and protein are to keep your body geared up for this example i will use a water baloon and a water faucet....lets say that when you workout you tear your muscles up so in order to rebuild them you need protein now think of a water ballon with a hole(muscle breakdown) in it you need to put more water(protein) in it to make it get bigger....now the water faucet will be your carbs...the more power(strength/energy) you turn on the water faucet with the quicker the baloon will fill up...now if you didn't have the carbs(water power knob) and were trying to fill it up with just drips at a time it would take longer cause there's just no force to it(no energy during workouts)

all the different numbers for each is based on your own activity level so what works for me may not work for you that's why it's all about figuring out what works for you....the eating every 2-3 hours is to keep your body in an anabolic state where your muscles just keep growing and your energized throughout the day

it's good to balance out everything to keep your body in this anabolic state because when you eat a portion of fat, protein and carbs every 2-3 hours it's giving your body all the nutrients it needs to build muscle

i hope this helps...ask me any other questions and i will try and answer them as best i could for you :gl:

I did have one question about salt/seasonins/salad dressing.
I see JSF having a salad for lunches but no mention of any dressings. Is that true?

Also, what do you use to season your chicken, etc. Is salt a BIG no no?

Also, I'll see an 6 oz can of tuna for lunch with 2 slices of wheat bread.
Do you mix it with anything, or just drain it and slap it on the bread that way?
Again, there's no rules about these things.

If I don't put nuts on my salad, I usually use dressing. The nutrients in the vegetables can't be absorbed into the body as well if you don't eat them with fats.

I sometimes season my chicken with lemon or orange juice. Once in a while, I use a bit of barbecue sauce, but more often, I try to get the flavor in the meal from the items I eat with my chicken (brussels sprouts, broccoli, wild rice with dried apricots) Salt is bad, but it's not going to kill you if you stick to reasonable amounts. (For example, I rarely use the salt shaker; I figure I get enough sodium already from canned and processed foods and sauces and dressings.)

I've eaten plain tuna on bread before, but it's not very exciting. I usually mix in about a tablespoon of cottage cheese or yogurt and some lemon juice and a sprinkling of black pepper. Chopped red pepper or celery adds a nice crunch as well.

Also, I'll see an 6 oz can of tuna for lunch with 2 slices of wheat bread.
Do you mix it with anything, or just drain it and slap it on the bread that way?
Personally, I always make a tuna salad. Chopped Chinese cabbage, bell pepper, tomato, lettuce, onion, some olives possibly, some cottage cheese, a can or two of tuna, and black pepper/other seasonings mixed up. Usually a bowl of it to last a good few servings. Protein and veggies, two in one :). And the good fats, if you add more olives or olive oil in.

1 can of tuna drained mixed with 2tbsp miracle whip with 4 slices of wheat bread....i actually eat this 2 times a day

calories-544
carbs-64g
protein-44.50g
fat-12.25g

for chicken i put seasonings to help with the dry flavor of chicken...i use cajun seasoning and garlic powder(garlic has a thermogenic effect so it helps too) sometimes i just use the garlic powder and eat the chicken with pace picante sauce

1 can of tuna drained mixed with 2tbsp miracle whip with 4 slices of wheat bread....i actually eat this 2 times a day

calories-544
carbs-64g
protein-44.50g
fat-12.25g

for chicken i put seasonings to help with the dry flavor of chicken...i use cajun seasoning and garlic powder(garlic has a thermogenic effect so it helps too) sometimes i just use the garlic powder and eat the chicken with pace picante sauce


Thanks again everyone!! This is all very helpful information.
well, I spent about $700 last Friday and bought everything I think I'll need to begin ($300 of it was a digital camera), so I just need to sit down and determine some meals/food preparation ideas and goto the grocery store. I think I'll realistically be able to start next Monday.

I read that about 1-2 lbs per week weight loss is realistic. Have you found that to be about right? I ask because I'm trying to set out some short term and intermediate goals and I want to be realistic.

1 to 2lbs is a good target it could well go a little faster for the first month because the body will release water. Assuming you drink lots of it everyday it will adapt and not hold onto so much.