I actually wrote and finished a post on this last night but when I clicked on "Preview Post" Internet Explorer crashed esssentially deleting everything I had written - no joke.

Getting down to business, ever since I was 9 years old I have always had small problems with computers. I have always owned and worked on a PC since I was a little kid, the only experience that I ever had with a Mac was at a friends house when I was in my early teens and recently at computer labs in college. The small problems that I had with my various computers I always explained to myself as something that was a "necessary evil" or something that came with using technology. But my recent problems and frustrations have are now making me consider a switch that I previously thought would never be possible - buying a Mac.

I just bought a brand new $1500 HP laptop in September for my first semester of college and I justified spending some extra cash on it so it would last me at least 4 years of undergrad work. But alas, I have successfully lost two papers in the last semester, countless e-mails and messages, and have had increasing spyware and adware problems no matter what software I instal or run. My favorite computer story is from exam week last semester when I had to spend over 8 hours on the telephone with university computer support to fix my computers inability to access secure websites. And I know that I'm not the only one with these problems - I'm the "computer geek" in the family so whenever anyone has a problem (every other week or so) they call me up, and I'm always fixing my girlfriends PC from spyware attacks.

These frustrations have been brought up in discussions I've had with new friends at my school who happened to be Mac guys. They filled me in on how they've never had a virus, never get attacked by spyware, never have "blue screen" attacks, ect. That sounds pretty appealing to me so I've started to work on Macs in my school computer labs and have gotten pretty familiar with the OS.

Now, my computer usage is as follows - I check my e-mail, surf the web, write papers, listen to and compose music, watch movies, chat with friends, and occasionally play a few games (mostly Diablo 2, and ususally only over break). So, I'm pretty sure that a switch to a Mac wouldn't be limiting anything that I do on a daily basis. I guess the only thing that is really holding me back is an issue of money. Since I broke the bank a bit on the laptop PC I bought in September I would need to sell that computer in order to buy another one. So depending on how much I could get for it I may or may not simply be able to do this.

Any advise is much appreciated, especially suggestions as to how I could sell my laptop.

Before the age of about 12 (22 now), I only used Macs. Then, for whatever reason, I switched over to a PC and have been using one ever since. However, I went ahead and bought a 12" iBook G4 about 6 months ago. And well, basically, I will always have a PC around but all of my future big computer purchases will be Mac only. The Mac OS just destroys Windows in every way. MS Office is far superior on a Mac. Everything about a Mac is sleeker and nicer looking.

Everything you mentioned and MUCH MUCH more can be done on a Mac and I guarantee you will NOT be disappointed. Get yourself an iBook or Powerbook and make sure to go to the Apple Education Discount store. Saves you some cash. Get it with standard built-in RAM and purchase an extra stick off Newegg.

Or, go for a Mac Mini for like $500 if you don't need a laptop. Great way to introduce yourself to Apple without breaking the bank.

:gl:

Well, Macs aren't infalliable- they have their problems as well, and in general, if something goes wrong, you'll be unable to fix it yourself.

The main thing, however, is what you plan to do with the system. Surf the web, write Word documents- a mac is a fine choice. If you're talking games or software availability, then you're probably better off with PCs. (Getting better, though)

We have a few G5 macs with the cinema displays here, and they're nice. I like OSX.

Once you go Mac you never go back.



Mac user 6 years and counting.

In case anyone is wanting to comment on what apple product I would purchase, I've got my eyes on an iBook, probably the 14" model. It would be my only system so it would need to be portable - a desktop is out of the question.

All the comments have been great, but what about selling my PC? The only thought that runs through my mind is eBay, but is there another means where I can get more money for my laptop? I'm not even sure what a fair "trade in" value would be for the computer - It's an HP Pavilion zv5240us, if that makes a difference.

You'll probably get around $600 for it. Maybe a tad more or less. Definitely try ebay. It's the best place to sell to the blind.

The iBook is a great choice. If you want extreme portability (and a lower price), grab the 12" model. The resolution on the 14" and the 12" is the same, so even though you have a slightly larger screen with the 14", you don't have any more "real estate" in a sense.

GAAA!!! $600? That's all it will sell for?!? Sure, I know that my computer has lost value, but has it really depreciated almost $900 in 8 months?

Cars and computers... two of the worst things to invest in.

These frustrations have been brought up in discussions I've had with new friends at my school who happened to be Mac guys. They filled me in on how they've never had a virus, never get attacked by spyware, never have "blue screen" attacks, ect.

I'm a PC guy and I just wanted to throw out there that I had to use a MAC in college and these supposed new friends of yours are either novice MAC users - or are flat out lying to you to try and get you to make the switch.

ALL operating systems hang up and crash - Linux, MAC, UNIX, Windows - no body is infallible. If they were - they'd control 100% of the computing market. And when a MAC crashes - usually you'll find yourself unplugging the damn thing to get it to turn off and reboot. ARGH!!!

I hate non-windows pc OSes because the programs available for them suck - MAC pretty much follows suit with this.

I've found the biggest problem in the PC world is that PCs pretty much try to support EVERYTHING - both software and hardware. In a real world however this is rarely effective and the buyer gets the short end of the functionailty stick. If you scrutinize every piece of hardware and software you attach to your PC - you see 90% less of everything you're complaining about. (Of course MAC has done this for you by having closed architecture - which in turn limits your choices pretty significantly) And if you add something to your machine and it starts to misbehave - theres a 90% chance that if you rip out that new app/hardware - the problem goes away. Words for PC users to live by.

Good luck with your trek to MAC world though - its definately "different". :)

"ALL operating systems hang up and crash - Linux, MAC, UNIX, Windows - no body is infallible."

Of course, but you can't even try to tell me that they all crash an equal percentage of the time. Windows systems crash far more often than any of the Unix based ones.

I've known a great number of Windows users who have said "I only use Windows because:

I have to for (whatever) reason".

or

I don't know how to use a Mac, so I won't buy one."


I've never heard a Mac or even Linux user say something similar and there's good reason for it.

I just switched over to Linux after having used Windows since version 3.1. I can guarantee you that Linux and OS X crash just as much as Windows does. I see my KDE apps crash 3 or 4 times a day, and I recall OS X crashing spectacularly one time when I was working in a recording studio.

The only reason I'm using Linux is because it's free, pretty and does the things I need to do on a daily basis. If I had $300+ to spare I would use XP Pro for sure.

It's entirely possible to use Windows for years without having any virus or spyware problems. Just get a good firewall (Zone Alarm is free) and run an anti-virus and AdAware scan once a week. I was using Win2K forever before this and I think I had one virus in that whole time. I just got that one because I was stupid and went to some Russian site that popped up and asked me to install something and I clicked OK by mistake!

I agree that Macs are incredibly sexy and very well-designed. However, there's a price premium for all that. To my mind it's not worth the extra money.

If you take care of your machine, it won't matter what OS is on it. I know 90% of users don't know how.. but you can't blame an OS for your ignorance. The only reason I have never had a mac is because it seems like a cult ;)

If you take care of your machine, it won't matter what OS is on it. I know 90% of users don't know how.. but you can't blame an OS for your ignorance.


That's it. I was a Mac user from the first Apples until 3 years ao. I needed a new machine and ended up building a new PC from scratch running XP Pro. I got wicked power for 1/3 the cost of the mac, and only marginally more than a complete off the shelf unit. The XP machine has been far more stable than my latest Mac ever was. I run a fulltime firewall, keep viruses up to date and have never been nailed by a virus. My PC has crashed only twice, literally, in 3 years for "unexplained" reasons (the rest were me hitting the stupid button).

I still love Macs and we use OSX at work in some areas but I've been happy with XP.

I do take care of my machine - I have antivirus software, I run AdAware and SpyBot along with a defrag once a week, I delete my cookies/temp internet files, ect. I'm not trying to blame Windows XP for my ignorance at all.

I do know that OS X will crash. Anything will, that's just technology. My friends were exaggerating a bit when they told me that they *never* get a virus, crash, ect. What they were trying to point out to me is that they have much less frequent problems. And from what I hear online and elsewhere, that seems to be the case.

And I admit, in the past when people have brought up Mac I've always thought "Oh gee, I would never have the patients to learn a new OS" or "I would feel really naked without Windows." There is actually a Mac Expo at my school next Wednesday so I'm definitely going to go to it and talk to some of the people there. Perhaps they can explain more to me about the Mac I want to purchase or how to sell my PC. :tu:

Yes.... if you know how to clean your pc and know about its guts then you will more then likely not have a problem on your pc... but as for 95% of the pc user base... you are a minority... 95% arent as versed in the pc as you are.

a good guy stated this recently...

----
"From the very beginning Apple hired very talented and very creative people. Musicians, writers and artists who were also some of the best computer engineers around.

Microsoft hired very talented computer people. CompSci, computer engineers, etc. People who didn't do much else but computers.

These may be sterotypes and generalizations but I think they hold true.

The personnel who designed and developed each OS is very evident in each OS. We are computer people, so we can live in Windows. We can see how to do things, get things done. REGULAR PEOPLE CAN NOT.

Windows wasn't designed *for* or *by* regular people. Think back to trying to teach your mom how to do something. It was obivous and easy for you, right? But not for your mom.

I was helping my sister download a shareware app the other day. We were on the phone, states away. I'm on my Mac, she's on a PC. She clicks download, then what? Save or Run? Save. OK, where did it save it? Look on the desktop. OK, oh, it's a Zip file. She hates zip files. Now she has to double-click, and then extract the files. Oppps..where did the files get extracted to? I say nevermind, look for setup.exe in the list of files in Winzip. Ok, run that...whew..

for me to download and install the same app was one click to download, then click on the disk image and then drag app icon to Applications.

The beauty is in the simplicity. That is what Microsoft will never get."

----

I've used both Platforms, but mainly mac in both professional and fun capacities. Both will get the job done. For many the differences will be unimportant, for others critical.

1. Web content. Yes, there is plenty of web content that does not work on a mac, but that is choice of the programmer. Too few Macs users to influence these decisions. Though understandable it is one of the worst offenders as it unfairly contributes to PC as a preferred platform. A vicious circle.

2. Aesthetics and usability. The Mac has better looking, better made, easier to use hardware and software, generally. There are some reasonable looking PC systems, but way more garbage. Most mac software has a consistent GUI. Before OSX I would have said installations were easier on Mac, but they are pretty much the same now. From a a designer's perspective Windows is a horrible looking GUI, in every respect. The quality of the graphics/icons/typography is absolutely abismal. I see no excuse here as surely Bill has far more cash to throw at this exercise.

3. File management. Windows, to my knowledge, cannot move an installed application easily and has often failed to delete an application successfully for me. To my knowledge, file type associations on Windows are limited to 1:1 based on suffix. This is a big problem for a design workflow where I deal with EPS files created by Quark, InDesign, Photoshop, FreeHand, Illustrator and more, but as far as Windows is concerned they can only be associated with one of those apps. Font management is hideous, though it's almost as bad on OSX now. I'd like to thrash the brainless idiot at Apple who decided Helvetica.dfont would make a great system font, when it clashes with standard postscript publishing workflow. And you cannot replace it without causing problems with Safari, Mail and Address Book.

4. Speed. Well, we can argue for ever about which systems are faster but at the end of the day many do not need the capacity of even the lowest end systems for most day-to-day tasks.

5. Software availability. Just becuase there is more software for PC does not make it better. There's a huge range on both platforms for most users.
----



as for the price issue... which is often brough up by those arguing against macs....

why does it cost more to buy a jaguar then it costs to buy a ford focus (generally speaking)?

that answer more then likely will settle the... "why are macs so expensive"? question.

think about it.

Well, actually, the cost issue is really due to two factors:

1. There's no such thing as a Mac Clone. They tried it, they were called PowerPCs and they drove down the price of Macs. Apple didn't like that, so they brought everything back in house. Certainly, you can get upgrades that are not made by apple, but by and large you're stuck dealing with one company that can charge what it wants.

2. Design, design, design. PCs are not cute or attractive. They don't come in fun colors.

To quote: "why does it cost more to buy a jaguar then it costs to buy a ford focus (generally speaking)?"

Let's phrase the question more realistically. Why does a Porche 911 (~$100k, ~355HP) cost $55k more than a corvette (~$45k, ~400HP)?

-They're both made of rubber, plastic and metal.
-They both are fast, and work pretty well, in general.
-One, however, is much more of a status symbol than the other. That makes it worth $55k more in some eyes.

Well, actually, the cost issue is really due to two factors:

1. There's no such thing as a Mac Clone. They tried it, they were called PowerPCs and they drove down the price of Macs. Apple didn't like that, so they brought everything back in house. Certainly, you can get upgrades that are not made by apple, but by and large you're stuck dealing with one company that can charge what it wants.

2. Design, design, design. PCs are not cute or attractive. They don't come in fun colors.

To quote: "why does it cost more to buy a jaguar then it costs to buy a ford focus (generally speaking)?"

Let's phrase the question more realistically. Why does a Porche 911 (~$100k, ~355HP) cost $55k more than a corvette (~$45k, ~400HP)?

-They're both made of rubber, plastic and metal.
-They both are fast, and work pretty well, in general.
-One, however, is much more of a status symbol than the other. That makes it worth $55k more in some eyes.


aw but the 911 is not just more of a status symbol then a corvette... the 911 is more intuitive (repsonsive to the driiver) and is better at handiling.... not to mention other aspects that allude me at the moment.

oh yeah... ones domestic and the other is foreign and we all know that if you're gonna get a sports car ... foreign cars are the way to go.



which is why i used a ford focus in that analogy.

Yes.... if you know how to clean your pc and know about its guts then you will more then likely not have a problem on your pc... but as for 95% of the pc user base... you are a minority... 95% arent as versed in the pc as you are.

a good guy stated this recently...

blah blah blah



I think Krosspyder pretty much hit the nail on the head. PCs are for people who know how to use them. Macs are for people who a) are elitist and don't want to know how to use a PC because they would rather flaunt their imagined geek superiorty over Windows users (this applies to Linux desktop users too), or b) are not smart or skilled enough to fix anything that goes wrong with their OS and would rather pay somebody to do it for peace of mind anyway (this does not so much apply to linux users, and sadly can also apply to PC users).

Don't get me wrong, I like OSX, and I don't necessarily like Microsoft, but having owned both PCs that run Linux and Windows (many many several) and a Powerbook, my "FUNCTIONAL" OS preference goes:

1) Windows XP
2) OSX
3) Linux (mostly Gentoo, but I've used pretty much every distro there is).

I am a network technician and work in an environment where I have to use Macs and PCs daily. I'm not just pulling this out of my ass.

Is Windows complicated? Yes. Needlessly so? Definitely not. If you want to learn how to drive a tank, you don't complain to your sergeant that the tank is too tough to drive and they should probably give you a minivan instead. You learn how to drive the f'ing tank.

EDIT: I should mention that I love Linux and am a big advocate of Open Source Software, but it's simply not ready for end users.

Macs are for people who a) are elitist and don't want to know how to use a PC because they would rather flaunt their imagined geek superiorty over Windows users (this applies to Linux desktop users too), or b) are not smart or skilled enough to fix anything that goes wrong with their OS and would rather pay somebody to do it for peace of mind anyway (this does not so much apply to linux users, and sadly can also apply to PC users).

A completely invalid and ignorant statement.

There has yet to be a PC problem I couldn't fix and I personally never have any spyware/adaware nor viruses. I am not an elitist as I own a PC (several actually) and only one Mac, which I use less often (since it's a laptop). Geek superiority? Trust me, that's the last thing I look to "flaunt".

Yet, I still prefer Mac OSX for everything but gaming over Windows.

This could go on forever, and it probably will, but how about we refrain from immature name-calling that is uncalled for?

I've always hated Macs. That might be because OS9 sucks like hell....the constant extension conflicts and memory problems drove me nuts. I hated having to mess with the memory settings of programs in order to get them to function properly. Also, OS9 had idiotic little idiosyncracies that i never did get used to....such as only copying "aliases" when dragging files from a zip or CD drive to the HD, but copying the whole file when copying from one HD to another. Totally idiotic and nonsensical. However, OSX is a MUCH better operating system. I don't have nearly the conflicts that I did with OS9, and plus I like the fact that it updates itself each week with new patches/software additions etc. The interface is generally much better, and it doesn't have the random stupidity of OS9. So, now I am liking my Mac much better.

One advantage to Macs though, is that they are incredibly easy to network....unlike PC's (in my experience)....Also, macs have fewer spyware/adware/virus problems. One disadvantage, is fewer games for Macs.

I've always liked PC's, and I guess I don't really hate Macs anymore. I like them about equal now that Mac has a halfway decent operating system.

This could go on forever, and it probably will, but how about we refrain from immature name-calling that is uncalled for?


very well put. immature comments aren't my cup o joe. :tucool:



macs are more intuitive.
osx is closer to being one with the persons mind as oppose to windows.... which is far more detached.

I think Krosspyder pretty much hit the nail on the head. PCs are for people who know how to use them. Macs are for people who a) are elitist and don't want to know how to use a PC because they would rather flaunt their imagined geek superiorty over Windows users (this applies to Linux desktop users too), or b) are not smart or skilled enough to fix anything that goes wrong with their OS and would rather pay somebody to do it for peace of mind anyway (this does not so much apply to linux users, and sadly can also apply to PC users).

Don't get me wrong, I like OSX, and I don't necessarily like Microsoft, but having owned both PCs that run Linux and Windows (many many several) and a Powerbook, my "FUNCTIONAL" OS preference goes:

1) Windows XP
2) OSX
3) Linux (mostly Gentoo, but I've used pretty much every distro there is).

I am a network technician and work in an environment where I have to use Macs and PCs daily. I'm not just pulling this out of my ass.

Is Windows complicated? Yes. Needlessly so? Definitely not. If you want to learn how to drive a tank, you don't complain to your sergeant that the tank is too tough to drive and they should probably give you a minivan instead. You learn how to drive the f'ing tank.

EDIT: I should mention that I love Linux and am a big advocate of Open Source Software, but it's simply not ready for end users.



95 % of the pc user base doesn't want to learn how to drive the tank like you have learned.

generally speaking macs are more friendly in this sense to the common person...

of course if someone wants to learn how to drive the tank that the mac osx has... they can.... since its based on unix... as im sure you understand.


almost a perfect harmony....

a user friendly unix.... leave it to apple to do this. innovators not followers.

haven't people worked hard at trying to make a user friendly unix system?


apple does it with ease.

Nothing like OS comparisons to inflame passions! :lol:

yeah really.... i need to chill out. sorry guys. im real passionate about mac osx... sometimes that gets in the way of me being objective about this stuff. so forgive me if i seem out of hand. i don't mean to cause shit or stir it up. i dont respect windows or microsoft as im sure some of you all dont respect mac or apple but i do respect a person who knows thier pc and can build it from the ground up... without a doubt.

The intent of my example was to show that cars with comparable statistics don't always cost the same. As another example, you go to a fancy restaurant and get a steak. The next night you go to Outback and get a steak. Chances are, they're both pretty good steaks, but you pay more at the fancy place. Why? Because, theoretically, you should be getting a better experience and service at the fancy restaurant. In practice, however, this isn't always the case.

Similarly, Macs are well-known for being simple and elegant, if expensive. PCs are known to be cheap and fast, if problematic. Now, you can have a PC that is cheap, fast, looks good, and is stable. You can have a mac that is fast, looks good and is stable, but it will never be as cheap as a PC.

You can have a mac that is fast, looks good and is stable, but it will never be as cheap as a PC.

Mac Minis start at $499.
iBooks start at $999.

Not to mention students save at least $30 off those prices.

The last time I checked, those are very competitive prices for what you are getting.

The only PC Laptops that are <$1000 are either made by Avaretec or weigh 12 lbs and have 1 hr battery life. (Both are exaggurations, but you get my point.)

Mac Minis start at $499.
iBooks start at $999.

Not to mention students save at least $30 off those prices.

The last time I checked, those are very competitive prices for what you are getting.

The only PC Laptops that are <$1000 are either made by Avaretec or weigh 12 lbs and have 1 hr battery life. (Both are exaggurations, but you get my point.)
Another thing to note is that when looking at speeds, your mac doesn't have to be as "fast" as a PC. That is to say, because of the OS or something (I forget the exact reason) a 1.5 Gigahertz processor in a Mac is about as fast as a 2.5 Gigahertz processor in a PC.

I have a powerbook that I use for taking notes in class, making presentations, and working outside of home. I love it and it's great. However, because of the things I do with my PC desktop, I couldn't ever consider switching to Mac for my desktop, even though I'd really like to. (Screw you, Bill Gates!)

My father, however, switched a few weeks ago, and he is absolutely LOVING his new Mac desktop (I forget which one he got)

Another thing to note is that when looking at speeds, your mac doesn't have to be as "fast" as a PC. That is to say, because of the OS or something (I forget the exact reason) a 1.5 Gigahertz processor in a Mac is about as fast as a 2.5 Gigahertz processor in a PC.

It's because of the architecture of the chip.

Just how an AMD Athlon 3000+ XP is about the same speed (theoretically) as an Intel 3ghz chip but only runs at about 2.2ghz. Of course depending on which AMD and which Intel chip you are comparing, there are flaws, but the point is ghz are not nearly the end all be all of speed. You must consider other important factors such as cache size, front-side bus speed, etc.

Another thing to note is that when looking at speeds, your mac doesn't have to be as "fast" as a PC. That is to say, because of the OS or something (I forget the exact reason) a 1.5 Gigahertz processor in a Mac is about as fast as a 2.5 Gigahertz processor in a PC.
I think that happens when I run Outlook. If you go to Outlook's preferences and check "Allow other applications to run normally", the problem seems to go away. ;)

The intent of my example was to show that cars with comparable statistics don't always cost the same. As another example, you go to a fancy restaurant and get a steak. The next night you go to Outback and get a steak. Chances are, they're both pretty good steaks, but you pay more at the fancy place. Why? Because, theoretically, you should be getting a better experience and service at the fancy restaurant. In practice, however, this isn't always the case.

Similarly, Macs are well-known for being simple and elegant, if expensive. PCs are known to be cheap and fast, if problematic. Now, you can have a PC that is cheap, fast, looks good, and is stable. You can have a mac that is fast, looks good and is stable, but it will never be as cheap as a PC.


good point... but you also must consider that in a mac the components and software that comes with it are more so built from the same company (apple) as opposed to pcs which use components and software from different companys.... this increases the ease of use of macs as well as the stability and thus also increases the price... which is why you are paying for quality.... again like in Jag.... parts aren't nearly as parted out as other low budget cars.


Good points to the poster who posted about chip architeture. Very important point. Pc manufactures always use "the numbers" to decieve the public and make them think they are getting a blazing fast kick ass machine (when they dont really need it that fast to begin with) but sacrifice on quality... for quantity. Basic consumers are being decieved... old marketing ploy.

Mac Minis start at $499.
iBooks start at $999.

Not to mention students save at least $30 off those prices.

The last time I checked, those are very competitive prices for what you are getting.

The only PC Laptops that are <$1000 are either made by Avaretec or weigh 12 lbs and have 1 hr battery life. (Both are exaggurations, but you get my point.)

Actually, with the Apple Education Store discount you can buy an iBook for $899. That's a 12" iBook with a CD-Rom drive in place of Apple's "Combo" drive, but otherwise the machine is the same as the one that anyone can buy off the street for $999. So, the Education Store is great for saving some money off the price of the hardware.

I'll never touch a mac. PC all the way till the end of time.

Another thing to note is that when looking at speeds, your mac doesn't have to be as "fast" as a PC. That is to say, because of the OS or something (I forget the exact reason) a 1.5 Gigahertz processor in a Mac is about as fast as a 2.5 Gigahertz processor in a PC.

Macs use a RISC (Reduced Instruction Set) style processor, which allows them to do some processing jobs faster than PCs, which use CISC (Complex Instruction Set). They generally have lower clock speeds, so performance is comparable. Heck, even between PC chip manufacturers, they label their chips so that the clock speed is obfuscated.

A Mac mini is $499. For that price, you get the following:

1.25GHz PowerPC G4
256MB DDR333 SDRAM
ATI Radeon 9200 with 32MB DDR video memory
40GB Ultra ATA hard drive
Combo drive
DVI or VGA video output
one FireWire 400 port, two USB 2.0 ports, 10/100 Ethernet and a 56k V.92 modem.

A local PC shop near me has the following for $489

• AMD Athlon 64 2800 CPU
• Sony 52X CDRW drive
• Asus 400 Bus DDR Motherboard
• 512MB PC-3200 400 MHZ DDR RAM
• Deluxe Medium ATX UL 450W listed tower case
• Nvidia FX5200 128MB 3D AGP video card
• 5.1 Surround Sound
• 10/100 Ethernet Adapter, floppy
• 80 GB WD SATA 7200 RPM Hard Drive
• 2 serial, parallel, 2 USB, Software Bundle

A $999 iBook has the following:
1.2GHz PowerPC G4
512K L2 cache @1.2GHz
12-inch TFT Displays
1024x768 resolution
256MB DDR266 SDRAM
30GB Ultra ATA drive
Combo Drive
ATI Mobility Radeon 9200
32MB DDR video memory
AirPort Extreme built-in

A $999 Dell Inspiron 6000 has the following:
Intel® Pentium® M Processor 715 (1.50 GHz/2MB Cache/400MHz FSB)
Microsoft® Windows® XP Home
15" XGA display
64MB DDR ATI's MOBILITY™ RADEON X300 PCI Express x16 Graphics
256MB DDR2 SDRAM 1 Dimm
40GB Hard Drive
8X Max DVD ROM Drive
Intel® PRO/Wireless 2200 Internal Wireless (802.11 b/g, 54Mbps)

So we can see that you still tend to get a little more with PCs. On the other hand, the mac mini is pretty cool looking, and tiny to boot. The dell dimension is just a regular system. The laptops are both attractive, the Mac may be faster (I'm guessing) and the Dell has a larger screen.

Also, if you have a mac that uses SDRAM, don't buy memory from apple. $500 for 1GB of RAM? Yowza

so as you can see the reason why macs cost a little more (or a lot more...depending on what you are looking at) is because they dont source parts out as much as pc manufacures do.


hell.... the shell... case is from say... hp, sony, dell, compaq etc. and the os is from microsoft (most the time).

on a mac... the case is from APPLE and the os is from APPLE.

thats as basic as i can get so you can see my point.


you pay more for quality.

I'll never touch a mac. PC all the way till the end of time.

too bad. just might like the mac. i had this perspective till i had to use a mac at work. i was shocked at what i was missing out on.

now i can use a pc for games and a mac for serious work. i have options.


lol

so as you can see the reason why macs cost a little more (or a lot more...depending on what you are looking at) is because they dont source parts out as much as pc manufacures do.

hell.... the shell... case is from say... hp, sony, dell, compaq etc. and the os is from microsoft (most the time).
on a mac... the case is from APPLE and the os is from APPLE.
thats as basic as i can get so you can see my point.

you pay more for quality.

Well, the fact that all parts come from one source != quality. However, macs DO have very good design, which is what you're paying for. It's possible, though, to get nice quality parts for PCs as well.

Well, the fact that all parts come from one source != quality. However, macs DO have very good design, which is what you're paying for. It's possible, though, to get nice quality parts for PCs as well.

oh definitly...I wont despute that. more times then none though... 95% of pc user base sees high ghz numbers and cheap price automatically thinks... hell fast machine.. and its a good price.... better deal then a mac.

5% of the pc user base knows thier machines inside and out and can get quality parts for thier computer... and if something goes wrong they can fix it.

i think its logical to conclude that when most of the parts in a computer are made by the same company they work together better then parts that are from different companys.... less problems.
again to 5% of the pc user base it doesnt matter because they can fix the issues that may arise.

i think being "aware" is where its at no matter what system you use.

oh definitly...I wont despute that. more times then none though... 95% of pc user base sees high ghz numbers and cheap price automatically thinks... hell fast machine.. and its a good price.... better deal then a mac.


Yeah, I think that's true, in the same way that there's people who say "Oh, a Mac will make my life so much easier", and then they realize that they still have to have a basic understanding of computers to operate them.


i think its logical to conclude that when most of the parts in a computer are made by the same company they work together better then parts that are from different companys.... less problems.
again to 5% of the pc user base it doesnt matter because they can fix the issues that may arise.

i think being "aware" is where its at no matter what system you use.

It's interesting you bring that up. Consumer Reports, I think, did a survey of technical support numbers, and they found that Apple had the shortest call times. No why do you suppose that is? Could it be because they make just about everything for the machine? Compare that to a PC manufacturer who has no idea if you've swapped out the memory, cpu, video card, sound card, network card, motherboard, etc etc etc. Almost makes you feel sorry for them. ;)

Yeah, I think that's true, in the same way that there's people who say "Oh, a Mac will make my life so much easier", and then they realize that they still have to have a basic understanding of computers to operate them.

definitly. you still have to learn how to get use to the OS (especially if you are used to windows). still a tool that one needs to learn how to use.



It's interesting you bring that up. Consumer Reports, I think, did a survey of technical support numbers, and they found that Apple had the shortest call times. No why do you suppose that is? Could it be because they make just about everything for the machine? Compare that to a PC manufacturer who has no idea if you've swapped out the memory, cpu, video card, sound card, network card, motherboard, etc etc etc. Almost makes you feel sorry for them. ;)

well there ya go. thanks for mentioning that.