I've been on a 5 day split for awhile now and really enjoy my routine. However, I've noticed that some of my excercises overlap others. For example, I do pull-ups on back day (palms away), but I also do pull-ups (palms facing me) on arm day. I have made slow and steady gains but I'm wondering if I am giving enough time for recovery.
My Split
Mon-chest
Tues-back
Wed-Legs
Thu-Shoulder
Fri-Arm
Any tips and advice is appreciated.

Any tips and advice is appreciated.

I don't think you've given enough information to have good detailed responses, but if you're making gains, slowly -- keep it up. I would suggest that if your muscles are sore, rest them. If they are ready to go again, work them.

I like your name, I'm a big Johnny Cash fan, too. Is that the meaning of your name? Did you misspell his name intentionally, or is that your real name?

Also, welcome to the forums. Glad you're here.

I personally think the only way to be not overtraining on a 5 day split is to take your "vitamins" with a needle.
Unless its low intensity and then your gains will be minimal at best.

I wouldn't be concerned about working lats on two different days. My concern with overtraining is that you expose your body and CNS to 5 straight days of the stress of exercise. Your system has to work against that stress each day. on top of that some even throw in cardio to fill up 7 days a week of stress and recovery. I think the average person needs 48 hours after a exercise session to recover.

Thanks for the replies.

Williamso - My training currently consists of 1 compound lift and 1-2 isolation lifts per muscle group (back gets two compound - deads and pull-ups). I do 3 "working" sets for each excercise with a rep goal of 8-6-4. So, I usually only do 2-3 excercises per workout depending on the size of the muscle group. But I try to do them with intensity. And yes, I am a huge fan of johnny cash but I don't spell my first name with an "H" so i misspelled it in my nickname.

RTEstes - Can you provide me a link regarding CNS research, I would like to learn more about this. I searched this site but was unable to find a whole lot more than off-hand comments about this or that will affect your CNS. Google provided way too much info about the central nervous system, just wondering if you knew of a place to start.

I personally think the only way to be not overtraining on a 5 day split is to take your "vitamins" with a needle.
Unless its low intensity and then your gains will be minimal at best.


Well, Max OT is predicated on a 5 day split and I like the results so far.

Agreed. I use Max-OT principles too and I've never gained so well.

I too was wondering about the MAX-OT 5 day split. It seems to me that the difference between the MAX-OT and the other "home brewed" 5 day splits is that the MAX-OT puts a direct focus on those muscle groups - the other peripheral groups that you work out while focussing on the main group don't sustain enough stress to require major recovery. The short intense duration doesn't affect them as much as a sustained higher rep workout, where the instances of a peripheral muscle being worked out are greater.

Perhaps I am wrong in saying this, but by my experience it seems that secondary groups are worn out more by higher reps and long durations of tension, moreso than an overload of weight with lower reps. However, the main muscle group exercised is developed as well (or better) by a maximum overload for fewer reps. It seems that the effects of secondary muscles fatigue by weight is not directly proportional, whereas the effect of higher reps is proportional. This could be a reason why the MAX-OT workout works very well.

RTEstes - Can you provide me a link regarding CNS research, I would like to learn more about this. I searched this site but was unable to find a whole lot more than off-hand comments about this or that will affect your CNS. Google provided way too much info about the central nervous system, just wondering if you knew of a place to start.

Here is a little to get you started. Like all things there is no black and white:

The muscle tissue itself will continue to recover even if the same mechanical stress is applied to it within 48 hours (T.C. Chen, Taipei Physical Education College, and S.S. Hsieh, FACSM,. The effects of a seven-day repeated eccentric training on recovery from muscle damage. Med. Sci. Sports Exrc. 31(5 Supp) pp. S71, 1999). Studies where overtraining was intentionally induced indicate that although "voluntary strength" decreases with "overtraining", involuntary strength does not. Involuntary strength is measured by stimulating the muscle with electrodes. This enables researchers to see if the muscle itself is able to generate force, or if the problem lies in the central nervous system (the electrodes bypass the CNS).


http://www.physsportsmed.com/issues/2001/05_01/uusitalo.htm

http://sportsmedicine.about.com/od/strengthtraining/a/overtrainweight_3.htm

http://www.ironmagazine.com/article21.html

http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/issa71.htm

Thanks again for your help. I will start reading tonight.

Hort, Monkey, & Betastas - I agree that I have seen excellent growth in size and stregnth from a 5/day overload training and I think that your theory regarding secondary muscle fatigue is probably accurate, but I'm beginning to think that Max O/T may not be a good long term routine (even factoring the week off every 8 weeks) simply because of the demands it places on your body. Maybe not, but it is a feeling I can't seem to shake.