Two weeks ago I started Max OT, 5 nights a week, usually about 6p. I also started doing 40-45 minutes fasted cardio from 5:15-6a 5-6 days a week.

I eat clean, 5-6 meals, 40-40-20 or sometimes 50-30-20. Calories distributed a little more towards the first half of the day. Currently eating 2300 cals daily.

I'm 38, 6'2", and currently 180lbs, BF% is 15%... and there's the problem.


Two weeks ago, I was 174lbs and 13.5% BF (measured with calipers by me and by a trainer).

????? :d_eek:

I'd take the gain if it was lean but what's with the fat gain (It's obvious just looking in the mirror)? During this same period, I've seen significant strength gains in legs amd shoulders, but losses in chest.

I can't imagine it's the "starvation mode" issue. 2300 isn't a lot but John's cutting on much less- of course he's more muscular. And maybe my lower muscle percentage is the issue. That said, A year ago I cut down to 10% with less muscle than I have now.

If you were me with my current routine, how many calories would you be eating daily? The only supp's I take currently are whey pwo and glutamine. I don't do caffeine.

I'm sorry, something just doesn't add up. With all that activity and considering your weight, there is NO WAY you ate 21000 excess calories in the past two weeks, end of story.

Either your measurements are off or you are eating a lot more than you think or you got your measurements backwards and the 174lbs was the newer one... or, I can't even think of anything else to explain it.

Well, I'm friggen stumped :d_confuse

I have to agree, something seems off. You sure you have the calorie counts right? You counting everthing.... no matter how small it may seem?

But even if you're not counting stuff like salad dressing and may, I still don't see how you could have gained that much weight (and fat)

I think it may have something to do with cortisol, water retention, and CNS overload possibly.

For the last 10 weeks I have been training very hard doing a 4 day split and two days of low intensity cardio. After 10 weeks, my body simply needed a rest. I just felt worn out and sluggish all the time because of the training and low carb diet. I took this week off because of all that, and am losing more weight with the exact same diet and I feel energozed.

I haven't done extensive research, and maybe someone else could shed some light on this, but after training for a few weeks straight, I think the metabolism can actually slow down because of the fatigue factor. Just my thoughts though....

I had a hell of a time deciding to take this week off, but I am very grateful that I did.

I'm not saying you gained fat per se, but most likely water retention from cortisol

Thanks guys. Like you- it doesn't add up for me either. I'm meticulous about logging my diet- everything including water, vitamins, etc.

Psuguy98 - that's interesting. I have been sluggish. I attributed it to the two a days and lower carbs. I've been looking into cycling macros which would get more carbs in on a couple of days.

I'd say water is part of the issue... I'm not getting a huge overdose of sodium that I'm aware of... I drink about 1 gallon a day lately.

Cortisol... I do have a high-stress job. Does the heavy workout raise the physical stress factor, compounding matters?

Thanks guys. Like you- it doesn't add up for me either. I'm meticulous about logging my diet- everything including water, vitamins, etc.

Psuguy98 - that's interesting. I have been sluggish. I attributed it to the two a days and lower carbs. I've been looking into cycling macros which would get more carbs in on a couple of days.

I'd say water is part of the issue... I'm not getting a huge overdose of sodium that I'm aware of... I drink about 1 gallon a day lately.

Cortisol... I do have a high-stress job. Does the heavy workout raise the physical stress factor, compounding matters?

I personnaly have been cycling carbs as well. It worls for me. 5 days of cutting with low or no carb and then two days of maintenance calores or as much as 500 calories more with complex carbs and protein. This works well for me.

After any type of stress whether physical or emotional, cortisol is running through you. After I leave work my stomach is usually more bloated because if the stress form working. Duriing the weekends, when I have little or no stress, my waist usually shrinks.

With the change in diet, I'd also like to ask if you are "going" on a regular basis. In other words, are you taking a dump everyday? Is it possible that you are a little backed up? Food going in but not coming out can also cause you to be sluggish or hold on to "extra" weight.

With the change in diet, I'd also like to ask if you are "going" on a regular basis. In other words, are you taking a dump everyday? Is it possible that you are a little backed up? Food going in but not coming out can also cause you to be sluggish or hold on to "extra" weight.


Good question... there has been a little change downstairs...

I'll keep at it for a bit and see if things don't balance out.

Two weeks, 6'2, 38, 2300 Kcal 40:40:20

You put on 3 plds muscle and 3 plds fat in a basically 1:1 ratio

Are you trying to bulk right now or cut on your diet? seems like a cut diet.

This is really confusing, and you say you write down every single item that you put in your mouth. I think what would be helpful is if you list the times and the foods that you eat for a typical day so that people can look at it further.

Switching to double sessions = stress.

Stress is a strange one, manifests in many ways... perceptible stress, that we're aware of, as well as things like sluggishness that we aren't so cognizant of. If a week off is out of the question, how about reverting to your old routine for a 2 weeks and see if that straightens you out. Maybe your current plan is too much with everything else that is going on in your life right now.

Switching to double sessions = stress.

Stress is a strange one, manifests in many ways... perceptible stress, that we're aware of, as well as things like sluggishness that we aren't so cognizant of. If a week off is out of the question, how about reverting to your old routine for a 2 weeks and see if that straightens you out. Maybe your current plan is too much with everything else that is going on in your life right now.


Wondering about that too. I appreciate the reply. Began fighting a cold this afternoon. Methinks I'm a bit worn out. :confused:

Why not try to lower your calories for a week or two, then evaluate some changes. Maybe eat 1800-2000 kcal, then go back up again. I know stress can be a big factor (especially if you deal with it the wrong way) and not to mention the cortisol problem. I'm not a nutritionist or a physical expert for that matter, but I do know that it effects your fat loss progress...

OK-

Over two months I've tried calories as low as 1600 and as high as 2500 over prolonged periods. I've fiddled with rest between sets and many other options. Even met with a couple of trainers who said I looked pretty dialed in.

And in those 8 weeks I've only managed to trim down to 13%. The only thing the trainers mentioned and that I feel might be true is that I don't have enough muscle, that I have a slow metabolism despite the healthy lifestyle and that perhaps I should bulk now.

My only fear is that, given my current fat content, I'll store too much fat while bulking. It's weird, I easily dropped down to 10% last year with noticeably less muscle. I'm stymied- the weight should be falling off and I should be 9-10% by now instead I'm risking becoming "skinny fat".

Should I bulk or just hope that over the next few months the VERY slow cut will continue?

OK-

Over two months I've tried calories as low as 1600 and as high as 2500 over prolonged periods. I've fiddled with rest between sets and many other options. Even met with a couple of trainers who said I looked pretty dialed in.

And in those 8 weeks I've only managed to trim down to 13%. The only thing the trainers mentioned and that I feel might be true is that I don't have enough muscle, that I have a slow metabolism despite the healthy lifestyle and that perhaps I should bulk now.

My only fear is that, given my current fat content, I'll store too much fat while bulking. It's weird, I easily dropped down to 10% last year with noticeably less muscle. I'm stymied- the weight should be falling off and I should be 9-10% by now instead I'm risking becoming "skinny fat".

Should I bulk or just hope that over the next few months the VERY slow cut will continue?

I would go to maintenance calories and hit the weights harder... you'll find that you'll still increase muscle and will probably drop your fat a little bit at the same time... since your main goal is to lean out I wouldn't bulk... but that's my opinion ;)

what do your lifting and cardio schedules look like?

That's an idea Chameleon- meet it in the middle maybe. I'll give that some thought.

I do M-F/5 days a week. 45 minutes fasted cardio at 5:30a and M-F/5 days lifting, MaxOT. Occasionally do some cardio weekends but with warm weather here finally and more outside time, yardwork etc I won't hit the gym on weekends.

WOOHOO!!!!
http://instagiber.net/smiliesdotcom/otn/realhappy/jump.gif

Just got my calipers and measured my BF% 6 times because it took that long to believe the number: 10.9!! That means my weight has stayed steady around 176 for the past few months but I've also lost 4% bodyfat in the same period. :tu:

Still have to get leaner but I know I need to add muscle too. :jumping:

10% Wow! Great job Hort! Can you already see your abs? Again, congratulation!

Alas- these 38 year old abs are being elusive. Flexed- the outer outline is there, running down my abdomen. The top two show but the remainder are well hidden. I'm guessing I'd need to be ~7% :o Even at 11% I'm still rather skinny-fat, you know?

I want down to 9% then I'll probably bulk.