IVe been doing them for abit. I use either a 25lb or a 35lb plate (dont have any 45s) while doing them. What does everybody else do? When you need to use more weight do you just pile them on and hold onto a stack while doing them? Any suggestions? I think I am at the point where I could probably do some sets with 50lbs plus maybe. This is only for standard weighted crunches working the upper abs, otherwise I am pathetically weak with the lower abs. Thanks for any advice.

It depends on your goals. If you are looking to have well-defined abs, you don't ever have to touch a weighted crunch. Bodyweight is all you'll ever need, when done correctly, combined with proper nutrition.

In fact, I can't think of too many functional reasons to do weighted crunches, either.

I know bodybuilders enjoy doing them ... but again, it's not necessary for ab definition because some great abs have been built without ever adding external resistance.

Jeremy

IVe been doing them for abit. I use either a 25lb or a 35lb plate (dont have any 45s) while doing them. What does everybody else do? When you need to use more weight do you just pile them on and hold onto a stack while doing them? Any suggestions? I think I am at the point where I could probably do some sets with 50lbs plus maybe. This is only for standard weighted crunches working the upper abs, otherwise I am pathetically weak with the lower abs. Thanks for any advice.

I was doing them mainly to build up some serious ab muscles. Especially the lower ones, because of some health issues of mine I thought there might be some added benefits in going this route. Maybe Ill try to do just crunches with the 35s but do more of them. Thanks for the reply.

Lately, I've been do them on an incline holding a 10 pound plate behind my head - mostly because the incline crunch apparatus is one of the only things in my gym that is reliably not in use around 7:30. It's in a small, neglected corner of the gym, next to the erg.

Since they started doing boxing classes in the stretching area of my gym from 7:00 to 8:00 (conveniently cutting off access to the Roman chairs), floor space has gotten pretty tough to find, and they only have two pull-up bars in the whole place, both of which are above cable stations, and thus constantly obstructed, my ab options are sometimes somewhat limited if I want to fit them into my workouts rather than do them at home.

There are a lot of ways to work your abs, I just find that weighted, inclined crunches give me the right intensity with the apparatus available. And they're fun.

It depends on your goals. If you are looking to have well-defined abs, you don't ever have to touch a weighted crunch. Bodyweight is all you'll ever need, when done correctly, combined with proper nutrition.

Huh? The nutrition and lower body fat part I get, but not the part about not doing weighted crunches. I mean, it seems kind of counter intuitive to me, you know? If you want your muscles to grow, you engage in progressive resistance training, right? Why wouldn't that apply to abdominal muscles? Can't you make them become larger and more prominent by adding weight to crunches?

I didn't say you "can't" get them to grow with weight, I said you don't NEED to.

You don't need to train with weights to grow muscles. There were muscular physiques long before the first dumbbell or barbell was invented. Will these help? Sure. Are they necessary? No, unless you are planning to compete in a bodybuilding competition.

As for abs, the thing with abs is they are a special type of muscle. They stabilize your core and torso. Therefore, any time you squat, dead-lift, or perform other compound, multi-joint lifts, you are working your abdominal muscles. So they are getting plenty of work.

The problem I have with weighted crunches is simply most people go to them too soon - before they learn how to properly train their abs. To properly train your abs, you must train your pelvic girdle and transversus. Abs are actually only flat when contracted. What pulls them flat when relaxed is a muscle beneath the abs called the transversus. When you perform a hanging leg raise with bodyweight, the only way to keep your torso from whipping around is to engage the pelvic girdle and transversus so these are under tension and contracted while you are performing the lift.

Going straight to weighted crunches is a good way to overdevelop the abs and underdevelop the transversus - which basically leads to a protruding "gut" even when the fat is low (See professional wrestling, there are plenty of examples of this). Another common mistake is to forget the lower back, which also works.

There is a dominant view that everyone muscle train like a bodybuilder. This simply isn't true. If your goal is to get on stage and bodybuild, then yes, that's the way to go. If your goal is optimal health, then there is never any need to weight the abs whatsoever - they get plenty of work as a stabilizer.

In fact, I've taken people who can do decline sit-ups with 75 pounds worth of plates and shown them the CORRECT way to do hanging leg raises and crunches, and they can barely knock out 8 reps. Why? Because they arent using their abs - they're using a ton of muscles with a little bit of abs. When you learn how to isolate the abs, it can be years before you develop the strength to justify adding external loading.

If you can do this sequence without your torso swinging at all, then you are probably ready for weighted crunches:

12 reps hanging knee raises (211 tempo - knees come up, you pause, then take 2 seconds to lower - again, no support, this is free hanging, not in a roman chair, and no torso swinging allowed whatsoever)

rest 1 minute, then

12 reps straight leg raises (draw legs up until feet are higher than your navel, pause for 1 full second, then lower)

rest 1 minute, then

12 reps full leg raises (draw legs up until feet are over head (you invert your torso at the top, then take 2 seconds to lower them back)

rest 1 minute, then

12 reps inverted Vs (while hanging from the bar, draw your legs up so your feet are over your head. Now, without returning to the start, spread your legs in a wide "V", pause, return them together, then repeat for 12 reps)

rest 1 minute, then

12 reps inverted scissors (invert yourself while hanging from the bar, so legs are over head ... then, keeping your left leg up, lower your right leg until it is parallel to the ground, pause, raise it back, then do the same with the left leg, etc 12 times each side)

Those are exercises that isolate the abdominal and core muscular (by hanging free, you are also engaging the pelvic girdle, transversus, etc) ... if you can do that sequence, then I'd say, yeah, throw some weight on, you're ready. What I find is that many people doing weight crunches and situps with plates are just overcompensating using hipflexors, hamstrings, and other muscles - the abs are really still only receiving body weight.

Here's an article with pictures:

http://www.naturalphysiques.com/cms/index.php?itemid=103

Again, this is just my opinion and experience. A picture of my abs is in that article ... for me, that's all the abdominal development I care for, beyond that (visually) I only care for functional strength, which comes from the core being involved with other lifts and not necessarily direct ab work.

So, to recap, will weighting abs help them grow? Sure. Do most people weight their abs? Nope. They might be doing weighted crunches or decline situps, but they aren't isolating their abs ... they're using a ton of muscles besides the abs to take on the extra weight.

Jeremy

Edited because I had overdevelop abs/underdevelop transversus backwards in the original post

Huh? The nutrition and lower body fat part I get, but not the part about not doing weighted crunches. I mean, it seems kind of counter intuitive to me, you know? If you want your muscles to grow, you engage in progressive resistance training, right? Why wouldn't that apply to abdominal muscles? Can't you make them become larger and more prominent by adding weight to crunches?

Damn! Woah!

Thanks for the detailed info Jeremy, that one (post) is definitely a keeper, cut-and-paster into Wordpad for future reference. Again, thank you! :tu:

~B

yeah thanks for the detail. Ill try some of the stuff you listed.