Ok, so i have just completed my morning cardio, at 65-75% of MHR. Now, when should i eat breakfast, right after, 30 minutes after? Any suggestions to this ?

15 mins after, have a fat/protein meal. 45 after that (1 hour total) can have a protein/carb meal

completely dependent upon what you're eating. Do a search of the other threads on this. Swole has a very good theory on this. Most important though is just getting the cardio in while fasted. That alone will produce solid results. Though quality post-workout nutrition is the icing on the cake.

Ok thanks. About fasted workout, is it ok if i eat like half a banana before. Ive read elsewhere that it can be good to have a fruit or similar before the fasted workout, so you dont get dizzy while working out. Does this seem right ?

Hi all,

Just recently started doing my slow-med intencity cardio of 65-85% MHR. My question to you is does it matter whether it is performed in the morning fasted or in the afternoon/evening? I find it really hard to get up to do cardio, however I have no qualms about doing my cradio in the afternoon or evening. My main goal is too add muscle mass whilst burning fat. Im around 13-15% body fat.

most people here will prob say its fine to do cv in afternoon/evening so long as its seperated from weight work by a couple of hours.

Reason(ing) for cv in mornings is that your body has depleted glycogen in muscles and can burn more fat... which you wont be able to in afternoon or evening as you'll have been eating beforehand.

Also, if u do it in the morning, its easier to get some important hours between cardio and weight lifting.

you'll definitely have more energy in the morning than later at night when your back from work or whatever and stressed out. :p i would.

A cv in the mornings will make you more wide awake at the start of a day, and can set you up in a good mood for the rest of the day.

About fasted workout, is it ok if i eat like half a banana before.

Are you getting dizzy during your fasted-state cardio?

If so and a banana helps, then that's just what your body requires. If you don't get dizzy then it probably becomes moot.

A banana is a high-glycemic carb. Don't eat anything with carbohydrates in it before fasted-state cardio, or the whole "fasted state" part is gone. Your body will burn that banana and remaining glycogen in your muscles from the overnight before moving on to lypolize fat. I think you'll find that if you get out of bed and head straight to the treadmill you'll never get lightheaded. I.e., do your daily preparation the night before such that you can jump out of bed, in your car and get to the gym ASAP.

In my opinion, you'll heavily dilute the effectiveness of your cardio if you eat before you do a steady, fasted-state cardio session. If you must have something before your cardio in the morning, I'd say have a shot of whey protein (20-grams worth) and nothing else.

If you do begin to do fasted-state cardio, the best thing you can do immediately following that session is to have a protein/fat source (no carbs, or keep the carbs extremely low). I utilize why protein shakes with flax or some Omega 3/6/9 oil mixed in. Sometimes I'll have egg-beaters with a few strips of bacon.

Just avoid those carbs for about 2 hours following fasted state cardio.

-R

Ok, thanks. Today was the first day i did fasted cardio. And i had breakfast like 30 minutes after, consisting of oatmeal and alittle bread and chicken...Would a breakfast with egg as main source of food be better ? Im thinkin of making a egg omelette with some mackerel in it, would this be a good protein/fat meal after my fasted cardio ?

A banana is a high-glycemic carb. Don't eat anything with carbohydrates in it before fasted-state cardio, or the whole "fasted state" part is gone. Your body will burn that banana and remaining glycogen in your muscles from the overnight before moving on to lypolize fat. I think you'll find that if you get out of bed and head straight to the treadmill you'll never get lightheaded. I.e., do your daily preparation the night before such that you can jump out of bed, in your car and get to the gym ASAP.

In my opinion, you'll heavily dilute the effectiveness of your cardio if you eat before you do a steady, fasted-state cardio session. If you must have something before your cardio in the morning, I'd say have a shot of whey protein (20-grams worth) and nothing else.

If you do begin to do fasted-state cardio, the best thing you can do immediately following that session is to have a protein/fat source (no carbs, or keep the carbs extremely low). I utilize why protein shakes with flax or some Omega 3/6/9 oil mixed in. Sometimes I'll have egg-beaters with a few strips of bacon.

Just avoid those carbs for about 2 hours following fasted state cardio.

-R

Nix the oatmeal and bread. In fact, if you're looking for fat loss, nix the bread altogether. Oatmeal is fine for a mid-morning meal, but keep it (and all other carbs) at least two hours removed from fasted-state cardio.

If mackerel is mostly protein and fat, along with a few egg whites, you should be fine. For example, my post-cardio meal consists of 30~40 grams of protein and 10~12 grams of fat. Zero carbs, or as close to zero as I can get.

-R

So something like Egg whites and mackerel after the cardio in morning. Then 2h after i could eat some oatmeal to get some carbs. Would that be a ok start for the first 2-3 hours of the day ?

Nix the oatmeal and bread. In fact, if you're looking for fat loss, nix the bread altogether. Oatmeal is fine for a mid-morning meal, but keep it (and all other carbs) at least two hours removed from fasted-state cardio.

If mackerel is mostly protein and fat, along with a few egg whites, you should be fine. For example, my post-cardio meal consists of 30~40 grams of protein and 10~12 grams of fat. Zero carbs, or as close to zero as I can get.

-R

I think you'll find that if you get out of bed and head straight to the treadmill you'll never get lightheaded. I.e., do your daily preparation the night before such that you can jump out of bed, in your car and get to the gym ASAP.
R, can I at least take a leak?

:D

i've heard that you need carbs after morning fasted cardio because you can become catabolic. Something to do with cortisol levels after long fast.

So something like Egg whites and mackerel after the cardio in morning. Then 2h after i could eat some oatmeal to get some carbs. Would that be a ok start for the first 2-3 hours of the day ?

As I said, anything that's mostly protein and some fat, you should be fine. How you choose to get it is up to you. Check those foods you mentioned for their nutritional values and see how things fall out; adjust if necessary.

R, can I at least take a leak?

Pee-breaks are cool. Sometimes they're required to deflate EMW (early morning wood). :D

i've heard that you need carbs after morning fasted cardio because you can become catabolic. Something to do with cortisol levels after long fast.

I'm more interested in preventing the insulin rise that carbs cause. If insulin is present post-cardio, fat burning will stop. I have not had problems with muscle catabolism using the plan I've described in these posts.

-R

Pee-breaks are cool. Sometimes they're required to deflate EMW (early morning wood). :D

:lol:

As I said, anything that's mostly protein and some fat, you should be fine. How you choose to get it is up to you. Check those foods you mentioned for their nutritional values and see how things fall out; adjust if necessary.



Pee-breaks are cool. Sometimes they're required to deflate EMW (early morning wood). :D



I'm more interested in preventing the insulin rise that carbs cause. If insulin is present post-cardio, fat burning will stop. I have not had problems with muscle catabolism using the plan I've described in these posts.

-R

Well, just to provide a difference of opinion, I used to run most mornings before work a couple summers ago - not for fat-loss purposes or "lipolysis" concerns, but cuz I liked running (and still do) and that was the best time for getting one in at that period of my life- would then move on to my favorite breakfast of cereal, fruit, and soymilk- all those dreadful insulin-raising carbs (the horror!) didnt keep me from staying pretty lean...plenty of runners also maintain pretty low BF %s while at the same time eating before/during/after a run, so dont feel you have to suck down eggs, nuts, and oils after a good run (ugh, just the thought makes me a bit queasy...)

Well, just to provide a difference of opinion, I used to run most mornings before work a couple summers ago - not for fat-loss purposes or "lipolysis" concerns, but cuz I liked running (and still do) and that was the best time for getting one in at that period of my life- would then move on to my favorite breakfast of cereal, fruit, and soymilk- all those dreadful insulin-raising carbs (the horror!) didnt keep me from staying pretty lean...plenty of runners also maintain pretty low BF %s while at the same time eating before/during/after a run, so dont feel you have to suck down eggs, nuts, and oils after a good run (ugh, just the thought makes me a bit queasy...)

I'd venture an educated guess that when you're running, you're exceeding 75% of your maximum heart rate for extended periods of time - you're not doing slow, steady, fasted-state cardio at that point. Running is a more strenuous type of cardio altogether and requires carbohydrates for fuel to prevent muscle catabolism.

-R

I agree, if you can, do cardio on an empty stomach IF you are doing the slow going, fat burning stuff. If I am doing HIIT, I usually get my heart rate quite high, I can't do it on a fasted state, I feel too light headed as well.

i really dont see the need to do all this "dont eat carbs for 1 hour after training"
i do low-intensity cardio (never over 60% MHR) then straight after i have oats, banana and some whey, i have been seeing good results
if i were to move that 1 meal back 45mins, how much difference would it make... probly very little, everyone is missing the point that its about the other 23hours of the day, when your not doing cardio that actually matter, if your diet generally sucks, you probly wont be very successful, however if you have a good solid diet, and sensible training, there shouldnt be any problems, no need to wait 45mins after training to eat, thats just taking things too fat, i have to start my day with oats, oats for breakfast is a staple of any good diet.

do your fasted cardio, burn your calories, eat your food, if you get results, then stick with it, this little nit-picking things are just annoying to do

i really dont see the need to do all this "dont eat carbs for 1 hour after training"
i do low-intensity cardio (never over 60% MHR) then straight after i have oats, banana and some whey, i have been seeing good results
if i were to move that 1 meal back 45mins, how much difference would it make... probly very little, everyone is missing the point that its about the other 23hours of the day, when your not doing cardio that actually matter, if your diet generally sucks, you probly wont be very successful, however if you have a good solid diet, and sensible training, there shouldnt be any problems, no need to wait 45mins after training to eat, thats just taking things too fat, i have to start my day with oats, oats for breakfast is a staple of any good diet.

do your fasted cardio, burn your calories, eat your food, if you get results, then stick with it, this little nit-picking things are just annoying to do

So I'm assuming you've done fasted cardio and then tried what has been suggested by others about not eating carbs for upwards of an hour and not had good results? Or are you just preaching to the choir about your own thoughts without knowing for certain that you get much better results from either way?!?! You can do your cardio and eating however you like or however you feel is best for you and I give you credit for that, but I'm here on these boards (like so many others) to get info from folks that have went through tried and tested ways of burning fat, not just best guesses from people who don't believe in certain ways of training based on their own supposed 'nit-picking annoyance' values. If I find that I can lose fat quicker by not having carbs for upwards of an hour after cardio, then it ain't nit-picking to me - it's a solution that I can live with...

*blink

fasted training under any circumstance is suboptimal for many reasons.

im saying i've had good results with eating within an hour of doing cardio, also my cardio is less intense, so if anything im burning less calories during the session, and i seem to lose weight fine, because weight loss = diet, cardio simply creates a greater caloire deficit

if you are losing weight at a healthy rate (1lb a week) you dont need to do all these little micromanagement stuff, have a solid diet, a good training program, and you will be fine

Ok thanks. About fasted workout, is it ok if i eat like half a banana before. Ive read elsewhere that it can be good to have a fruit or similar before the fasted workout, so you dont get dizzy while working out. Does this seem right ?

no.

Most importantly just get up and do the cardio. That is first and by far the most important. Nutrition corresponding to the activity is just the icing on the cake. By doing the cardio fasted, you're burning pure body fat. This is great. Whether you eat a banana, or flax/whey afterwards, isn't going to make a huge difference. I always go for the whey and flax personally since you can never get too many healthy fats, and lipolysis is going to continue for about 30 minutes. However, the amount of fat burned as fuel isn''t going to be a HUGE difference in your program is you eat one banana after your cardio session. This isn't make or break. Rather than fret upon what to eat, get in a regular habit of doing it. Once you hit that stage of commitment, then play around and see what works for you.

well first of all, low intensity cardio does not mean below 60% HR. it means between 65% and 75%. so you need to get there, thats where you burn fat.

the 65-75% zone is where you burn the most fat for the time(excluding HIIT), however it costs additional carbs, the slower you go, the greater %'age of fat you burn

Would it be a good idea to "slowly" eat carbs after morning cardio?
Like when I get home have 2 eggs and flax oil. Then 20 minutes later have a bowl of yogurt.. and then about half an hour later have a bowl of cereal?

I was thinking about it and that would most likely not create a spike from just loading up on carbs all at once.

well first of all, low intensity cardio does not mean below 60% HR. it means between 65% and 75%. so you need to get there, thats where you burn fat.

65% - 75% seems like medium intensity to me.... :/

With an elevated metabolism after cardio, surely you continue to burn fat for at least a couple of hours after it? And if so, isn't it optimal to leave out carbs for a while so your body doesn't quickly switch to burning carbs instead? I suppose low GI foods wouldn't affect that so much, but surely having protein / fats instead would be more optimal...